Blondeagadvisor blog:Latest Details of CAP Reform - How to deal with greening etc…

4course · Aug 18, 2014

cover crop/catch crop
how in the world are we to put down cover/catch crops on a form in may15 when in the case of both the above would not be sown until aug15and would be destroyed before jan16 and in the case of a catch crop following barley or wheat heres an idea sow mustard mixed with hss barley of variety just harvested or to be planted and follow with barley sown first few days oct same idea could poss work for early harvested wheat .what have I missed

rob1 · Aug 18, 2014

silverfox said:
So establish a temp grass ley now, graze hard with sheep until Jan, then take hay or silage from 30th June .
Exactly like my HLS arable reversion.
Can be as profitable as cereals.

My thinking exactly and as its horse hay with no fert on and with our normal summers just about ideal timing, have to say that defra/rpa have done their best to make this scheme easier than some of their previous interpretations

Cow1 · Aug 19, 2014

4course said:
cover crop/catch crop
how in the world are we to put down cover/catch crops on a form in may15 when in the case of both the above would not be sown until aug15and would be destroyed before jan16 and in the case of a catch crop following barley or wheat heres an idea sow mustard mixed with hss barley of variety just harvested or to be planted and follow with barley sown first few days oct same idea could poss work for early harvested wheat .what have I missed

Just read through the latest rules and I am confused about catch/cover crops. I normally grow a stubble turnips/kale/fodder rape mix for sheep on arable land then spring crop. When the rules came out I thought what I am doing already helps me greatly with EFA. However my interpretation of the rules now is anything I put in the ground now will not count towards next years claim, which is ridiculous. @blondeagadvisor can you help clear this up?

4course · Aug 19, 2014

Cow1 said:
Just read through the latest rules and I am confused about catch/cover crops. I normally grow a stubble turnips/kale/fodder rape mix for sheep on arable land then spring crop. When the rules came out I thought what I am doing already helps me greatly with EFA. However my interpretation of the rules now is anything I put in the ground now will not count towards next years claim, which is ridiculous. @blondeagadvisor can you help clear this up?

As I read it the catch /cover crop dont need to be sown until aug 15 to count its just how you put that on your declaration so as to be eligilble cos that land parcel could well be in cereals in may surely they dont expect a field to be left bare just so you can grow a catch/cover crop, its what you do after1/1/15 for next year that matters

Hindsight · Aug 19, 2014

4course said:
cover crop/catch crop
how in the world are we to put down cover/catch crops on a form in may15 when in the case of both the above would not be sown until aug15and would be destroyed before jan16 and in the case of a catch crop following barley or wheat heres an idea sow mustard mixed with hss barley of variety just harvested or to be planted and follow with barley sown first few days oct same idea could poss work for early harvested wheat .what have I missed

I like to think you have missed nothing. I just read the English in the guidance note and as far as I can see Defra has / is trying to be as helpful as possible in allowing simple compliance with EFA. As I thought Defra would.

4course said:
As I read it the catch /cover crop dont need to be sown until aug 15 to count its just how you put that on your declaration so as to be eligilble cos that land parcel could well be in cereals in may surely they dont expect a field to be left bare just so you can grow a catch/cover crop, its what you do after1/1/15 for next year that matters

Yep, that is how I read it too. I presume on the application form next May will be a column where we complete the intended EFA option on a field by field basis and thus in case of cover and catch crops established in autumn 2015 it will be a declaration of intent. Possibly with a list of acceptable prior crop uses in 2015. Which will then have to be followed up!! Be patient! Some bright staff at Defra will have thought it through though I suspect main problem will be computerised application form getting to heavy for data. On many an arable farm the catch crop and overwinter cover looks a very suitable easy option to 'make weight' given an establishment date of Aug 31 and early destruction of Oct 1st. EFA looks easier. Maybe not have everyone flooding the pea and bean market.

blondeagadvisor · Aug 19, 2014

4course said:
As I read it the catch /cover crop dont need to be sown until aug 15 to count its just how you put that on your declaration so as to be eligilble cos that land parcel could well be in cereals in may surely they dont expect a field to be left bare just so you can grow a catch/cover crop, its what you do after1/1/15 for next year that matters

If it’s something you usually do then you'll do it next year, which will count to next year’s claim form which will be fine. My concern is that the definition may exclude your sheep grazing mix. It is currently a sown mixture of two different cover types, one cereal and one non cereal. More detail will be published in October which will shed more light on exactly what is and what isn’t allowed...

4course · Aug 19, 2014

blondeagadvisor said:
If it’s something you usually do then you'll do it next year, which will count to next year’s claim form which will be fine. My concern is that the definition may exclude your sheep grazing mix. It is currently a sown mixture of two different cover types, one cereal and one non cereal. More detail will be published in October which will shed more light on exactly what is and what isn’t allowed...

thanks your help much appreciated so just to clarify I could follow autumn sown2014 cereals for harvest in aug 2015with a catch crop of mustard and say barley mix sown prior to 1/9/15 then destoy this on oct 2 2015 and sow with cereals straight away and using the weighting factor could use this catch crop as part or all of our efa recquirement, if so it begs the question how is it to be put on the form or how is it to be checked

blondeagadvisor · Aug 19, 2014

Answer to the first part is yes- 1ha of EFA will require 3.33ha of catch / cover crop. You will need to keep records, seed purchases, work diaries etc. Second part- we don't know what the forms will look like... More details in October...

4course · Aug 19, 2014

blondeagadvisor said:
Answer to the first part is yes- 1ha of EFA will require 3.33ha of catch / cover crop. You will need to keep records, seed purchases, work diaries etc. Second part- we don't know what the forms will look like... More details in October...

in that case im sorted reduction in grass weed, stop others here wanting to sow 2nd wheats too early no change in rotation no different crop to grow/market no loss of crop to sell in fact poss more no need for other machinery or knowhow as we already use mustard as a green manure occassionally ,helps reduce pests, and the benefits to the local wildlife of somewhere to go when all around is bare land no need to bother with extra maps or worry that weve left enough width in any strips and above all simple lets see if in october they havnt altered things meanwhile ill keep enough bare land to count as fallow just in case before sowing this autumn.thanks

blondeagadvisor · Aug 19, 2014

4course said:
in that case im sorted reduction in grass weed, stop others here wanting to sow 2nd wheats too early no change in rotation no different crop to grow/market no loss of crop to sell in fact poss more no need for other machinery or knowhow as we already use mustard as a green manure occassionally ,helps reduce pests, and the benefits to the local wildlife of somewhere to go when all around is bare land no need to bother with extra maps or worry that weve left enough width in any strips and above all simple lets see if in october they havnt altered things meanwhile ill keep enough bare land to count as fallow just in case before sowing this autumn.thanks

Happy to be of help!

robbie · Aug 19, 2014

If I was to sow a half and half mix of cereal and stubble turnips before the end of August 15 then after 1st Oct I let the field out to my mate for his sheep to graze,the sheep would destroy the cover over winter and then I could sow spring barley would this count for EFA or is there a clause that says cover/catch crops can't be grazed even after the end date.
Also will 1 ha of cover crop drilled in August but left until January 15 be worth more EFA than a ha of catch crop drilled August and destroyed on Oct 1st?

4course · Aug 19, 2014

robbie said:
If I was to sow a half and half mix of cereal and stubble turnips before the end of August 15 then after 1st Oct I let the field out to my mate for his sheep to graze,the sheep would destroy the cover over winter and then I could sow spring barley would this count for EFA or is there a clause that says cover/catch crops can't be grazed even after the end date.
Also will 1 ha of cover crop drilled in August but left until January 15 be worth more EFA than a ha of catch crop drilled August and destroyed on Oct 1st?

we dont know but my reading is thats going to be ok so long as you call it a catch crop and not a cover crop ,its all to do with the dates and a catch crop can be destoyed but a cover crop has to remain in place but this october will give us more info and we dont sow catch or cover crops this year its next that matters but like previous posts take proper advice

5020man · Aug 20, 2014

Hi.
I understand the three crop rule.
If I grow four crops would the following %s be OK?
crop 1 60%
2 25%
3 11%
4 4%

rob1 · Aug 20, 2014

5020man said:
Hi.
I understand the three crop rule.
If I grow four crops would the following %s be OK?
crop 1 60%
2 25%
3 11%
4 4%

yes as i understand it two crops max 95% so your fine

Henry B · Aug 20, 2014

If I grow 7% Peas or Beans for EFA does this 7% allso count as my 3rd crop or do I need to grow 5% extra on top of the 7%?

Robigus · Aug 21, 2014

Henry B said:
If I grow 7% Peas or Beans for EFA does this 7% allso count as my 3rd crop or do I need to grow 5% extra on top of the 7%?

It will be your third crop.

billboy 1 · Aug 25, 2014

so a 4m margin 100m long = 4x9x100=3600 divide by 10000= 0.36ha is this correct and can I call It fallow and keep it topped ?

Ramrod · Aug 25, 2014

billboy 1 said:
so a 4m margin 100m long = 4x9x100=3600 divide by 10000= 0.36ha is this correct and can I call It fallow and keep it topped ?

No!
Buffer is 1 linear metre(length) = 9m2 regardless of width so long as it is a min of 1m wide.

Fallow is different entity 1m2 =1m2, unsure of required measurements as yet.

billboy 1 · Aug 25, 2014

ok so if I call my existing buffer strip that is 4m wide and eg 100m long fallow that would be 0.04ha is that right ?

Ramrod · Aug 25, 2014

billboy 1 said:
ok so if I call my existing buffer strip that is 4m wide and eg 100m long fallow that would be 0.04ha is that right ?

Would be better to have first metre (must be next to dry/wet watercourse) buffer = 100m x 9m2 =900m2,

Then maybe remaining 3 m fallow (as said unsure of requirements) =100m x 3m =300m2,

Therefore original 400m2 (0.04Ha) = 1200m2 (0.12Ha) of EFA's.

There must be a lot more information to be revealed yet, suggest you wait until more released, It is looking as though EFA choices won't have to be made until the application
goes in, more than likely May 2015. Then choices established back end of 2015.

This is my understanding at the moment

Blondeagadvisor blog:Latest Details of CAP Reform - How to deal with greening etc…

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

0 %

Up to 25%

25-50%

50-75%

75-100%

100% I’ve had enough of farming!

Share this page