How to become a member of the Society of Ploughmen?

What is the youngest you can be to become a member of the Society of Ploughmen?
Qualification is not related to age, just wisdom or lack of it.
I think it could be 13, as i know a young lad that ploughed at the national when he was 14, and think it was said at the time, that you cannot drive a tractor in a field till your 13, and so let him plough as was over 13, but think he had to have insurance in his name to complete, however I will stand to be corrected,
Many Thanks, I know somebody who is 16 and want's to join up!
 
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Pennine Ploughing

Member
Mixed Farmer
I think it could be 13, as i know a young lad that ploughed at the national when he was 14, and think it was said at the time, that you cannot drive a tractor in a field till your 13, and so let him plough as was over 13, but think he had to have insurance in his name to complete, however I will stand to be corrected,
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire

A few societies round here, Scarcroft included, have allowed youngsters to plough at age 13 or over provided the relevant insurance was in place. Others refused point blank, insurance or not and others roped areas off where youngsters were competing to allow them to plough. What this has to do with the minimum age for joining the SOP, then god only knows.

Not a lot of point in rushing to join the SOP as some of the best young talent ploughing world style over the last few years has been sidelined / maltreated which has led to a parting of the ways. So much for the youth coaching policy which, forgive the expression, over the years has been non existant, whilst the main policy carried on somewhat incestuous at best. Abysmal showing when England - the country that pioneered plough development - is fielding septagenarian and octogenarian ploughmen on the world stage whilst Ireland and Scotland rampage on unchecked.

It's not only technique and capability which is lacking in tuition, but also the engineering skills required to produce world class work.

Thanks for the vote of confidence Nearly. Did not think for one minute that you had either holiday lets or that you had had Diane Abbot convalescing there! :D:D:D
 
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Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
perhaps if the back biting, jealous carping the world style competitors constantly endure were to be toned down, there would be a few more younger competitors about!
Insurance companies do need to work with the law however, the fact that Ellie Bullard was competing in the yfc class( I believe) at the national caused the whole class to roped off!
 
perhaps if the back biting, jealous carping the world style competitors constantly endure were to be toned down, there would be a few more younger competitors about!
Insurance companies do need to work with the law however, the fact that Ellie Bullard was competing in the yfc class( I believe) at the national caused the whole class to roped off!
A few societies round here, Scarcroft included, have allowed youngsters to plough at age 13 or over provided the relevant insurance was in place. Others refused point blank, insurance or not and others roped areas off where youngsters were competing to allow them to plough. What this has to do with the minimum age for joining the SOP, then god only knows.

Not a lot of point in rushing to join the SOP as some of the best young talent ploughing world style over the last few years has been sidelined / maltreated which has led to a parting of the ways. So much for the youth coaching policy which, forgive the expression, over the years has been non existant, whilst the main policy carried on somewhat incestuous at best. Abysmal showing when England - the country that pioneered plough development - is fielding septagenarian and octogenarian ploughmen on the world stage whilst Ireland and Scotland rampage on unchecked.

It's not only technique and capability which is lacking in tuition, but also the engineering skills required to produce world class work.

Thanks for the vote of confidence Nearly. Did not think for one minute that you had either holiday lets or that you had had Diane Abbot convalescing there! :D:D:D
Why would any youngster want to join all they want is your money you won't have a look in on the ploughing field in world style with some of the judging and to get kit around these days is not cost effective. The ploughing school is to far away from most people down in Cornwall so why waste your money.
 

Pennine Ploughing

Member
Mixed Farmer
Why would any youngster want to join all they want is your money you won't have a look in on the ploughing field in world style with some of the judging and to get kit around these days is not cost effective. The ploughing school is to far away from most people down in Cornwall so why waste your money.
don't think the original post said anything about World style, they may want to plough vintage or classic,
and no doubt you would not encourage anyone to join SOP, as you are one of the 5 that was voted off, is that not right ?
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
On the face of it, ploughmen do seem to get very little for their subscription, when in fact they get quite a lot, the classes other than world style do very well.They get qualifying events arranged in their areas( Run by local societies, but organised and policed by the SOP.) World style have to be nominated by an affiliated society, a system in which face fitting can be very important! Matches get judged by judges who have been instructed at SOP courses, the Sop cannot force these men to abide by their instruction, so there are some who do a course, then go back to their old ways.Ways of preventing this are being investigated. All ploughmen get a national match organised in which they can take part, and if successful, move onto the world or European stages.
The ploughing school is , in my view a failure, you are quite correct in the fact that its at the end of the world, and you forgot to mention the poor sticky(from photographs) land. There is much more to learnt at a judges seminar.
Ploughing rules have been standardised to a large extent, to the SOP requirement, so those who like to travel, dont get caught out by local ideas!
Costs are a problem, but while your golf clubs or cricket whites are cheap to move, the club subscription may be considerably more that that of the SOP.
There are improvements that could be made, its true. A qualifying scheme for new judges needs to be implemented, similar to the "P" plates on new drivers cars. That would weed out those who only use the seminars as a route to inflict their own ideas on competitors! A ploughing school could be added to the national match, though man power may not allow this.
The SOP is not perfect, but its all we have. I can remember how things were in the vintage classes before the SOP admitted them. We had to beg local matches to give us a class for example.
 
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ploughman61

Member
Mixed Farmer
Why would any youngster want to join all they want is your money you won't have a look in on the ploughing field in world style with some of the judging and to get kit around these days is not cost effective. The ploughing school is to far away from most people down in Cornwall so why waste your money.
At Uttoxeter agricultural society we run a training day for all Comer's first timers through to experienced ploughmen who want to have a run out before the season starts. Hopefully will take part on last Saturday in August, not recognized officially by sop but have got it advertised on sop website in past. Had many top ploughmen come and help including Ashley Boyles Colin Bowen David chapel Tom Titterton & John Kitchen, to mention a few. All are welcome to come and help or plough, normally about 20 ploughmen attend this event, will post time and place when everything has been conformed.
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
On the face of it, ploughmen do seem to get very little for their subscription, when in fact they get quite a lot, the classes other than world style do very well.They get qualifying events arranged in their areas( Run by local societies, but organised and policed by the SOP.) World style have to be nominated by an affiliated society, a system in which face fitting can be very important! Matches get judged by judges who have been instructed at SOP courses, the Sop cannot force these men to abide by their instruction, so there are some who do a course, then go back to their old ways.Ways of preventing this are being investigated. All ploughmen get a national match organised in which they can take part, and if successful, move onto the world or European stages.
The ploughing school is , in my view a failure, you are quite correct in the fact that its at the end of the world, and you forgot to mention the poor sticky(from photographs) land. There is much more to learnt at a judges seminar.
Ploughing rules have been standardised to a large extent, to the SOP requirement, so those who like to travel, dont get caught out by local ideas!
Costs are a problem, but while your golf clubs or cricket whites are cheap to move, the club subscription may be considerably more that that of the SOP.
There are improvements that could be made, its true. A qualifying scheme for new judges needs to be implemented, similar to the "P" plates on new drivers cars. That would weed out those who only use the seminars as a route to inflict their own ideas on competitors! A ploughing school could be added to the national match, though man power may not allow this.
The SOP is not perfect, but its all we have. I can remember how things were in the vintage classes before the SOP admitted them. We had to beg local matches to give us a class for example.

Come on Harry get real. Most of the successful ploughmen ploughing world style invent a society, pay an affiliation fee and go to the national as a matter of course. I have at least three options which I could use, societies which have been amalgamated to mine over the years. World style should qualify as does everybody else apart from high cut.

Come on again Harry - the ploughing school is a joke and doubtless charges the scholars. It is hardly freely available to all when all but a few know of its existence. The SOP should be taken to task for not cultivating young talent and what's more they should be the ones taken further to task for not paying the full expenses for the two competitors who attend the world match.

You are right. The SOP is not perfect nor will it ever be in the hands of the current incumbents complete with proxy votes purloined and administered by themselves in their very own Dianne Abbot school of hard sums way. I wish a pound for every member who has told me that over the last two years, but until there is an alternative they apparently have no option other than to be members.

Just in passing. Last week an Executive Director told me (at Les Walkers sale) that he felt very very sorry for Alan Jones because he was told exactly what to say by the now departed incumbent - which is exactly what caused all the controversy and problems in the first instance.
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
Evening David,
Inventing a society was indeed a common happening when the class had high numbers of entrants, these days there is no need, many matches are won by the same people, and they cant represent more than one society. This leaves room for the nomination routine, and some one who has disagreed with a judge or committee can find it hard to get the nomination, over quite a wide area.
In a way, world style used to run a qualifying routine in that you had to win the class in the nominating societies match, that cant happen now, for the reasons already stated above. You could try to run qualifiers for World style, but if you only took the winners, you would not have enough to fill the plough off plots!
Whats wrong with my description of the ploughing school? If you have another read, you will see that I termed it a failure, and held in a bad area, on poor land.
I agree that the SOP could do more, though financial assistance may have been difficult before.The improvements I would like to see would entail some form a disciplinary system whereby societies have to use SOP trained judges.There is a match in the south of England where the judging has been so bad, that everyone believes the result to be a foregone conclusion! Having walked the plots, and watched the judges antics, I dont think this is the case, but the use of sop trained judges could have prevented this bad feeling.
 
don't think the original post said anything about World style, they may want to plough vintage or classic,
and no doubt you would not encourage anyone to join SOP, as you are one of the 5 that was voted off, is that not right ?
At least being one of the 5 we had the GUTS to speak out for what is right when the majority of directors don.t even speak at the meeting for being afraid they will be out of favour with the powers that be.
 

Pennine Ploughing

Member
Mixed Farmer
At least being one of the 5 we had the GUTS to speak out for what is right when the majority of directors don.t even speak at the meeting for being afraid they will be out of favour with the powers that be.
don't think the speaking out and saying what you think or believe in was the problem, and while I think and lead to believe the 5 did many things good for the SOP, the problem was the legal action the 5 took,
I am not saying you were right or wrong, but anyone taking legal action against an individual or a group, will leave a bitter taste in the mouths of the accused,
and if you have the guts to stand up, why hide behind a made up name on here
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
don't think the speaking out and saying what you think or believe in was the problem, and while I think and lead to believe the 5 did many things good for the SOP, the problem was the legal action the 5 took,
I am not saying you were right or wrong, but anyone taking legal action against an individual or a group, will leave a bitter taste in the mouths of the accused,
and if you have the guts to stand up, why hide behind a made up name on here

Just to clarify John.
During the course of the whole debacle, I was taken to task by the administrator on here for trying to expose people who were trying to expose me. Apparently that is not the ethos on here.
As far as taking legal action is concerned then in real terms the 5 Directors actually took legal advice which is significantly different to legal action.
The fact of the matter is that the incumbents at the time led their side of the campaign corruptly from start to finish and were found wanting on several counts. They are the ones who took legal action to rectify their corrupt and contrived handling of the issue.
We cannot escape the reality that the 5 Directors never ever intended to take over the SOP. All they ever wanted was to stop the current executive running things in the corrupt way that it has been run for years - at least 40 years according to Tom Charlton, the longest surviving ploughman at the Nationals.
I know of only three ploughmen man enough to stand up for their belief in fair play.
I know of dozens of others, somewhat lacking the courage of their convictions to stand up and be counted for fear of retribution.
 
don't think the speaking out and saying what you think or believe in was the problem, and while I think and lead to believe the 5 did many things good for the SOP, the problem was the legal action the 5 took,
I am not saying you were right or wrong, but anyone taking legal action against an individual or a group, will leave a bitter taste in the mouths of the accused,
and if you have the guts to stand up, why hide behind a made up name on here
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
don't think the speaking out and saying what you think or believe in was the problem, and while I think and lead to believe the 5 did many things good for the SOP, the problem was the legal action the 5 took,
I am not saying you were right or wrong, but anyone taking legal action against an individual or a group, will leave a bitter taste in the mouths of the accused,
and if you have the guts to stand up, why hide behind a made up name on here
One other thing John. If, as the five believe, this unpleasantness had been in place for years, why wait until the society was committed to a large financial undertaking before making their complaint, and then doing their best to weaken the societies finances with legal activities? Why is one of them widely believed to have threatened to use every penny he had to leave a wasteland? And another to request his wide circle of contacts to withdraw their support for the world match funding. It is my belief that by timing their attack as they did, that it was an attack on every member of the society, in that it stood the chance of making the society unable to meet its commitments re the world match and therefore leaving the members to the possibility of being chased for any shortfall, and also depriving the members of the chance to witness a world match close to home.
If they had agreed to suspend their action until after the world match, I believe they would have improved their position no end.
 

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