Proving a need for farm worker to live on site

Cazza

New Member
just had feedback from our local planning auth who have said that we would need to demonstrate a real need to have a farm worker to live on site for us to even be considered to put a small farm cottage on our land.
We have 20 acres and keep pedigree lincoln red cattle, breed friesian horses and want to move into rare breed pork.
Has anyone ever managed to prove the requirements and if so how did you manage it?

Cheers
 

Dry Rot

Member
Livestock Farmer
I think you would need to be able to produce some convincing accounts/projections showing why you need a farm worker on site for 20 acres.

No personal experience but I have been doing some research for a related problem. One thing that comes across is that hobby farming doesn't seem to convince the planners that you are seriously farming. You need to show that it is viable in the long run. Can anyone do that these days?:(
 
just had feedback from our local planning auth who have said that we would need to demonstrate a real need to have a farm worker to live on site for us to even be considered to put a small farm cottage on our land.
We have 20 acres and keep pedigree lincoln red cattle, breed friesian horses and want to move into rare breed pork.
Has anyone ever managed to prove the requirements and if so how did you manage it?

Cheers
Am I of the assumption that you already live on the 20ac and are looking for another dwelling for a farm worker or do you have 20ac and are looking to build on it to live yourself as the farm workers?

Either way, 20ac is a small area for the council to consider you needing a key on-site farm worker; only a solid business plan and a set of roles and responsibilities of everyone on the farm plus the prospective tenant. If you are already living there on the 20ac then they would probably say you could manage that size yourself; if your argument is that you aren't doing the work then in the council's eyes there is no reason why the key worker could not live in your house and you live elsewhere.

Getting a new dwelling in the countryside is a nightmare, national and local policies resist except in very special circumstances.
 

Cazza

New Member
We are currently living 20 miles away from the land and having to travel to care for the livestock ( keep horses on livery at present due to security issues) so we are looking for it for myself and my husband where I work full time with the animals as already have 10+ hour days and husband helps on 4 days a week or when I need an extra pair of hands.
We have got to supply a business plan with projected forecasts etc but the need to live on site is separate to that.
We stated for the welfare of the livestock but they wanted more. I wasn’t sure if anyone had been through this process recently to help me get the information I needed before I go back to my architect... cheaper if I do the legwork
 
We are currently living 20 miles away from the land and having to travel to care for the livestock ( keep horses on livery at present due to security issues) so we are looking for it for myself and my husband where I work full time with the animals as already have 10+ hour days and husband helps on 4 days a week or when I need an extra pair of hands.
We have got to supply a business plan with projected forecasts etc but the need to live on site is separate to that.
We stated for the welfare of the livestock but they wanted more. I wasn’t sure if anyone had been through this process recently to help me get the information I needed before I go back to my architect... cheaper if I do the legwork
Normally at this point I would be doubting the architects ability to provide a convincing enough application and to use a Planning Consultant like me! Lol!
But on this occasion I am going to not blow my own trumpet but to suggest seeking help from a specialist rural planning advisor.
In Kent and the South East the council's don't have the knowledge within the Planning Department to make informed decisions over agricultural applications so they seek the advice of an external consultant, in many cases a chap called Richard Lloyd-Hughes (he was consulted, and supported @Steviemoomoo 's recent application). If he doesn't consult for your local authority he may be in a position to assist you. If you want his contact details then drop me a PM.
 
Last edited:

Nikki

New Member
We are currently living 20 miles away from the land and having to travel to care for the livestock ( keep horses on livery at present due to security issues) so we are looking for it for myself and my husband where I work full time with the animals as already have 10+ hour days and husband helps on 4 days a week or when I need an extra pair of hands.
We have got to supply a business plan with projected forecasts etc but the need to live on site is separate to that.
We stated for the welfare of the livestock but they wanted more. I wasn’t sure if anyone had been through this process recently to help me get the information I needed before I go back to my architect... cheaper if I do the legwork
I think you need a stallion on site and breeding records to have a 'bothy'
 

S J H

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Bedfordshire
I've just got 1 on 20 acres without financial evidence, because I've been trading in another company for the past 11 years so it was very difficult to show.

I've been fencing at a local place where the chap got an ag dwelling about a year before mine. I went to the planning committee meeting to see what was said. It was passed and the 'farm' has already been sold, and 1 of the buildings dismantled. (n)

IMO they should be using more agricultural advisors to sort through the applications.
 

Forever Fendt

Member
Location
Derbyshire
just had feedback from our local planning auth who have said that we would need to demonstrate a real need to have a farm worker to live on site for us to even be considered to put a small farm cottage on our land.
We have 20 acres and keep pedigree lincoln red cattle, breed friesian horses and want to move into rare breed pork.
Has anyone ever managed to prove the requirements and if so how did you manage it?

Cheers
i don't think the horses will count but could be wrong, you need to prove the man hours and essential on site presence on animal welfare grounds, getting some pedigree sheep that will breed out of season would help as you could have a very protracted lambing and a need to be on site and then a few carvings for high value cows would help,you will also need to be putting up some buildings
 

Greenbeast

Member
Location
East Sussex
I've just got 1 on 20 acres without financial evidence, because I've been trading in another company for the past 11 years so it was very difficult to show.

I've been fencing at a local place where the chap got an ag dwelling about a year before mine. I went to the planning committee meeting to see what was said. It was passed and the 'farm' has already been sold, and 1 of the buildings dismantled. (n)

IMO they should be using more agricultural advisors to sort through the applications.

ludicrous! this is exactly why it's hard for people like us who are genuine :mad::mad:
 

Forever Fendt

Member
Location
Derbyshire
On that acreage and with those enterprises pretty tricky I would think but talk to the experts - Acorus are pretty good but no one who knows what they are doing will be cheap.
http://www.acorus.co.uk/countryside-planning-permission-rural-dwellings

http://www.acorus.co.uk/userfiles/file/(19)_Rural Dwellings_(1).pdf
When the new permitted development legislation came out a local person used Acorus and made a application with them so i thought these would be the people to do mine, However i got in touch with them and was directed to one of there advisors who said it was a bad idea and it had no chance at all for a building that complied fully with the legislation.The one they did was in my opinion a very poor application that was rejected but went through the second time with a private planning consultant,I also got mine passed with out to much trouble. my advice would be study the planning legislation and look at plenty of previous failed and successful applications and form an opinion from this point,Perhaps i spoke to the guy on a bad day but he was very negative about it with no justification for dismissing the idea
 

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