Aphid predators

britt

Member
BASE UK Member
I have had a recommendation to spray aphids in wheat to prevent BYDV, as I expect many of you have.
I avoid insecticides for all of the usual reasons, but it seems this one is needed.
So what aphid predators are there about at this time of year that may be harmed ?
I don't think there are many ladybirds about, never mind there larvae.
Is an insecticide at this time of year as benign as it can be ?
 

shakerator

Member
Location
LINCS
I have had a recommendation to spray aphids in wheat to prevent BYDV, as I expect many of you have.
I avoid insecticides for all of the usual reasons, but it seems this one is needed.
So what aphid predators are there about at this time of year that may be harmed ?
I don't think there are many ladybirds about, never mind there larvae.
Is an insecticide at this time of year as benign as it can be ?

Ants/flies

i wouldnt omit it judging on aphids seen here!
 

shakerator

Member
Location
LINCS
I thought that ants "farm" aphids for the honeydew, so are more likely to protect than predate them.

Indeed but they also subdue colonies and stop them flying and in effect limiting secondary spread of BYDV as they need them close by......

Nothing seems black and white in this game ....:confused:
 

rob1

Member
Location
wiltshire
I have had a recommendation to spray aphids in wheat to prevent BYDV, as I expect many of you have.
I avoid insecticides for all of the usual reasons, but it seems this one is needed.
So what aphid predators are there about at this time of year that may be harmed ?
I don't think there are many ladybirds about, never mind there larvae.
Is an insecticide at this time of year as benign as it can be ?
did you use deter dressing ? Not used an insecticide for many years and have lots of grass around for green bridges but no issues (so far)
 

britt

Member
BASE UK Member
No Deter. Most seed is cleaned only.
Most years there is very little threat from DYDV in Oct sown wheat. But this year has been exceptionally mild and aphids can be found in crops.
I haven't sprayed for them or had a problem with BYDV for years.
This is threshold lead, rather than "just in case". (But I'd still rather not taking the longer term view).
 
If we get any amount of cold weather average temperature below 4.8 c the aphid will not multiply
They will also go down the plant and be harder to kill with inscecticide
The aphid predictors will run into hundreds of species spiders and parasitic wasps etc
They will reduce the aphids to a very low level this combined with the weather will eliminate the problem especially if you have not used inscectide for a few years

In the 1990s i often found aphids in December but found very little bydv in unspraued fields so have not sprayed in the autumn since then rape or wheat

In the 1980s when bydv was a big problem it was in wheat that had emerged in mid September

If I farmed where temperature was higher west of the m1 then I waoild use seed dressing that would cover to the end of November
The worst case were always where ploughing grass or wheat and emediate drilling followed with emergence of the wheat or barley before the volunteers had died

With notill drilling wheat on the green the brassica aphids do not pose a threat and the beneficials are more numerous

Nowadays the areas of spring land round here are a sink for cereal aphids and also help to build up beneficials compared to burnt of stubble with bare fields so the aphid moved onto the newly emerging wheat
 
No Deter. Most seed is cleaned only.
Most years there is very little threat from DYDV in Oct sown wheat. But this year has been exceptionally mild and aphids can be found in crops.
I haven't sprayed for them or had a problem with BYDV for years.
This is threshold lead, rather than "just in case". (But I'd still rather not taking the longer term view).

Wait till the spring march and if aphids build up more consider spraying
the aphids on the crop now will stay put and have infected the plant they are on if we get cold enough weather they will die or the beneficials will get them killing aphid now will only be revenge killing
They need enough day degrees to multiply temperature to average more than 4.8 c to accumulate day degrees

If you look at fields on a sunny day the amount of spiders is staggering when a field is unsprayed
 

SimonD

Member
Location
Dorset
Wait till the spring march and if aphids build up more consider spraying
the aphids on the crop now will stay put and have infected the plant they are on if we get cold enough weather they will die or the beneficials will get them killing aphid now will only be revenge killing
They need enough day degrees to multiply temperature to average more than 4.8 c to accumulate day degrees

If you look at fields on a sunny day the amount of spiders is staggering when a field is unsprayed

Your last sentence is why I’m hesitant to spray. If you don’t start building now then when is the best time to help the beneficials (genuine question)?
 
Your last sentence is why I’m hesitant to spray. If you don’t start building now then when is the best time to help the beneficials (genuine question)?
in your area be carefull bydv is a much bigger problem than it is here especially if you are near the coast
you have much warmer weather than us

when I worked in dorset in 1982 bydv was a new problem one field was ploughed out of grass and planted to wheat the headland had no bydv and yielded double the middle the apids had climbed from the grass to the wheat

we had snow the first week I worked there in januarry the first snow for year
in Lincolnshire we usually had snow in most years although in rescent year we have had only 1 day with snow
the norm 40 years ago was snow cover for a month
 

SimonD

Member
Location
Dorset
in your area be carefull bydv is a much bigger problem than it is here especially if you are near the coast
you have much warmer weather than us

when I worked in dorset in 1982 bydv was a new problem one field was ploughed out of grass and planted to wheat the headland had no bydv and yielded double the middle the apids had climbed from the grass to the wheat

we had snow the first week I worked there in januarry the first snow for year
in Lincolnshire we usually had snow in most years although in rescent year we have had only 1 day with snow
the norm 40 years ago was snow cover for a month

Good response. Caught in the loop of killing off beneficials which isn’t ideal when trying to build, will discuss with the agronomist to see what level of risk we are at. If we don’t need to apply then I won’t.
 
Last edited:

stroller

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Somerset UK
IMG_2288.JPG Took this picture today, the shiny stuff on the wheat is spider webs, the whole field is covered. This was deter dressed and didn't have any insecticide, all bought seed this year usually fss and no dressing but at least one insecticide. Was the same last year with spider webs so perhaps they have become immune along with the aphids!
 
Or Deter has no effect on those non target species :whistle:
that is most likely because the amount of chemical on the seed is just enough do do the intended job of killing any thing that attempts to eat the growing crop

the spiders do not live on the wheat where as the aphid suck the sap of the wheat and live on it 24 7

there would be no inscects if the seed dressing was highly toxic
 

stroller

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Somerset UK
Or Deter has no effect on those non target species :whistle:
All dd for 4 years now and fss last year apart from 1 field, so it had 1 insecticide but was still covered with spiders, have just looked at the spray sheets and I used mavrik, which is supposed to be better for the beneficials.
 

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