Prepare yourselves for

Danllan

Member
Location
Sir Gar / Carms
Gosh, I’m impressed with your knowledge of Eire. (y)
Now as to us being a region in Europe. Economically you are correct. The globe is now a minuscule place in terms of time and distance. We quite frankly have little other choice other than to be a very small part of a much larger economic entity. It doesn’t bother us. Need to keep food in mouths of babes as they say.
Even the mighty Britain’s place in the world has changed from one of total economic and military dominance to one of economic and military partnership with old adversaries and colonies! And yes, I know that might well be hard to accept, but it’s a reality. Of course the Tory party or a large part thereof have yet to come to terms with that reality. Their denial and blatant daily incompetence in the exit process now started, threatens to seriously damage Britain.

I've enough family and friends in the Republic to have a fair bit of ken to history and so forth, and a mild interest in the politics and history, but an outsider can never really fully understand a foreign country and would be a fool to think he could.

To quote the great Palmerston '...We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow...' Our interest is now toward self determination, once again, so we shall follow it. I disagree with your prognosis but, even if it were true, why should we be any less able than the Irish to recover from incompetent politicians? We'll be fine.

I'm no apologist for the Empire, nothing lasts forever, everything changes, but I don't see us as needing to be a vassal state within the EU, and can not tolerate being so at the expense of our democracy. Fortunately a majority of my country men agreed in the referendum. Most people I know who voted to remain do not think we are being unreasonable in the current 'talks'.

Again, I think we'll be fine, and I think you in Ireland will be likely to follow sooner or later. But, if I am wrong and @czechmate is right, you will have us back with our tale between our legs and over a barrel. You have told us before that you would be glad for us to do well, so it would seem that you are in the fortunate position of being in a 'win, win' situation: if we fail and slink back to the EU, your power-block will have us on its own terms and our money forever; and yet, if we succeed, you will applaud us, cheer us on, enjoy and, no doubt, share in our prosperity.

@RagnarHairybreeks you write of the UK as it is, I have written of what we needs must become, don't fall for Remoaner doom and gloom stories, that seek to underestimate / undersell this country. Explain to me what is inherent in us, as a people, that means we can't once again make our own laws, lead the world in innovation and set ourselves up as a preeminent international trader. We did it all before, we effectively invented it all; what's wrong with us now? Have some faith in your own people.
 

czechmate

Member
Mixed Farmer
I find your faith in the EU and the EC remarkable and rather, regarding the EC in particular, rather suspect, I assume you wear a blindfold.



Revealing your true colours again? Oops. I have made no mention of other countries recently and wouldn't expect any to sign up for an agreement against their own interests, nor will we; mutually beneficial agreements are what it is all about. Remember that word, mutually, as Ireland ceases to be anything but a 'region' within the EU. No, hadn't mention other countries, but note that you haven't mentioned South Korea, Canada, Australia etc. all failing miserably and dying a long, lingering economic death in the real world market. Not.

Carp, whine, snipe and so on, it is amusing although a little sad. You do write as someone afraid, you needn't be, as I wrote earlier, we will still trade with Ireland on good terms. We'll probably still be your best friend when your people want their democracy back; friendly old John Bull helping Kathleen ni Houlihan back on to her own two feet again. :)


Did you like the paper I sent you that one with?:D
 
Possibly, but I think it far more likely that it will make them. One of the things we learn as adults, even politicians, is that 'we are where we are'. This being so, once Brexit is done and dusted the one major division in the Parliamentary Conservative Party will have gone and, anyway, due to general attrition and constituency selections, the following election will see a majority of prospective parliamentary candidates who are / were pro-Brexit.

Of course all parties always have had and always will have internal divisions, but these will be minimal compared to Europe. From 2019 the Conservatives will be more united than at any time since World War II; a united party that isn't headed by JC or his like will win elections.
I myself have followed politics since 2000' it's dirty and unpredictable business to say the least
 

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Somerset
I would think it highly unlikely we will both be writing on this forum in circa 8 years time but if we are it will be interesting to reflect upon that; imo uk will be crumbling :(
There is a fare bit of erosion along the South coast but I don't think structural stability of the UK as a whole is at risk
How are things over there
 

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
Prepare yourselves for.... absolutely anything.

In the next 5 years, politically, anything is possible.
I don't think that a Corbyn government would be a problem other than it would be considerably more divided than the present one, before or after Brexit.

What we should be all preparing for is a no deal.

Paradoxically, I think the best chance of getting a deal is to walk away now. Being held to ransom on starting discussions about future trade is simply not going to leave time for a deal.
If we put the ball in their court and said we are planning for no deal but if you come up with something favourable, we will vote on it and give you the X billion you want, they might just be more forthcoming.
As it is, there is just an argument about a 'meaningful vote'. What actual options could there possibly be to vote on?

Is not leaving possible?
Is renegotiating the deal possible?
In all likelihood, it could only be deal, or no deal.

The only argument for not preparing to leave with no deal now, is political, not logical.
 

Billhook

Member
To be fair Danllan " South Korea, Canada, Australia etc. all failing miserably and dying a long, lingering economic death in the real world market. Not."
Isn't really a fair comparison.

South Korea has a huge, high tech manufacturing base (we steadily destroyed or exported most of ours over the last three decades. Catapult schemes and things like the MTC are starting to push us back in the right direction, but very little, very late in the Global scheme of things.)
Canada and Australia. Both massive countries with huge natural wealth.

Britain is, I'm afraid, a small island with an ageing population, relatively little industry, dwindling natural resources and a huge social burden. Not really comparing eggs with eggs.


You might just like to peruse this list of the top economies of the World where you will find the UK is fifth with a GDP the same as Russia and South Korea combined.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)
 
Success and GDP are not inextricably linked. For example 10% directly of our income is from the City of London (under threat) and another big chunk is North Sea oil (running out).

We've got very little in the way of natural resources, manufacturing is at an almost all time low (and most of what is left is owned by overseas companies, usually with huge tax breaks as it puts employment in place in areas that need it). Farming can't apparently survive without subsidies and we import a hell of a lot more than we export. Where is the wealth creation?

Not trying to cast a huge downer on all this, just really can't understand where all the optimism is coming from.
 

Ashtree

Member
Success and GDP are not inextricably linked. For example 10% directly of our income is from the City of London (under threat) and another big chunk is North Sea oil (running out).

We've got very little in the way of natural resources, manufacturing is at an almost all time low (and most of what is left is owned by overseas companies, usually with huge tax breaks as it puts employment in place in areas that need it). Farming can't apparently survive without subsidies and we import a hell of a lot more than we export. Where is the wealth creation?

Not trying to cast a huge downer on all this, just really can't understand where all the optimism is coming from.

Boris Johnson says UK can have a trade deal with Pakistan. #outnow

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/736776/Boris-Johnson-Pakistan-ties-silk-road-trade
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 79 42.0%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 66 35.1%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 16.0%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,292
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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