Farming without subsidies

stewart

Member
Horticulture
Location
Bay of Plenty NZ
I have had this conversation with you before,so dont want to go over old ground.The Dairies of the day were completely abusing their position,in much the same way as the supermarkets are doing today.
Have we had this conversation before? even if we have what is the harm in re visiting it?
Were the dairies of the day abusing their position or were farmers of the day incapable of making decisions on their future?
I tend to go off facts and steer away from emotion and rhetoric, the facts are that the MMB was very poorly run, very inefficient and the main fact is the price increased substantially once they were disbanded, it is a great pity that post vesting day the same old fish heads that could not run the MMB effectively took over to run Milk Marque, a great opportunity was lost.
 
I don't care if there is any argument for an MMB or not, or if it was an effective organisation or not. I do not see the need for any kind of government enforced price fixing mechanism or quango to regulate the price of bloody milk. It is a completely ridiculous idea. You might as well have a marketing board that sets the retail price of bedside lights. It's mental, not needed.
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
1933 was almost 90 years ago, who knows what the government of the day were thinking, maybe they set up the MMB because farmers of the day were inept and incapable of organising themselves.
I do know that once the MMB was disbanded the efficiencies of milk collection and my milk price increased overnight, within less than 24 hours.
It didnt last long though.
Wiseman offered a penny extra to break the board, and with the help of two or three charlatans they succeeded.
4 yrs later the price was fecked
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
I don't care if there is any argument for an MMB or not, or if it was an effective organisation or not. I do not see the need for any kind of government enforced price fixing mechanism or quango to regulate the price of bloody milk. It is a completely ridiculous idea. You might as well have a marketing board that sets the retail price of bedside lights. It's mental, not needed.
Bedside lights are a non essential item., which can be stockpiled
Milk is not, thats a stupid comparison.
The milk board and the corresponding improvements in its health status played a major part in improving the health of the nation, banishing rickets to the history books.
 
Bedside lights are a non essential item., which can be stockpiled
Milk is not, thats a stupid comparison.
The milk board and the corresponding improvements in its health status played a major part in improving the health of the nation, banishing rickets to the history books.

Come off it. You are dangerously passing down the road of trying to make out milk is some kind of item of national importance. I am afraid to say that many people would quite readily prove it is not.
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
Come off it. You are dangerously passing down the road of trying to make out milk is some kind of item of national importance. I am afraid to say that many people would quite readily prove it is not.
You obviously know nothing about the subject.
Tb was rife in the 30,s, and milk was one of the methods of spread
The mmb paid a premium for tb free milk which helped eradicate the disease.
 

Cowcorn

Member
Mixed Farmer
It didnt last long though.
Wiseman offered a penny extra to break the board, and with the help of two or three charlatans they succeeded.
4 yrs later the price was fecked
Divide and conquer, the oldest trick in the book, wiseman northern milk etc took a lot more than a penny back of their suppliers once the had milk marque on the ropes. And the chance to create a large farmer owned co op was lost .
 
I don't care if there is any argument for an MMB or not, or if it was an effective organisation or not. I do not see the need for any kind of government enforced price fixing mechanism or quango to regulate the price of bloody milk. It is a completely ridiculous idea. You might as well have a marketing board that sets the retail price of bedside lights. It's mental, not needed.
Say that in Canada......:facepalm:
 
You obviously know nothing about the subject.
Tb was rife in the 30,s, and milk was one of the methods of spread
The mmb paid a premium for tb free milk which helped eradicate the disease.
Think there be quite a few people who don't realise how hard life was in the 1930's, 40's and even 50's and 60's , fair to say that the current youth don't know how easy they have it or be it too much time and money.
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
Think there be quite a few people who don't realise how hard life was in the 1930's, 40's and even 50's and 60's , fair to say that the current youth don't know how easy they have it or be it too much time and money.
Thatchers generation have never been taught anything but the free market and dont understand the great good that was done by other methods. Some of which still lives on, eg AHA tenancies
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
Saw that yesterday too. So they do get subs in the USA after all.....
Some do.
The bulk of it appears to go to a select few - namely the biggest growers of corn rice soybeans etc

:scratchhead:

But the majority get nothing, as far as my understanding goes, it's more of a conduit to get even more money into the big corporations :censored:

Sorry if it sounds like a conspiracy theory, but that's my impression of their subsidy "system" .
That was the opinion I got from reading threads on here over the last 4 years.
They only get crop insurance, blah, blah, blah........
It's actually more of a corrupt and corrupting system than the CAP.... believe it or not!
 

stewart

Member
Horticulture
Location
Bay of Plenty NZ
Divide and conquer, the oldest trick in the book, wiseman northern milk etc took a lot more than a penny back of their suppliers once the had milk marque on the ropes. And the chance to create a large farmer owned co op was lost .
The chance to create a farmer owned co op is never lost, it is still there, all it takes is farmers to get together and create the co op.
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
The chance to create a farmer owned co op is never lost, it is still there, all it takes is farmers to get together and create the co op.
And the necessity to do so.

Hence why most countries pay a little bit of money out, to ensure this isn't necessary enough to be accomplished - as they would suddenly lose their monopoly and control of the producers, keep them working against each other and producing more than they need to... in survival mode instead of thriving.

"Divide and Conquer".
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
Some do.
The bulk of it appears to go to a select few - namely the biggest growers of corn rice soybeans etc

:scratchhead:

But the majority get nothing, as far as my understanding goes, it's more of a conduit to get even more money into the big corporations :censored:

Sorry if it sounds like a conspiracy theory, but that's my impression of their subsidy "system" .

It's actually more of a corrupt and corrupting system than the CAP.... believe it or not!
The bulk of the sub goes to landowners, not farmers.
Same as the uk
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
The bulk of the sub goes to landowners, not farmers.
Same as the uk
Much of it even bypasses them, if you believe all that you read - one of the best "diversifications" is to recruit a senator onto your board of directors!
It appears quite a "bent" way of doing it, but ultimately has the effect of keeping the poor in their place and enhancing the position of the well-off.

I guess it's a classic example of every action having an opposite reaction .
 
Come off it. You are dangerously passing down the road of trying to make out milk is some kind of item of national importance. I am afraid to say that many people would quite readily prove it is not.
I and many others brought up after the last war would have had free school milk. I can only assume that milk was thought of as 'national importance' The MMB was the saving of so many small farms raising standards of herd health, hygiene and a milk cheque every month. The 'man in the bowler hat' gave farmers a chance to improve their stock by having access to quality proven bulls. Do not dismiss so readily things you have no experience of.
 

Y Fan Wen

Member
Location
N W Snowdonia
Come off it. You are dangerously passing down the road of trying to make out milk is some kind of item of national importance. I am afraid to say that many people would quite readily prove it is not.
Milk 'was' of national importance up to the 70s, the national diet and pay was so poor. Today, obesity is the problem.
Have a read of 'The Far Country' by Nevil Shute to see the state of the country in 1952.
 
Tags
maize

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 81 42.2%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 68 35.4%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 15.6%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.6%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,294
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top