The economics of autosteer
- Thread starter Clive
- Start date
Stoxs
Member
- Location
- Andover , Hampshire
not a chance of liking it now because its rubbish!!!!!!
waste of money, dosnt work at all and even numpties can use it!
Right lets sort this lot out cus I'm back from the pub now! John those rows are wider than 100cm- I mean 100mm for a start,hickup, count the rows!
Anyway I thought 125mm was the closest anybody drilled now days! The older drills were on wider spacings for a start, 7 inches 175mm! As far as auto steer goes, 90% of farmers set their markers slightly too close or drive too close cus the drilling looks better so to hide a lapse in concentration, I am guilty too! BUT driving slightly wider is far more efficient because when spraying nobody keeps the booms 500mm or 50 cm above the crop all the time, its probably 60 or 70cm or more especially when travelling 12 to 20km! So if you drive slightly wider and even wider than auto steer the whole crop would be sufficiently covered by the chemical used, infact you could even save more than using auto steer that drives spot on! And I dont want to hear about auto boom height crap because that is a load of tosh, a boom is a solid straight line of around 24m + nowadays, fields are not, unless in Aus in a 1000 acre laser levelled paddock and dont forget the slight spray drift! Hope this sorts the arguement finally? 
- Location
- East Riding of Yorkshire
yorkie
Member
- Location
- pe34 norfolk,but not born there
started drilling for a contractor when i was 17 40acres a day with a 674 and 13 row bamlet drill,being doing it sinse moved over 300miles to one job becuse they couldn't get anyone local to drill suger beet on hills if i couldn't do it lost job was in black and white kept job still drill beet with out gps it does make life easyer,just a note you would not have kept job with that drilling and they put me in wrong class for drilling in local farm comps before i got gps if that means anything,its best to wait for other people to tell you that you have made a good job than make your selfe look daft
Getting right back to the OP, using John's drilling photo - some sums. Assuming John's drill is 3m there are 24 counters so 12.5 cm spacing.
On 3m 12.5cm overlap = 4%
On 600 acres there are now an extra 25 acres.
Assuming a cost of £200 per acre for all variable costs, labour after ploughing and application costs.
So extra spend of £5000 per year.
What else could you buy to payback in 2 to 3 years?
On 3m 12.5cm overlap = 4%
On 600 acres there are now an extra 25 acres.
Assuming a cost of £200 per acre for all variable costs, labour after ploughing and application costs.
So extra spend of £5000 per year.
What else could you buy to payback in 2 to 3 years?
spanners
Member
Rural Rob
Member
- Location
- Gods own country NORFOLK
I hasten to add, if dressed you were breaking umpteen xcompliance rules.When wheat was £60/t I got £30 being a share farmer. I spread seed xpressed rolled. My tramlines were 24m Exactly because of GPS, after its cost it just about let me keep my head above water imagine trying to mark out with no GPS!
Rural Rob
Member
- Location
- Gods own country NORFOLK
My final word, it makes a damn good tractor driver into an even more productive one, who can work without suffering the fatigue of yesteryear. Please those that use it carry on, no one is holding a gun to your head to use it!
Thick Farmer
Member
- Location
- West Wales
What rules? I've always done it this way...
- Location
- Black Isle
What does a system suitably accurate for drilling with a 3m drill cost? Currently drilling 500acre a year but also have 700acre mowing prob around 1500acre of fert on grass etc that a steering pAckage would be useful for. Currently have a ez guide and can see a benefit to it at fert and mowing. Hopefully have a good few more acres to drill over the next few years so looking at ways I can get more output from my drill, more power and GPS would be a good start. Being a mixed farm just now I also have other commitments with animals that stops me getting more that a 12-13hour day drilling. I won't drill in the dark currently but would prob get an extra 3-4hours a day with GPS.
John it's all very well with only 75 acres to do you won't even know what fatigue is. The novelty of staring at a line trying to hold it straight with the sun in your eyes going along a sideland and theres dust flying soon wears thin.
John it's all very well with only 75 acres to do you won't even know what fatigue is. The novelty of staring at a line trying to hold it straight with the sun in your eyes going along a sideland and theres dust flying soon wears thin.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
Take your current EZ-Guide, add an EZ-Steer for ~£2000, brackets ~£500, omnistar unlock ~£1300, and if you can fit it yourself then great. Plus a £7-800 a year subscription.
Ball park figures a bit but not too far off the line I wouldn't think. That would be your cheapest route for sure, admittedly not the best option, but for sure the best value for money.
Ian01
Member
- Location
- In the East
[te="T C, post: 57702, member: 326"]Getting right back to the OP, using John's drilling photo - some sums. Assuming John's drill is 3m there are 24 counters so 12.5 cm spacing.
On 3m 12.5cm overlap = 4%
On 600 acres there are now an extra 25 acres.
Assuming a cost of £200 per acre for all variable costs, labour after ploughing and application costs.
So extra spend of £5000 per year.
What else could you buy to payback in 2 to 3 years?[/quote]
Although this is true in theory, I think in most cases, no product is actually saved because we all apply 20 ha worth of product to a 20 ha field, regardless of if you have gps, just with gps the bulk of the field would get a slightly higher dose, because less would be wasted on overlaps. I dont think I know of anyone who would apply 20.8 ha worth of product to that 20ha field to allow for the 4% overlap.
However i would say that there is a financial benefit from the more accurate placement of the product accross the field.
It always ammuses me though the ammount of people who go on and on about tramline widths, use rtk for drilling and tramlines for the ultimate accuracy, then drive up them tramlines applying fertiliser (one of the most expensve inputs) with a disc spreader, probably in the wind, which is probably the most inaccurate method of application available!
I definitely think it has its place, but it is easy to get carried away.
On 3m 12.5cm overlap = 4%
On 600 acres there are now an extra 25 acres.
Assuming a cost of £200 per acre for all variable costs, labour after ploughing and application costs.
So extra spend of £5000 per year.
What else could you buy to payback in 2 to 3 years?[/quote]
Although this is true in theory, I think in most cases, no product is actually saved because we all apply 20 ha worth of product to a 20 ha field, regardless of if you have gps, just with gps the bulk of the field would get a slightly higher dose, because less would be wasted on overlaps. I dont think I know of anyone who would apply 20.8 ha worth of product to that 20ha field to allow for the 4% overlap.
However i would say that there is a financial benefit from the more accurate placement of the product accross the field.
It always ammuses me though the ammount of people who go on and on about tramline widths, use rtk for drilling and tramlines for the ultimate accuracy, then drive up them tramlines applying fertiliser (one of the most expensve inputs) with a disc spreader, probably in the wind, which is probably the most inaccurate method of application available!
I definitely think it has its place, but it is easy to get carried away.
John 1594
Member
- Location
- Cambridgeshire
even more so if your trying to throw fert 36/48m with a twin disc machine, which makes me think a well set up 12m machine would give a more accurate coverage over the field surely?
Maybe im not as daft as you lot seem to think i am!!!
Maybe im not as daft as you lot seem to think i am!!!
- Location
- Black Isle
Thanks for reply. What pass to pass Accuracy does that have? Would it work from a 250 or does it need to be a 500? Will that steering motor thing fit to a 6930 jd? Thanks again
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
Although this is true in theory, I think in most cases, no product is actually saved because we all apply 20 ha worth of product to a 20 ha field, regardless of if you have gps, just with gps the bulk of the field would get a slightly higher dose, because less would be wasted on overlaps. I dont think I know of anyone who would apply 20.8 ha worth of product to that 20ha field to allow for the 4% overlap.
However i would say that there is a financial benefit from the more accurate placement of the product accross the field.
It always ammuses me though the ammount of people who go on and on about tramline widths, use rtk for drilling and tramlines for the ultimate accuracy, then drive up them tramlines applying fertiliser (one of the most expensve inputs) with a disc spreader, probably in the wind, which is probably the most inaccurate method of application available!
I definitely think it has its place, but it is easy to get carried away.[/quote]
Excellent post! Agree with you a lot regarding spray chems at least. Fert is only as accurate as the spinner is calibrated too-weigh cells would often help save/apply accurately more than GPS would.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
I'm no salesman/expert, just someone with an interest in it all but to answer your questions:
Pass to pass of 3-5" is the official line I'm lead to believe...though its generally accepted to be accurate enough for drilling so may well be less. I'm afraid I can't comment much further.
EZ-Steer will work off a 250 just as well as a 500, though you obviously just have a smaller screen.
I'd be very surprised given how popular JD6930s are if they didn't make a bracket to fit one. I'm fairly sure all modern tractors would have a kit, though you may struggle with a DB Zetor or the like from yesteryear.
Rural Rob
Member
- Location
- Gods own country NORFOLK
Leaving treated seed on the surface
- Location
- East Riding of Yorkshire
I have gone from a basic 4 auto section 24m boom to a 30m 10section boom the difference in field sizes now is amazing as more accurate, the end nozzles are a section on there own. When first started with new sprayer I wrote down the new field sizes and did so the next couple of times to make sure not a one off so now use these new areas to make up a load. Yes each field might not vary much from say just under a ha to say a quarter of a ha but at the end of the day this soon adds up, as an example just done under 200ha of t0 and saved two 5 litres pots of chemical which will go back to supplier or get put on stock list for the next t timing. Again 10 litres of product is not much but over a growing season for that crop I reckon it would soon add up. That make sense?