All true, but their effect on the soil is priceless, the vagans think they are doing good but if they got their way the destruction of the soil/ planet would be unimaginable
My Bridgeway Biostimulant trial
- Thread starter Clive
- Start date
Priceless maybe but you have to pay the bills
No point going bust whilst creating lovely sustainable soil ! ............ for someone else to farm
Farming is first and foremost a business for me
I might have mentioned in another thread recently ............. there is a very good book about this ;-)
- Location
- Essex/Herts Border
We found similar when we used to plough, if it was ploughing back up the next year that means theres not enough soil life down at 8 inches or so to breakdown the straw, essentially anaerobic conditions. Finding now that if we leave the straw on the surface by the following harvest its all gone.
Lovely sustainable soils are great for paying bills I think
They are but your rate of investment can bankrupt you before you get there
It’s not complex to understand what we need to do but it is complex to do make that change whilst still staying profitable and viable
If only I could afford to apply 25.000 t of compost and another 25,000t of FYM each year ........... 100k to spend on drainage would be nice as well and I could blow a couple of million on a 200 cow dairy unit with robots and people to run it ........ all of these things would improve my soils very quickly
Fact is change has to happen at an affordable and practical pace I’m afraid
Of course, we can all do a little tho, the "rules" for soil health don't change just because we can't or won't change. I'm not suggesting everybody can make massive changes to how they farm, just making the point that the grazing animal is a vital part of keeping soils healthy, personally I think soils can never be really healthy without animals somewhere in the system and their removal or mismanagement is a big reason that so many people have such pest/ weed/ disease problems on their farms
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
You could grow as many acres of stubble turnips as you could and rent it out to a lamb finisher ? or buy your own lambs , finishing stock is easy compared to breeding, finishing lambs is a doddle.
SilliamWhale
Member
Wpuldnt be great for the osr in the rotation
We do this on winter mixed covers but the economics of missing a combinable cash crop to grow / rent to livestock in a no livestock area simply doesn’t stack up
Hard to understand when u expect your surrounded by animals I guess but there are basically NO. livestock farms left around here really
Green manure summer cover crop incorporation going amazingly well for a friend of mine on heavy clay-BUT ON SCHEMES! Wheat /fallow/wheat/fallow-contract farmed/joint venture which makes overheads quantifiable & chargeable. Big enough area on simple combinables farm 'could' be possible if you viewed the covers as breaks(which are becoming less reliable)and more likely to leave a loss anyway! No stupid 10 way seed mixes-HS oats/beans/crucifer & make cheap.
Fixed costs need a complete overhaul-no massive power units as loads of time to create conditions to drill into, still need combine for your wheat crop-but available to hire out early season. Needs must, answers often harsh.
Think this is the caveat many need-slippery government support for 'soil health and sustainability' needs backing up.
Waits for ironic laughter.....
Fixed costs need a complete overhaul-no massive power units as loads of time to create conditions to drill into, still need combine for your wheat crop-but available to hire out early season. Needs must, answers often harsh.
Think this is the caveat many need-slippery government support for 'soil health and sustainability' needs backing up.
Waits for ironic laughter.....
No laughter from me - I would however prefer to not be sub dependant
But if it’s environmental sub and makes food more sustainable that’s a lot better use of tax payers money than the current system which pays many farmers to pollute and run inefficient businesses
No, not at all.
It obviously / simplistically does need a joined up approach from everyone. the top to the bottom..and part of that could be that somehow rents would be moderated
warksfarmer
Member
Straw needs N to break it down. Soil N levels are consistently 30-70kg/ha down to 60cm depth. Nobody adds fert to break straw down, ever.
Also straw adds back OM.
I’m afraid you are missing the point entirely.
warksfarmer
Member
AD plant as then it would widen the rotation further whilst giving back both liquid and solid soil nutrients.
- Location
- Lincolnshire.
If policy makers want this type of ag there is strong argument for taxing bagged nitrogen. This also chimes well with cutting greenhouse emissions.No, not at all.
It obviously / simplistically does need a joined up approach from everyone. the top to the bottom..and part of that could be that somehow rents would be moderated
We have a supply contact for AD. All green forage, return fluid & solids. Put in 150ha 3 year leys on v heavy BG land. I am leaving it in grass for the duration of the contract. Also 60 Ha continuous maize in awkward fields on primarily food based digestate nutrition(different AD plant and cheap!).
Trying to get life back into heavy land(that had been farmed out after 30 years arable-was all obviously originally grass as per rest of country)-and properly sort the blackgrass-just cannot get a look in against silage ryegrass.
So exporting fresh green matter and importing digestates and pig slurry if going begging. Buying layer muck covers its cost in nutrient around here, and have not yet found a 'free if you take it' deal.Turning straw into litter through broilers would be another less pastoral method of cycling organics-but the planners(and demand) has vagaries!
Trying to get life back into heavy land(that had been farmed out after 30 years arable-was all obviously originally grass as per rest of country)-and properly sort the blackgrass-just cannot get a look in against silage ryegrass.
So exporting fresh green matter and importing digestates and pig slurry if going begging. Buying layer muck covers its cost in nutrient around here, and have not yet found a 'free if you take it' deal.Turning straw into litter through broilers would be another less pastoral method of cycling organics-but the planners(and demand) has vagaries!
Not missing the point at all - soil is simply dirt without biology and biology need OM to feed it. It’s not hard to understand what happens to a cow if you don’t feed it, livestock in soil is no different !
Of course OM needs N to break it down but also eaten by a multitude of soil biology that eats and process it for you. N that goes into breakdown OM isn’t lost, it’s simply banked for later
You really should come have a look around our place - it would be really interesting as you were very familiar with a lot of our land and soil 10 years ago ....... I expect you wouldn’t recognise it now. Focusing on improving SOM and soil biology has lifted yields at least 10% over that period while using much lower inputs to get them
Last edited:
AD mines OM and soluble nutrition unless fed by waste - growing crops to feed it is frankly the definition of idiotic and the ultimate soil mining process
I can’t believe they will continue to subsidise such utter stupidity and environmental vandalism in the future, it’s as bad as burning straw really. Almost no faster way to release carbon into our atmosphere whilst depleting the resource we depend upon to feed ourselves ......... utter human madness and short term thinking at its finest
AD from waste makes a lot of sense however, certainly a lot better than landfilling it
Capex is also high and I believe it’s a very skilled job to run one successfully. A lot don’t seem to perform or deliver from what I’m told
Last edited: