- Location
- Derbyshire
mmm?Just look at all thatneed for chemicaldiversity
Herbal ice cream
'Herbal Ice Cream' , now there's a thought 
"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..
- Thread starter Kiwi Pete
- Start date
'Herbal Ice Cream' , now there's a thought GreenerGrass
Member
- Location
- Wilts
Had a neighbour cut my hay and he was not convinced said that with taller grass when trampled the mat generated would suppress grass growth. Of course he's right to an extent but a very short term view. He did seem impressed by the amount of grass we had mind!
Anyway I decided to have a poke around and amazing how much cooler and less dry it is under the mulch. The plant matter from the previous rotation is brown underneath as per photo. I'm not concerned about it in the slightest but just wondered does it take a while for the soil to get into equilibrium or during say dry summer months do things slow down. For now to my mind it's doing a great job!
I am struggling to get the same trampling on this rotation, think I need more mouths. And smaller paddocks! But for this week they'll have to stay as they are with 3 day moves. I have a couple of patches of very fine stemmed grass with delicate flowers, that the sheep don't seem to touch. I'll get a photo. At the minute I'm putting their salt lick on these spots but anything else worth thinking about with this grass? Will get a photo of them. Look quite palatable to my eye but sheep clearly don't agree!
Anyway I decided to have a poke around and amazing how much cooler and less dry it is under the mulch. The plant matter from the previous rotation is brown underneath as per photo. I'm not concerned about it in the slightest but just wondered does it take a while for the soil to get into equilibrium or during say dry summer months do things slow down. For now to my mind it's doing a great job!
I am struggling to get the same trampling on this rotation, think I need more mouths. And smaller paddocks! But for this week they'll have to stay as they are with 3 day moves. I have a couple of patches of very fine stemmed grass with delicate flowers, that the sheep don't seem to touch. I'll get a photo. At the minute I'm putting their salt lick on these spots but anything else worth thinking about with this grass? Will get a photo of them. Look quite palatable to my eye but sheep clearly don't agree!
Attachments
- Location
- Glen Clova, Angus, DD8 4RD
One of the habits we have to get out of is assessing how good/bad the forage looks to us. As Voisin points out it is what the animals make of it that is important. The highest yielding new ryegrass cultivar ever with high persistence and excellent disease resistance is of no financial or environmental benefit if the animals don't choose to eat it.
- Location
- West Yorkshire
It’s great to hear that your efforts are rubbing off on your neighbour and that he is taking note as to what you do, but also that he’s not to stubborn to ask for advice too.
Well done KP
Well done KP
GreenerGrass
Member
- Location
- Wilts
Oh trust me, I am seeing definitely it from the sheep's point of view! Hence asking the question on ID as there are vibrant green patches of it left in the paddock after moves, I am putting salt buckets on them so they get trampled, as I can tell the sheep don't like it! Is it silver hair grass, or common bent, or something else?
Attachments
Could try chopping it up and mixing it with a treat to give them a taste of it. Sometimes it's just something new and they aren't used to it or just don't want to try it. Bunching them tighter can also make them try some.
I'm sure it's probably not toxic but you can always check that out before trying to get them to eat it
- Location
- Quebec, Canada
I work out each field individually. I have all the records but haven’t properly figured out what to do with them.Some years are wet, some dry- I don’t find there is much consistency in my animal days per acre. Maybe a few more years of data will help establish a sortof picture.
- Location
- Quebec, Canada
I took a HM financial planning course a couple of years ago. That helped eventhough I didn’t completely’get’ it. I find the holisticmanagement approach to things a bit like the game ‘Twister’. I am trying to keep better accounts and have worked quite diligently at budgetting. I don’t necessarily keep to it, but I have an idea of what I will earn this year and have tried to plan expenses around that.
I took a lot of the things in this thread to heart. Especially the bit about cutting back inputs. I never really had a way of measuring if they did any good, so I cut just about everything but the bare bones out. I am spending a bit more this year than last completing my water project and putting a roof over my winter shelter (from cedar from the woodlot and scavenged roofing tin and rafters from a neighbours old barn).It won’t earn me anything but it should make the job of looking after the animals easier.
I have spread out my earnings through the year by having hens( not a lot of money but pay for a lot of incidentals) and butchering animals throughout the year instead of just in the autumn as previously. It doesn’t increase the income but it means you aren’t scrounging around for money to pay bills or not paying them and being charged interest.
A big money drain is the ‘good idea’, buying books, going to conferences, taking courses- actually its all connected- and I am grateful for this thread and others as it fulfills the same purpose but is free.
- Location
- Quebec, Canada
View attachment 817520
View attachment 817522
This grazing with a plan is starting to feel good now
Top picture shows yesterday break, grazing today and what is for tomorrow. Bottom picture shows the week ahead. Good dose of rain this morning too that'll freshen things up.
BEAUTIFUL!!!View attachment 817520
View attachment 817522
This grazing with a plan is starting to feel good now
Top picture shows yesterday break, grazing today and what is for tomorrow. Bottom picture shows the week ahead. Good dose of rain this morning too that'll freshen things up.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
That panicle (seedhead) looks a lot like a bent or a meadow-grass, but it isn't one we have here so I can't be too sure.
The only pink coloured grass we have here is good old Yorkshire Fog, and it isn't that.
I'm thinking creeping or common bent.
Is it becoming invasive?
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
He is a really stubborn type of guy.It’s great to hear that your efforts are rubbing off on your neighbour and that he is taking note as to what you do, but also that he’s not to stubborn to ask for advice too.
Well done KP
I'd have a hell of a time prising him off the farm to go to a discussion group or the like; that's a fair part of the problem, he's such a hermit and doesn't get away out to see what "the locals" do.
As a result he's farming in a paradigm he isn't living in anymore, ie he came from a part of the country reliant on irrigation, and really struggles to manage for dry as the way he's accustomed to (turn up the irrigation) isn't available. So it's crunch time.
I suppose it's similar to a few threads on here about the beef job being buggered in some respects; farming for conditions that don't exist isn't working anymore.
Which for me is mind-blowing, if money can be made with cheap cattle, then why does everyone keep wishing they were more expensive?
My neighbour is similar in that way, he simply wishes the summers were wetter and the winters were drier.... he's also similarly not getting what he wants!
could be CRF.
creeping red fescue
creeping red fescue
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
As per my other post, I fear he "won't be dragged off the farm" due to his habits.Is there a group to point them towards? @Sheila Cooke has repeatedly suggested we set up as a Savory training hub once we get settled.
I believe that what you are seeing is the most effective, if slow, way that holistic management will spread: by farmers observing their "mad" neighbours doing better than they are and asking questions.
Alan says we must make it happen much faster than that though if we are to address the climate issues in time.
Perhaps the writing IS on the wall for the bloated Ag supply and conventional "education" industry.
He keeps very much to himself, as a rule.
I think the writing's on the wall for his current operation, anyway, based on the information he gave me.
One little pearl is that they spent around 70k on fertiliser last year, and bought in about 1000 bales
which demonstrates quite neatly the difference between supplying feed for X number of cows, rather than balancing the number of cows to the feed you can grow.Someone on here earlier said they need to grow 15tons of DM to have enough feed, I didn't persue it at the time but I still find it an interesting way to look at the problem of feeding a cow for a year
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
That would make sense.could be CRF.
creeping red fescue
A good dry-out last summer would suit it well?
I notice a lot more Chewing's fescue this year than ever before, possibly due to management but likely also a change in soil moisture levels.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
- Location
- Glen Clova, Angus, DD8 4RD
That would make a great bale grazing soil improver for damaged land then.
What I've found mind blowing on some of those threads is I've put premium prices of what can be achieved & only 1 person asked how to achieve those premiums
If someone was getting 15-25% more than me for doing a similar job I'd be looking at what they are doing.
Kp said surely it was profitable @ 350- 360p/kg with native breeds & no one answered!?
I was going to answer but couldn't be arsed with the arguments off anyone saying the job is doomed or about small hairy cattle that don't come to any money. I'd already decided that natives were the answer to a lot of out beef cattle problems the Angus and Hereford bonuses when you sell them are the icing on the cakeWhat I've found mind blowing on some of those threads is I've put premium prices of what can be achieved & only 1 person asked how to achieve those premiums
If someone was getting 15-25% more than me for doing a similar job I'd be looking at what they are doing.
Kp said surely it was profitable @ 350- 360p/kg with native breeds & no one answered!?
I didn't answer either! was waiting for some interesting answers but they didn't appearI was going to answer but couldn't be arsed with the arguments off anyone saying the job is doomed or about small hairy cattle that don't come to any money. I'd already decided that natives were the answer to a lot of out beef cattle problems the Angus and Hereford bonuses when you sell them are the icing on the cake
.