Buying Top quality meat ? why so hard ?

honeyend · Nov 3, 2020

Clive said:
My point is though for you livestock producers - why are not more of you not butchering and retailing direct, online at a premium?

why are the good places the exception?

If only it was that easy. You need to invest in cold stores, freezers, training in food hygiene, boxes to pack with chiller packs, and want to do all the paperwork that goes with it. Some I know someone sells through Facebook, every two weeks he sells ,pork, sausages, bacon and gammon and a home produced chicken, selling it direct from the butcher that cut his pigs, and once a month beef in 10kg boxes. I am amazed at his energy to do this, on top of all the other things he does. You have to keep marketing, which is a job in its self if you are going to get the turnover to reduce wastage.
When I was selling food I couldn't find local beef at the time, so I used,

Buy Meat Online | Online Butchers | Donald Russell

Buy meat online with Donald Russell. We have 50 years' experience in supplying quality beef, chicken, lamb and seafood to homes and restaurants across the UK.

www.donaldrussell.com

Tim G · Nov 3, 2020

Clive said:
worth every penny, fed 12 with left overs that will make my sandwiches most of this week and most importantly was divine eating

Obviously you mean it 'could have' fed 12, you only had six round.

jellybean · Nov 3, 2020

Modern legislation makes it much harder to get access to good quality meat. I know it is not possible to turn back the clock to the time when we could do what we like in order to eat well. Two things spring to mind straight away, the first is abattoir slaughter. For our own meat an animal is chosen and will be shot through the back of the head while it is lying down in the field. Zero stress! No loading up, no journey, no rough handling, no unfamiliar experience in the company of other stressed animals. Second is speed of refrigeration. I prefer to let carcasses cool down for at least 24 hours before any refrigeration and even then find it best to hang in the skin for whatever time you feel is appropriate to let the meat relax, usually at least 10 days with no refrigeration. Obviously not possible in summer.
All these things can be done if for home consumption by yourselves.

Dry Rot · Nov 3, 2020

Clive said:
Only meat I would disagree and say does need marinades or heavy seasoning is chicken which is quite a bland meat left alone

You've got the wrong breed of chicken reared the wrong way, which is why I breed my own!

milkloss · Nov 3, 2020

Funny this thread came up..... I got sent this YT vid from the Bearded Butchers (I wonder if this is who @Clive has been learning about fancy cuts from) which talks about grass fed vs feedlot beef. They also show the cutting of the Pecanha steak, it's quite long but also an interesting video. They are certainly good at selling themselves and their products..... most money is probably made from traeger (sp?) smokers, plenty of mentions!

So grass fed or feedlot? I think I prefer the feedlot..... sorry everyone, I'm just not into that gamey flavour.

And for @Clive ..... the secret steak..... the next must have piece of meat!

JD-Kid · Nov 3, 2020

milkloss said:
Funny this thread came up..... I got sent this YT vid from the Bearded Butchers (I wonder if this is who @Clive has been learning about fancy cuts from) which talks about grass fed vs feedlot beef. They also show the cutting of the Pecanha steak, it's quite long but also an interesting video. They are certainly good at selling themselves and their products..... most money is probably made from traeger (sp?) smokers, plenty of mentions!

So grass fed or feedlot? I think I prefer the feedlot..... sorry everyone, I'm just not into that gamey flavour.

And for @Clive ..... the secret steak..... the next must have piece of meat!

most of the beef eat is grass feed had some from a feedlot a while back and have to say was great
best lamb/mutton off clovers etc and still had a mouth full of grass when hit the ground worst lamb had been off feed for a few hours

Chasingmytail · Nov 3, 2020

There are 5 lambs in the freezer all organic grassfed. Really happy with them. The butchery is good.
Pork I only buy organic due to the feeds. Havent raised any pigs in a while so buying and I would say the best pork Ive had is from Grazegills (clitheroe). I tend to buy half/whole pig and its cut to my spec. I dont like small joints to me that doesnt work.

Beef again depends on whether we have anything havent killed a beast in some time. I find beef hit and miss very much depends on the breed and the hanging. There are many issues with beef imo. It can be very disappointing, lacking taste and just plain bland. The beef I have bought is from Mountain Hall Farm in West Wales (not organic but Hereford grassfed) older cow and exceptional tasting with real fat. Steaks cut thick (no point in thin steaks). Also my other pet hate is over minced beef mince - why do this? It becomes a nasty paste. Mince should not be put through the mincer 3 times. Its no good it needs to hold onto its shape. Another disappointment was beef from Exmoor from a big advertiser very fancy packaging and newspaper. The mince came in 250g packs - why? I had my bin full of plastic. The beef tasted no better than average run of the mill.

I think the butchery is the problem as the old school cutting isnt done now and a few years ago I had a butchery do some cutting via a friend god only knows what he was doing but the so called ribeye steaks were so rough. Getting beef hung properly is another issue. The big butcher we used over 12 years ago didnt have a hanging fridge it was a contestant walk in fridge with pigs etc. The beef carcass got wet and went moldy on the outside. Instead of cutting the mold off them cut it all up. Customers had furry sausages and burgers within days it was a flippin scary time after that we called it a day.

Chickens we raise ourselves and freeze in bulk.

Chasingmytail · Nov 3, 2020

I also wonder about the refrigeration process going on in some places. About 4 years ago we took some average lambs to a small family abattoir (not our usual place) and they came back inedible - you could eat any of it. I couldnt work this out never happened before been taking lambs done for years and year - good bad ugly. There was nothing I had done as the first batch I didnt freeze. The chops were so tough. I did some research and the only way this could of happened is that the warm lamb was chucked in the chiller too quick and temp dropped suddenly. Also they only killed on certain days so assumed they took in too much stock on that day. If this is happening elsewhere then good meat is being ruined by the abbattoir. After this went back to the local butcher as no way can you have good lamb ruined like this imagine if we had sold this meat????

Highland Mule · Nov 3, 2020

Clive said:
all I want as a customer is to order a Packer cut brisket or pichana and get that

surely not good business to complicate things or exclude customers because they don’t use the words you want them to ?

What's the swahilli for barley, or the japanese for wheat? How do you say "peas" in Mongolian?

If you're expecting a multilingual butcher as a default, I presume you're similarly competent for your own produce?

Be honest though, do you even know which language 'pichana' is from, far less speak it?

holwellcourtfarm · Nov 3, 2020

upnortheast said:
When we go out to eat I hardly ever have a steak.. Been disappointed too many times.

Same here. Restaraunt beef is a complete unknown

. Virtually none provide any detail of where their meat comes from or how it has been handled.

honeyend · Nov 3, 2020

I have been really lucky that I found two butchers, one does kill and cut at the shop, the other takes his my animal in with his, then he has the refrigeration to hang. When local abattoirs are closing it's going to get harder, not many have the space or handling for cattle.
The only way for the small abattoirs to survive with the new regulations, is if producers can provide them with a regular supply.
This is no longer up to date but it gives some information.

Good (or not) Abattior guide - Version 2 - The Accidental Smallholder

Good (or not) Abattior guide - Version 2

www.accidentalsmallholder.net

JD-Kid · Nov 3, 2020

holwellcourtfarm said:
Same here. Restaraunt beef is a complete unknown . Virtually none provide any detail of where their meat comes from or how it has been handled.

there was a place in NZ called hogs breath slow cooked steaks for the whole day then grilled them best feed have had for a long time .
grandmother could cook a steak for a hour and it was great
I f#$k up steaks yer need yer good teeth in to eat them hahahaha

ollie989898 · Nov 3, 2020

milkloss said:
Funny this thread came up..... I got sent this YT vid from the Bearded Butchers (I wonder if this is who @Clive has been learning about fancy cuts from) which talks about grass fed vs feedlot beef. They also show the cutting of the Pecanha steak, it's quite long but also an interesting video. They are certainly good at selling themselves and their products..... most money is probably made from traeger (sp?) smokers, plenty of mentions!

So grass fed or feedlot? I think I prefer the feedlot..... sorry everyone, I'm just not into that gamey flavour.

And for @Clive ..... the secret steak..... the next must have piece of meat!

You see this is what you have about no, fudging cults about a particular cut of meat. FFS, 60 years ago people would just have been glad to have a piece of beef to eat.

Clive · Nov 3, 2020

Spud said:
I have no problem with you Clive, don't flatter yourself.

Strange how you've got all excited about my comment on your approach, but totally ignored my earlier post.

Seems you can't resist attacking me.

Maybe you need counselling?

Put me on ignore if you like, I understand it's a simple procedure?

Or maybe just get off your high horse and accept that we're all different.

As a moderator I can not ignore any member, if I could I would though, You certainly can however

Are you a livestock farmer? if not what's so interesting about this tread other than it being a chance for you to call me pretentious ?

ollie989898 · Nov 3, 2020

Chasingmytail said:
There are 5 lambs in the freezer all organic grassfed. Really happy with them. The butchery is good.
Pork I only buy organic due to the feeds. Havent raised any pigs in a while so buying and I would say the best pork Ive had is from Grazegills (clitheroe). I tend to buy half/whole pig and its cut to my spec. I dont like small joints to me that doesnt work.

Beef again depends on whether we have anything havent killed a beast in some time. I find beef hit and miss very much depends on the breed and the hanging. There are many issues with beef imo. It can be very disappointing, lacking taste and just plain bland. The beef I have bought is from Mountain Hall Farm in West Wales (not organic but Hereford grassfed) older cow and exceptional tasting with real fat. Steaks cut thick (no point in thin steaks). Also my other pet hate is over minced beef mince - why do this? It becomes a nasty paste. Mince should not be put through the mincer 3 times. Its no good it needs to hold onto its shape. Another disappointment was beef from Exmoor from a big advertiser very fancy packaging and newspaper. The mince came in 250g packs - why? I had my bin full of plastic. The beef tasted no better than average run of the mill.

I think the butchery is the problem as the old school cutting isnt done now and a few years ago I had a butchery do some cutting via a friend god only knows what he was doing but the so called ribeye steaks were so rough. Getting beef hung properly is another issue. The big butcher we used over 12 years ago didnt have a hanging fridge it was a contestant walk in fridge with pigs etc. The beef carcass got wet and went moldy on the outside. Instead of cutting the mold off them cut it all up. Customers had furry sausages and burgers within days it was a flippin scary time after that we called it a day.

Chickens we raise ourselves and freeze in bulk.

You describe all the things that can go wrong. A while back around Easter I was sat in the office with a client sorting some paperwork and his old man arrived back in his pickup with box after box of meat all packed- he'd just returned from collecting the meat from an old cull cow they had fattened and he had shed loads of stuff in his pick up. He invited me to take a box home and I promptly put it in my car and left. Do you know, that box was loaded with a load of steaks and a pretty basic mince but it was all excellent- they had deliberately fed this one beast up and put the fat on it knowing they would eat it themselves. Nothing wrong with any of it.

Spud · Nov 3, 2020

Clive said:
As a moderator I can not ignore any member, if I could I would though, You certainly can however

Are you a livestock farmer? if not what's so interesting about this tread other than it being a chance for you to call me pretentious ?

I've told you not to flatter yourself, but yet you continue.

I don't need to justify which threads I read or contribute to, as far as I know, it's an open forum.

But since you ask, I rear livestock, and both buy and eat meat. I'm also interested in the wider markets, and how sectors that I am not directly involved in operate.

I trust that is reason enough?

ollie989898 · Nov 3, 2020

holwellcourtfarm said:
Same here. Restaraunt beef is a complete unknown . Virtually none provide any detail of where their meat comes from or how it has been handled.

Depends on the restaurant or pub in question. Around here they usually proudly detail where they obtain their products.

Tim G · Nov 3, 2020

Highland Mule said:
What's the swahilli for barley, or the japanese for wheat? How do you say "peas" in Mongolian?

If you're expecting a multilingual butcher as a default, I presume you're similarly competent for your own produce?

Be honest though, do you even know which language 'pichana' is from, far less speak it?

Its Picanha.....
Could be why the butcher doesn't know what he's asking for.

Highland Mule · Nov 3, 2020

Tim G said:
Its Picanha.....
Could be why the butcher doesn't know what he's asking for.

To be fair to Clive - that's what he wrote in the OP - I must have picked up a mis-spelled example later. Forgive me - I don't speak or write portugese. Is the pronouncation tricky? I've had issues before with asking for the wrong things in languages that weren't my mother tongue (actually in it too, if I think about it - the joys of accents!).

Clive · Nov 3, 2020

Tim G said:
Its Picanha.....
Could be why the butcher doesn't know what he's asking for.

isn't it a butchers job to know all this though ?

Buying Top quality meat ? why so hard ?

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