For those farming less than 200 acres.

andybk

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Mendips Somerset
We do need a reset of our food system, the present system produces food that is not nutrient dense, and food that is often ultra processed and too reliant on carbs and sugar. If we as a country do not change, we will become progressively fatter and even less healthy. How this change if it happens will affect farming, I am not sure, but I do know that if our food system does not change the future is pretty dire.
The issue is the "we are the cheapest message "supermarkets keep peddling , the consumer has lost all value of a basic necessity.(who really picks up a bottle of milk and looked at the price ? did anyone ever , they just buy what they need for the week !)
Most of the ultra processed (cheap) food is usually the bits normal food manufacture throws away , or the low value cuts , all this reformed meat that is power washed off carcases reformed into cheap burgers , curries etc in the freezer cabinet ,
how you convince joe public to buy less better quality food is a tough one , there is still to much being thrown away, not enough thought goes into buying it , lots of impulse buys , Best before dates another thing , while a good guide is read by the housewife as a do not use guide and in the bin it goes , inc cheese lol
There are numerous small shops selling near date stuff around here now, we have never had anything that was off from any of them (we use them regularly ) , so im really not sure the best before dates are working in creating less waste the opposite in fact , as its replaced in the next visit to tesco .
Supermarkets rely on impulse buys be interesting to know what % gets thrown out after a few weeks .
I would bet the carbon in manufacture / transport / disposal of these items (many wrapped in plastic ) would eclipse any carbon given off from farm animals in normal production that gets used as it should
 
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DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
We do need a reset of our food system, the present system produces food that is not nutrient dense, and food that is often ultra processed and too reliant on carbs and sugar. If we as a country do not change, we will become progressively fatter and even less healthy. How this change if it happens will affect farming, I am not sure, but I do know that if our food system does not change the future is pretty dire.
So where are we heading then? Meat and veg but not potatoes, wheat or sugar?
I have been reflecting on this as I complete my fertiliser plan. The only system here that would be remotely sustainable would be clover leys and sheep, maybe cattle as well with some barley in the rotation. All the rest, wheat, beet, potatoes etc need large amounts of non renewable resources and aren’t, when you think about it, that good for the population generally - well loads of carbohydrate doesn’t do me much good anyway.
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
Hmmm. The only thing that would be remotely sustainable here is extensive meat production. Eggs, and dairy would also be doable as at least you recycle a lot of the P and K rather than trailer it off the farm. As commented on, sustainability here would be completely contrary to veganism. We can manufacture N to keep the system going using clover.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
Livestock Farmer
So where are we heading then? Meat and veg but not potatoes, wheat or sugar?
I have been reflecting on this as I complete my fertiliser plan. The only system here that would be remotely sustainable would be clover leys and sheep, maybe cattle as well with some barley in the rotation. All the rest, wheat, beet, potatoes etc need large amounts of non renewable resources and aren’t, when you think about it, that good for the population generally - well loads of carbohydrate doesn’t do me much good anyway.
Rather contradicts Henry Dimbleby's National Food Strategy......
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
We do need a reset of our food system, the present system produces food that is not nutrient dense, and food that is often ultra processed and too reliant on carbs and sugar. If we as a country do not change, we will become progressively fatter and even less healthy. How this change if it happens will affect farming, I am not sure, but I do know that if our food system does not change the future is pretty dire.

What has food got to do with many farmers? I walk 1000's of hectares. Only food I see is Lettuce, Brassica Ve, carrots, potatoes. The rest is Wheat, barley and Oilseed Rape, oh and a bit of Linseed. None of that do I see in a supermarket as food. Nope. Farmers do not process the stuff. And I do not see why farmers get so worked up. Price of wheat is the key driver here in Lincolnshire unless or until government insist on some percentage in some form of stewardship.
 

Treg

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Cornwall
Just read again what I posted, I should clarify that she said that they had shut the nfs office down. She didn't say the 'waste of time' bit, that's just my observation.
I realised that's what you meant (y)
By shutting the office though they obviously feel there will be no food shortages in the next 5 yrs, the nation will be eating more healthy than the last 20yrs & we'll be producing the bulk of these healthy sustainable foods ourselves :rolleyes:
 

Spade

Member
Livestock Farmer
Purely for those farming less than 200 acres * please :

1) Have you been invited to be a pilot for the SFI ? Will you be taking up the invitation ?
2) How important are current BPS payments to your business ?
3) From what you know to date, do you see the SFI as being of relevance to your business ?
4) If it's not too intrusive, where do you see your farming business being in 5 years time ?

* Average farm size in England.
1. Yes
2. 60%
3 . Has a lot of catching up to do
4. Non existent
 

Wombat

Member
BASIS
Location
East yorks
Has anyone done the maths on what a 200 acre PP farm would get following yesterday's announcements ?
Approx
80ha x £58/ha = £4480

but you have to plant 15% herbal lays and the cheapest seed I could find with a quick scout online is £60/acre or £150/ha (some were closer to £250/ha) so you loose 12ha x 150 over the the 3 yrs so £1780 on seed alone

Just looking into it the herbal lay seeds spread across the whole time and area of the scheme (£1780 / (80hax3yrs) is about £8/ha out of the £20/ha so nearly half the advanced topup goes on seed costs for the herbal lay part only.
 
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delilah

Member
Approx
80ha x £58/ha = £4480

but you have to plant 15% herbal lays and the cheapest seed I could find with a quick scout online is £60/acre or £150/ha (some were closer to £250/ha) so you loose 12ha x 150 over the the 3 yrs so £1780 on seed alone

So, the most numerous farmers and farm type in England, managing our most stable carbon store, wont be applying.
Where does that leave the 70% participation target ? Where does that leave any pretence that ELMS is going to deliver any public good ?

Comments @Janet Hughes Defra ?
 

Treg

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Cornwall
(y) So, the most numerous farmers and farm type in England, managing our most stable carbon store, wont be applying.
Where does that leave the 70% participation target ? Where does that leave any pretence that ELMS is going to deliver any public good ?

Comments @Janet Hughes Defra ?
I've done the sums for here, already have herbal leys ✔ already do health review & testing so considering next years BPS cut I will still be £500 better off 😀
I'm happy with that, was expecting deep cuts to farm income but looks like I'll still be able to feed the kids(y)
 

delilah

Member
I've done the sums for here, already have herbal leys ✔ already do health review & testing so considering next years BPS cut I will still be £500 better off 😀
I'm happy with that, was expecting deep cuts to farm income but looks like I'll still be able to feed the kids(y)

So that isn't at the £58/ Ha quoted above ? What £/Ha is that ?
 

Treg

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Cornwall
What happens in 2023 and 2024 then with bps cuts mount up
They have said they are bringing in more options that you can add on in those years plus increase payment rates.
My current CS is for Organic grazing & couldn't add any options to it when I applied but now sounds like you can just keep adding options over the next few years , until we reach the next phase of uncertainty :rolleyes:
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 79 42.0%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 66 35.1%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 16.0%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,292
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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