In theory the rent should be lower because the earning potential of the land is less for the tenant. But in reality…
New information about local nature recovery and landscape recovery
- Thread starter Janet Hughes Defra
- Start date
Defra and the Government are destroying farming in the uk , they would rather import food and brag to the rest of the world how carbon zero the uk is. You don’t see them telling the airlines to reduce pollution by reducing how many flights they send up in the sky , no they are expanding Heathrow for cater for more flights while telling us to reduce our businesses and plant trees and flowers. They have so much control over uk ag. It stinks so much we should tell them to get stuffed.
My landlord also refuses to lower the rent as he knows the AD and Potato boys will pay the higher rents.
- Location
- Moreton-in-Marsh, Glos
So would I, as long as the entire world did the same.
- Location
- Moreton-in-Marsh, Glos
Yes it does. I suspect it may well become the death knell of ELMs and I couldn’t be more pleased if this was the case. Red Tractor too!
But, just in case………………!
- Location
- People's Republic of South Yorkshire
Well that would mean the down stream farmer can not ruin the river and flood his land as he will be breaking the law.
So will you be putting this info next to the option? To let the farmer know the risk he runs flooding his land? I am sure if you pay a farmer to do it and you are aware of the law and they are not and you did not tell them then their maybe a case against defra.
How about the tree example then?
A wood is planted on a slope with defra grant that then shades out large area of the neighbours land?
Reduced yields and late ripening on the shaded land.
Compensation for the shaded farmer?
beef 1
Member
- Location
- north yorkshire
i agree
- Location
- Devon
To claim BPS, you had to be an active farmer.
The more I read about ELMS, it seems that they wish to exclude active farmers.
The current scheme shows no initiative, it does nothing for farming and can therefore be in no way be considered sustainable. It fails as a SFI.
I just find it very sad that a once in a lifetime opportunity to make British agriculture successful, financially and environmentally, is being wasted.
- Location
- People's Republic of South Yorkshire
@Janet Hughes Defra
I think a simple way to look at this whole thing is like this:
Myself (who has been in environmental schemes for over 20 years and won conservation awards) and many other farmers who have been in the various environmental schemes are all saying they won't join this new 1 your designing.
Does it not say something to you that farmers who have been very active in environmental schemes don't think this is worth doing and badly designed?
I think a simple way to look at this whole thing is like this:
Myself (who has been in environmental schemes for over 20 years and won conservation awards) and many other farmers who have been in the various environmental schemes are all saying they won't join this new 1 your designing.
Does it not say something to you that farmers who have been very active in environmental schemes don't think this is worth doing and badly designed?
You don’t have to even grow anything to claim bps. It’s got nothing to do with farming and everything to do with land ownership.
I agree about the SFI, I was originally quite encouraged by it, but it seems to be becoming so complicated that’s it’s not worth the time of day, and the way we are farming means we wouldhave to change very little to get the full amount.
Hindsight
Member
- Location
- Lincolnshire
NO JofA. The definition of an active farmer under BPS and SPS before was so wide anyone was eligible, irrespective of being a 'farmer' The area based entitlement system made it a payment for occupying land. That is a subtle difference from owning land.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Well I think it’s best to do what’s right on the ground rather than what fits the forms.
So here we will have permanent not rotational watercourse grass buffer strips, min width 12m max width what ever I need to make a straight edge on the field boundary. Might be cut for horse hay. Might have a bit of camping. Might be left tussocky for field voles. Might be lightly grazed in rotation. I’m not interested in redrilling fancy mixes every year.
Don’t think this plan fits a “scheme” but not losimg any sleep over it. It’s practical, sensible and a winner all round as far as I’m concerned. Probably 10 acres out of 200 used. Done my bit.
So here we will have permanent not rotational watercourse grass buffer strips, min width 12m max width what ever I need to make a straight edge on the field boundary. Might be cut for horse hay. Might have a bit of camping. Might be left tussocky for field voles. Might be lightly grazed in rotation. I’m not interested in redrilling fancy mixes every year.
Don’t think this plan fits a “scheme” but not losimg any sleep over it. It’s practical, sensible and a winner all round as far as I’m concerned. Probably 10 acres out of 200 used. Done my bit.
England will be disadvantaged now with inputs costs , now priced for subsided farming as in the rest of uk and europe. If you are selling something you don,t price it to your poorest customer if you have plenty of market else ware.This i see is going to be a big problem for English farmers. May be we will be the one importing cheep machinery instead of Africa.
You don't have to own land to claim BPS any more than you have to grow/produce anything to claim it, lots of folk seem to go on about it being payment for land ownership but that is simply not true
midlandslad
Member
- Location
- Midlands
@Janet Hughes Defra
Have you released details of the profile of the new SFI claimants?
would you agree that the RPA were unsuccessful in the original rollout of the SPS scheme in 2005?
would you agree that the SPS scheme was relatively straightforward in comparison to the proposed scheme?
What proportion of the SPS or even current BPS is passed to the RPA? And what proportion will be passed to administer the new schemes?
Are the impact assessments for the new ELMS available online?
Have you released details of the profile of the new SFI claimants?
would you agree that the RPA were unsuccessful in the original rollout of the SPS scheme in 2005?
would you agree that the SPS scheme was relatively straightforward in comparison to the proposed scheme?
What proportion of the SPS or even current BPS is passed to the RPA? And what proportion will be passed to administer the new schemes?
Are the impact assessments for the new ELMS available online?
midlandslad
Member
- Location
- Midlands
I think the point is that the payment finds its way to the landlord either directly or via an inflated rent.
It gets back to the land owner generally. You either have a cfa so there land owner can be an ‘active farmer’ for tax reasons and that keeps the bps basically as their first charge, or you do an FBT where the land owner takes no risk and the tenant takes the bps but the value of that is built into the rent. Bps is part of the earning potential of the land, just like carbon/elms,natural capital etc.
(unless you are on an old aha tenancy)
It don't always though so its just a stupid statement
- Location
- North Wales
Hi @Janet Hughes Defra
I find the word recovery in the name of both schemes very insulting to land managers. Recover from what? Decades of government redtape and control? Your impying that all land eligible is in a poor state and needs to be repaired yet it'll have been managed within government scheme rules.
You want farmers to join these schemes but you've already put them down in the scheme title.
I'm sure you could think of a better title for LNR and you can dump LR.
I find the word recovery in the name of both schemes very insulting to land managers. Recover from what? Decades of government redtape and control? Your impying that all land eligible is in a poor state and needs to be repaired yet it'll have been managed within government scheme rules.
You want farmers to join these schemes but you've already put them down in the scheme title.
I'm sure you could think of a better title for LNR and you can dump LR.