Clay Soils Cracking

bactosoil · Jan 11, 2016

Loads out there in US which say between 1 to 2 tons and acre every 1 to 2 years, heavier ground getting heavier rates

http://fabe.osu.edu/sites/fabe/files/imce/files/Soybean/Bob Hecht PowerPoint.pdf

excerpts below

Percolation Rates Increase With Calcium Sulfate

Depth of Water Percolation Treatment Standing after 24 hrs.,

In. ml/24 hrs.

Check .50 86

Sulfur, 1 ton .23 86

CaSO4, 1 ton .18 190

Ca SO4, 5 tons .15 280

McGeorge et al. (1956), Irr. Plots; Impermeable soil.

Recommendations are developed with an assumption that one equivalent of a calcium will displace an equivalent of either sodium or magnesium on the soil exchange sites. Calcium has the greatest attraction for the soil particle.

If using recycled gypsum in the UK ,current EA regulations I believe allows you to spread 2 tonne/ha per year( though would want to put on more) but action will be moderately slow depending on particle size/grading curve ,
though not viable in arable crops ( multiple applications and higher input cost) the effectiveness of liquid calcium is truly impressive and quick .
As I said before about water movement not only do you want to improve water movement downwards but also the other way when plants need availability to moisture
and calcium can help towards this too .

Rainmaker · Jan 15, 2016

static said:
Any evidence, anecdotal will do, that the more I leave the soil be the more readily it will crack and self structure?

Last year the very shallow discing then drilling worked really well, but this last lot of rain is making me look a bit silly with the ploughed land taking the water much better.

Brother is now sad that we didnt subsoil the headlands at least, but I am trying to stick with my guns that by leaving the soil be it will more readily sort itself out.

I don't think one can call large cracks in the soil "self structuring" when the soil between the cracks is still a often a hard lump. Agree like others have said if you leave the land the water will run down cracks and not get trapped in the organicy tilthy glue the shallow dicing made.
Here the silty soil over clay will pull into a friable tilth but the large cracks are bad news as we want to trap as much irrigation/rain in the top soil as possible. DD land always need irrigation first one finds. (to be fair long term DD may change that)

franklin · Jan 15, 2016

Dont think irrigation will ever be a requirement here.

Farmer.sa · Jan 15, 2016

We have marsh land that cracks, 1 year went rabbit shooting and dropped them down the cracks they were that big! We manage them a lot better now if in wheat we plant 475 seeds m/sq to get the ground cover and stop wind/light getting to the soil helps a lot, normal drilling is 300-325 seeds. We have used gypsum in the past jury out on how much it helps only Benefit is mg as are soil is so high in mg it's locked up.

bactosoil · Jan 16, 2016

Agree like others have said if you leave the land the water will run down cracks and not get trapped in the organicy tilthy glue the shallow dicing made.

The organic tilthy glue will be down to biology in the soil, far more so than the mode of operation

Right-arm fast · Jan 16, 2016

static said:
Any evidence, anecdotal will do, that the more I leave the soil be the more readily it will crack and self structure?

Last year the very shallow discing then drilling worked really well, but this last lot of rain is making me look a bit silly with the ploughed land taking the water much better.

Brother is now sad that we didnt subsoil the headlands at least, but I am trying to stick with my guns that by leaving the soil be it will more readily sort itself out.

If we dont subsoil generally at some point water will lie in the lowest parts due to surface water. The soil cant absorb the water fast enogh and it sometimes runs to the lowest point.The land travels much better though than when its ploughed in my experience. Our ground will crack the size and depth of the cracks depends on how long its dry for.

bactosoil · Jan 16, 2016

Subsoiling and ploughing will create physical breaks but will not actually improve infiltration rate of the soil of the soil itself ( in fact will adversely affect it), with bacterial management it is possible to see huge improvements in infiltration in short periods of time and will reduce the need to subsoil

franklin · Jan 16, 2016

In a decent hot summer, we would typically get cracks deep and wide enough to see the backfill along the drains. We have stopped subsoiling as most years are either a) too wet at depth or b) so dry you pull the soil up in big chunks of hard clay.

Pleased to see that the water has mostly now drained away. The lightly disced land is going to travel 10x better than the ploughed. I went and looked at some untouched stubbles, which actually walked very well. They are due to be experimented on with spring direct drilling. Well, apart from the puddles.

Right-arm fast · Jan 16, 2016

static said:
In a decent hot summer, we would typically get cracks deep and wide enough to see the backfill along the drains. We have stopped subsoiling as most years are either a) too wet at depth or b) so dry you pull the soil up in big chunks of hard clay.

Pleased to see that the water has mostly now drained away. The lightly disced land is going to travel 10x better than the ploughed. I went and looked at some untouched stubbles, which actually walked very well. They are due to be experimented on with spring direct drilling. Well, apart from the puddles.

We are hoping that moving to DD will help with drainage as the soil self structures a bit. Whether this will reduce cracking I don't know. The cover crops are so well drained I've been in and sprayed off some of the ones that have got too big despite all the rain. I was amazed how well it went.

Right-arm fast · Jan 16, 2016

bactosoil said:
Agree like others have said if you leave the land the water will run down cracks and not get trapped in the organicy tilthy glue the shallow dicing made.

The organic tilthy glue will be down to biology in the soil, far more so than the mode of operation

After subsoiling various parts of the farm prior to drilling over the last few years I disagree.

bactosoil · Jan 16, 2016

All soils will behave differently but increased biology can have a very real effect on infiltration in all soils and happens far quicker than you would think .How many times has anyone dug a hole in saturated soil and found dry soil close to the surface ? these layers are no where near the subsoilers depth of operation

martian · Jan 17, 2016

static said:
Any evidence, anecdotal will do, that the more I leave the soil be the more readily it will crack and self structure?

Last year the very shallow discing then drilling worked really well, but this last lot of rain is making me look a bit silly with the ploughed land taking the water much better.

Brother is now sad that we didnt subsoil the headlands at least, but I am trying to stick with my guns that by leaving the soil be it will more readily sort itself out.

It's always worth reading/rereading this little gem:
https://www.exapta.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Biology-Soil-Compaction.pdf

Acke · Jan 22, 2016

After 3 years strict DD without any till at all. We get from huge cracks dry years on cultivated land to not any crack at all!The soil is heavy clay with 4-6% OM.

franklin · Apr 30, 2016

Has bucked up a bit now. Very little weeds coming through either grassweeds or BLWs.

I know I shouldnt, but this field is going back to OSR next year and I *promise* to DD it with some kind of disc drill.

Soil is noticeably firmer and less sticky on the boot than the ploughed. Have to admit the ploughed looks a bit ahead and that touch lusher. Am going to get some tissue tests done on both when the weather warms up. Currently got some purple tipping again after the recent snow and hail.

Surgery · May 1, 2016

A

static said:
Has bucked up a bit now. Very little weeds coming through either grassweeds or BLWs.

I know I shouldnt, but this field is going back to OSR next year and I *promise* to DD it with some kind of disc drill.

Soil is noticeably firmer and less sticky on the boot than the ploughed. Have to admit the ploughed looks a bit ahead and that touch lusher. Am going to get some tissue tests done on both when the weather warms up. Currently got some purple tipping again after the recent snow and hail.

Are you just off the wolds , can I see them in the back ground ?

York · May 2, 2016

static said:
Has bucked up a bit now. Very little weeds coming through either grassweeds or BLWs.

I know I shouldnt, but this field is going back to OSR next year and I *promise* to DD it with some kind of disc drill.

Soil is noticeably firmer and less sticky on the boot than the ploughed. Have to admit the ploughed looks a bit ahead and that touch lusher. Am going to get some tissue tests done on both when the weather warms up. Currently got some purple tipping again after the recent snow and hail.

looking forward to see results of tissue sample. Hope you don't mind.
Can you share picture of a "soil view"?
York-Th.

franklin · May 3, 2016

Surgery said:
A

Are you just off the wolds , can I see them in the back ground ?

That is the "cliff" in the background - a limestone escarpement running from Scunthorpe to Lincoln. This view looks towards the cliff at Hemswell.

York said:
looking forward to see results of tissue sample. Hope you don't mind.
Can you share picture of a "soil view"?
York-Th.

Yup, will do.

Will be taking tissue samples later this week and ahead of the already planned next fungicide application.

Clay Soils Cracking

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