What implement for mechanical glyphosate

matttargett4 · Jun 27, 2016

hi,

So I read increasing amounts about the negatives of glyphosate and the more I experience cover crops and reduced disturbance drilling or strip till or anything other than max till the more I realise I use quite a bit of roundup.

On my soils I also find when drilling maize in May if I don't get rain between drilling and emergence the soil hardens to the point that the seedlings struggle to emerge from under even a relatively small knob, anything the size of a 50p is a problem.

Please don't tell me I have not enough residue and the soil is to wet when I am drilling, I drilled maize on June 1st this yr ffs.

So anyway I was thinking of the mechanical glyphosate option and what I have read York mention about the at is to kill not to till and max 2 inches and with the exception of a roto tiller I cannot think what else will work.

I like the idea as they are great at pulverising green material and working shallow to make fine tilth and I think it would benefit emergence but I can't get away from the idea that I'm going out with the ultimate horizontal tillage pan making device to germinate every weed seed in the field and think it seems a bit of a backward step.

Anybody got any thoughts?

beardface · Jun 28, 2016

When I was in the states some farmers had a machine that looked a bit like a very shallow flat lift with very wide wings. I asked what it was and apparently they use it to kill weeds. The idea being is it lifts and cuts the roots of weeds which then dry out and die, whilst the surface remains relatively undisturbed

Dockers · Jun 28, 2016

Currently, drying out may be a bit of a problem !!

SilliamWhale · Jun 28, 2016

matttargett4 said:
hi,

So I read increasing amounts about the negatives of glyphosate and the more I experience cover crops and reduced disturbance drilling or strip till or anything other than max till the more I realise I use quite a bit of roundup.

On my soils I also find when drilling maize in May if I don't get rain between drilling and emergence the soil hardens to the point that the seedlings struggle to emerge from under even a relatively small knob, anything the size of a 50p is a problem.

Please don't tell me I have not enough residue and the soil is to wet when I am drilling, I drilled maize on June 1st this yr ffs.

So anyway I was thinking of the mechanical glyphosate option and what I have read York mention about the at is to kill not to till and max 2 inches and with the exception of a roto tiller I cannot think what else will work.

I like the idea as they are great at pulverising green material and working shallow to make fine tilth and I think it would benefit emergence but I can't get away from the idea that I'm going out with the ultimate horizontal tillage pan making device to germinate every weed seed in the field and think it seems a bit of a backward step.

Anybody got any thoughts?

what is quite a bit of glyphosate?

Dan Powell · Jun 28, 2016

Ring cutter:
http://quartermaine-agri.co.uk/black-grass-cultivator

Glyph-o-mulch

Geohobel (rotavator thingy)

Shallow plough:

Or just grow permanent pasture.

I don't think there is an easy answer here!

Simon C · Jun 28, 2016

Good effort Dan, unfortunately with the exception of the plough which is not "working in heavy soils", they are all min-till cultivators, otherwise known as mud making machines around these parts.

Dan Powell · Jun 28, 2016

Simon C said:
Good effort Dan, unfortunately with the exception of the plough which is not "working in heavy soils", they are all min-till cultivators, otherwise known as mud making machines around these parts.

Yup like I said no easy answers. It might work on my free draining stuff though.

matttargett4 · Jun 28, 2016

How much glyphosate? I need a clean up every time I grow a cover crop and then a selective in crop to keep control.

If I don't grow a cover crop I need a clean up for the winter annuals so I figure I may as well grow a cover crop, yes I can graze it but grazing it to the dirt at exactly the right time before planting a crop when the weather is being awkward isn't very practical.

Am I the only one thinking a rotovator with a piggy back drill isn't really no till?

I guess I need to find a cover crop that doesn't re grow that can establish quick enough to shade out the weeds and then can be flailed.

Winter beans?

SilliamWhale · Jun 28, 2016

matttargett4 said:
How much glyphosate? I need a clean up every time I grow a cover crop and then a selective in crop to keep control.

If I don't grow a cover crop I need a clean up for the winter annuals so I figure I may as well grow a cover crop, yes I can graze it but grazing it to the dirt at exactly the right time before planting a crop when the weather is being awkward isn't very practical.

Am I the only one thinking a rotovator with a piggy back drill isn't really no till?

I guess I need to find a cover crop that doesn't re grow that can establish quick enough to shade out the weeds and then can be flailed.

Winter beans?

How about looking at glyphosate use another way. Use in 12 month intervals give or take when sowing a winter crop after a winter crop and use in 18 month intervals when growing a spring crop after a winter crop. And then when growing a winter crop after a spring crop try and have a crack at using no glyphosate at all and see what happens.

So for example lets say you grow WW/Spring Barley/WOSR/WW/Maize or something. You can maybe find a way of using glyphosate as little as 3 times in that 5 year cycle. ie not between wosr and spring barley and maybe even not between wosr and wheat. It would take guts and an extra reliance on contact grass killers.

Another way to look at is 3 years grass in 10 years cropping and to reduce the reliance

matttargett4 · Jun 28, 2016

I guess that's a good point, to an extent you can rotate out its use, the problem with these sort of rigid rotations across all the acres we have is there are always exceptions and typically they end up as near permanent grass which increase reliance on other acres to grow annuals which limits their ability to improve and benefit from things like reduced chemical use.

But even in a straight wheat maize rotation which is the dirtiest thing we do it's still only glyphosate every other year.

Is that bad?

rob1 · Jun 29, 2016

How about a propane burner type thing,there was one I saw somewhere. perhaps a infra red heater to burn it off and the slugs at the same time

matttargett4 · Jun 29, 2016

In the last few weeks I think we could just block the ditches up and drown cover crop slugs weeds and all!

yellow belly · Jul 11, 2016

matttargett4 said:
In the last few weeks I think we could just block the ditches up and drown cover crop slugs weeds and all!

and the worms

What implement for mechanical glyphosate

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