Companion for lucerne

Simon C

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Essex Coast
I have been growing lucerne for a few years now for Dengie Crop Driers who sell it into the horse feed market. They want to experiment with growing some grasses in with the lucerne to improve the nutritional content of the finished product. On it's own , it is too higher nitrogen for horses and so has to be diluted with oat straw.

Everyone round hear struggles with blackgrass and so they are all afraid that there will be no way or controlling it in the lucerne crop without killing the grass as well. Well the fact is that since Gramozone was banned, the standard Reglone and Kerb, winter treatment is not working anyway and it is going to seed between each of the three spring/summer cuts.

I have also been growing rye grass for seed and after two harvests, fields seem to be pretty well free of blackgrass when they go back into the arable rotation. I am thinking that a mix of lucerne and a few different grasses is going to be much more competitive and be better for the soil as well.

So, I would like any suggestions as to what to put in the mix, Timothy, Cocksfoot etc, and at what sort of seed rates. It will be Spring drilled, end of April of May, but we need to be careful that one species does not out compete the others.

@Barleycorn I think you grow lucerne in your organic system, do you mix it with anything else. I want to keep this a virtually zero input crop, so grasses will have to scavenge what N they can.

@Cotswold Seeds have a bit about this in your catalogue, anything you would like to add.
 
over here we see prairie grass put in with it. This used to be common practice for when the lucerne stand gets a bit tired.

These days though a lot of lucerne stands are sown with grass in the mix.

Lucerne normally sown at 10 - 12 kg per ha so if the grass was sown at 4 kg the lucerne might be at 8 kg/ha
 

Simon C

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Essex Coast
over here we see prairie grass put in with it. This used to be common practice for when the lucerne stand gets a bit tired.

These days though a lot of lucerne stands are sown with grass in the mix.

Lucerne normally sown at 10 - 12 kg per ha so if the grass was sown at 4 kg the lucerne might be at 8 kg/ha
Thanks for the seed rates. Not sure what you mean by prairie grass?
 

Simon C

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Essex Coast
I would let the lucerne establish in year 1 then over sow with perennial rye and white clover.
sowing a pure stand for the first two winters lets you control grass weeds better than doing it in the first year.

Prairie grass - Pasture Info - Massey University
pastureinfo.massey.ac.nz/grasspages/gprairiegrass.html

Thank you both, the thing is Dengie want me to grow a more balanced feed, so the mix will have to all come up together. I think it is the seed rates and balance of the mix that needs to be got right, otherwise one may dominate early on. I undersow rye grass in spring barley and after harvest there doesn't look to be much grass at all, but by the next year, there is a complete cover, so I am thinking quite low rates to give everything it's own space to get going.
 

Andrew K

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Essex
Thank you both, the thing is Dengie want me to grow a more balanced feed, so the mix will have to all come up together. I think it is the seed rates and balance of the mix that needs to be got right, otherwise one may dominate early on. I undersow rye grass in spring barley and after harvest there doesn't look to be much grass at all, but by the next year, there is a complete cover, so I am thinking quite low rates to give everything it's own space to get going.
Simon,
Could be worth discussing with Michael S, he has done a bit of undersowing of PRG in various crops in the past in Essex?
 

BSH

Member
BASE UK Member
I grew lucerne a few years ago and grew the recomended companion grass that Cotswold recomended, but in hind sight wished I had planted cocksfoot. I have read other references that promoted cocksfoot as an ideal companion. My main issue was lack of grass in subsequent cuts. Cocksfoot regrows quickly and you wouldnt be cutting it too short. I have grown a lot of cocksfoot in other leys and really like it on my light ground. I think you should have a serious look at it as a companion.
 

Simon C

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Essex Coast
We have decided to do a trial by drilling a whole field with Lucerne and then over drill with different strips of Timothy, Cocksfoot and Fescue and mixes of these. I am the guinea pig for all the rest of the Dengie growers and hopefully we will then be able to grow a better product to sell into the equestrian market
 

AG Tim

Member
The rye grass tends to set seeds in stages where the lucerne isnt mature enough (early flowering for hay) to harvest. That whas our experience of a mixture of 20% late rye grass varietys, with 60% lucerne and 10% White Clover at 15kg/ha seeded into triticale stubble short after harvest.

The Clover should only fill the gaps - but dyed out in the first year, as lucerne and raygrass whas a too dominant canopy all the time - with more cutting and grazing like raygrass/Clover swards it could compete, but the later cutting due to lucerne whas killing it. Even the higher cut with 10cm stubble let some lucerne leafes at the bottom overlive that it whas really fast in rew growing. With the First year of experience and the Idea to dry the lucerne to hay (normaly cut it for silage) for milking cows we also detached the conditioner on a mower to keep the leaves on the plants, but after two years the lucerne desappeared more and more. When we break down the Crop to continue with combinables cropping we had huge problems with field mice populations. So we never tried it again.

Would also think Timothy is the Best partner as it is late and wont dominate that canopy like rye grass.
 

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