Building a dwelling house on the farm ...

suffolksmallholder said:

I've not seen this method, although I would like to try. Porch was all timber with sterling board inserted before the insulated plasterboard for fixing purposes. I must admit I'm still a fan of thermal mass hence blockwork. Plus the forgotten part; SILENCE.
Brickwork in Flemish bond as the outside skin. I still have a cavity as I'm in an exposed area. (good enough for big windmills) Modern building regulations require all this to withstand 120mph winds. I had one nervous monemt a couple of years ago before the main roof went on..... but I'd put in two big piers for structural & aesthetic purposes and they did their job.
SS

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Stick 4wall panels in your preferred search engine.
They've been wind strength tested to allegedly withstand equivalent of 1000mph winds! It's only the roof I'd be concerned about, and we are pretty exposed.
They are something like 100x stronger than timber frame and are able to carry concrete panel flooring.
100% waterproof even before rendering.
We're going for an insulated render system as belt and braces to stop any potential cold bridging.

Only negatives I've found so far are the panels only come in standard sizes so multiples of 1/2 brick in width (Not much of an issue) and 2.4m height (plus sizes to fit under windows obviously).
Also it currently sits on a timber soleplate the same as timber frame. Now obviously this is a tried and tested method with timber frame, but I feel being as the 4wall panels have moved the game on significantly from timber frame, the timber soleplate needs to come up to the same standard. However I say this as a layman with no specific qualification to make this assertion!

@Poorbuthappy Thanks for the info. I'll look closer this evening. Just having a tea break away from wackering some of the outside area.
SS

How practical would it be to have all the plumbing in some sort of duct? Just had to pull floor boards up to fix a leak

multi power said:

How practical would it be to have all the plumbing in some sort of duct? Just had to pull floor boards up to fix a leak View attachment 505402

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We plumbed ours in plastic and where pipes went through the insulation under the floor screed we put it in a larger plastic conduit so that it could be pulled through and replaced in the futore if necessary.

i.e the grey water pipe is in the larger black conduit in the photo below. So when the insulation, underfloor heating and screed went on top they could be replaced without (too much) grief if necessary.

Poorbuthappy said:

Block walls are so 20th C.
We're using a new type of SIP which is basically very dense insulation sandwiched between two magnesium oxide render boards. It's U value is far better than cavity wall with 100mm of celotex. Air tighteness exceeding passive house.

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I very nearly had a SIP roof but the company was purchased and they withdrew from there quote and the company they passed me on to wanted double I got the same result U value and air tight it was more work but less than even the first company. With a traditional roof it still had 2 massive 12meter long gluelam beams in it....only 25% was frames my ridge and a few sections of 2 gables ends the rest my chippy did. Even with the extra labour to insulate it it cost less to do than SIP.

The only negative I see to SIP is the very light internal structure which offers very little internal thermal mass, thermal mass gives off stored heat over time I bit like the old storage radiators used to do.
It can be a great thing if used correctly.
I say correctly because large thermal mass also take time to heat up so it depends on how your heating your house if your going for high output radiators then low thermal mass mean a quick response time to heat added but also quick (relativly) cooling when the heating goes off.
Large thermal mass works best with underfloor heating as it works with the system to give off heat over long intervals.

For anyone going down underfloor heating on second floors that are on chipboard subfloors consider dry screed and Latts This can help with thermal mass and is also very cheap, but it does force you to insulate the underside of your second floor
This unlabelled diagram shows what I did insulation under the floor the site floor which were the all weather 22mm water proof chip boards glued and screwed as the house was going up. Then timber batterns then I installed the underfloor pipe runs clipping them down to the site floor semi dry screed over them, then I glued and screwed 10mm ply over the lot, no expensive or special insulations. When I say glue I mean 100% coverage of floor area to remove any possible squeaks.....
Tip hire an unwinding dolly which you put the big rolls of underfloor heating pipes, also note you may be asked to take runs from part roles on the layout plan......say your floor needs 3 big rolls run 1-3 maybe from roll 1 but so might run 5-6 as they make max use of each roll it's not recommended to join underfloor pipes.......
You start at the floors inlet manifold which you connect then lay the run and end at the outlet manifold. Only cut the pipe when you have it 100% fixed down after the first run you will find it very simple ideally you need 2 people one to put a few clips in as you go the other to position the pipes.

Another thing to watch is the design of the underfloor if your fitting say ground source heat pump, the underfloor systems are rated from 1-5 stars (for the green deal payments)this massively effects your payments from the 7 year green deal you get back, and how well the system works. 5 star is best as normal this means it's got a very high efficiency rating in practice it means more pipework at closer centres. Which is easy to plan for. And cost very little extra to do.
So if your asked tell them you want a design that will garentee 5 star rating....
for me the net result is my underfloor heating runs all day, when I have it on at all, the heat pump that heats it runs 1-6 times a day 10-30 min at a time I have no room controllers the heat pump does it all it monitors the water temperature in the underfloor heating system and the external air temprature and adjusts the water temprature needed in my underfloor systems automaticly using a simple heat curve. I find it's often only 24-27c to give a room temp of 22c even in very cold weather I have never seen it over 28c even on the coldest nights.

multi power said:

How practical would it be to have all the plumbing in some sort of duct? Just had to pull floor boards up to fix a leak View attachment 505402

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I'd be interested to know what was the cause of said leak? Poor soldered joint, pulled joint (unusual in a duct) poor quality copper pipe. Or was it the plastic one where rodents had a meal?
SS

@Poorbuthappy
Interesting, the Tribus method. Thanks. I like the idea it can be skinned with anything!
SS

suffolksmallholder said:

I'd be interested to know what was the cause of said leak? Poor soldered joint, pulled joint (unusual in a duct) poor quality copper pipe. Or was it the plastic one where rodents had a meal?
SS

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Poor quality pipe , and too much water pressure , have had quite a few leaks, all on the line feeding header tank, no leaks on the gravity side, last time i replaced half the pipe under the floor, today replaced the rest of the length, should have done it all the last time but was too lazy to take up any more floor boards
House less than ten years old

multi power said:

Poor quality pipe , and too much water pressure , have had quite a few leaks, all on the line feeding header tank, no leaks on the gravity side, last time i replaced half the pipe under the floor, today replaced the rest of the length, should have done it all the last time but was too lazy to take up any more floor boards
House less than ten years old

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Are you an a private water supply? Acidic water in these parts can eat copper pipe and tanks for breakfast. We tested ours and had to put in a pH correction unit; no issues so far but then we used plastic mostly. Neighbour is constantly replacing copper pipes due to corrosion.

Farfrae said:

Are you an a private water supply? Acidic water in these parts can eat copper pipe and tanks for breakfast. We tested ours and had to put in a pH correction unit; no issues so far but then we used plastic mostly. Neighbour is constantly replacing copper pipes due to corrosion.

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Yes acidic borehole water

multi power said:

Yes acidic borehole water

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http://www.cleanwaterstore.com/resource/how-to-guides/how-to-treat-acid-well-water/
I assume you may be using something like this, but now and then it catches you out between refills and you get problems.
It's not something I have had as a problem, ( I am in a hard water area) but I could see how you would want easy to replace pipes. It still seems prevention is cheaper than the cure and ducted pipe runs only help with plastic in straight runs.
If you have you could lay, say a large water pipe the blue stuff then thread your plastic pipe run in it. I had some of my 32mm internal diameter pipe I used for my house water supply and used it as a duct run in my cinema room for cables it ended up with a hdmi cable and a digital audio cable for my subwoofer in it. It was not planned for needing it but I could see it would give me more options and keep the room cable free if I did, in your case if it's is possible to get a long run into it it would also trap any leaks from that pipe and give you possibly a way to see if it starts to leak at the low end of the duct you put in. Just watch the bends it may not be possible to bend the duct pipe very much and still thread your pipe past it. If you have a sharp bend it may pay to restart the duct at that point and make an easy access in your floor at that point and use a normal joiner to make the bend up.
You would also have to use the long rolls of easyfit water pipe in your diy ducting....so no joints at all.in the duct run.

Dave645 said:

http://www.cleanwaterstore.com/resource/how-to-guides/how-to-treat-acid-well-water/
I assume you may be using something like this, but now and then it catches you out between refills and you get problems.
It's not something I have had as a problem, ( I am in a hard water area) but I could see how you would want easy to replace pipes. It still seems prevention is cheaper than the cure and ducted pipe runs only help with plastic in straight runs.
If you have you could lay, say a large water pipe the blue stuff then thread your plastic pipe run in it. I had some of my 32mm internal diameter pipe I used for my house water supply and used it as a duct run in my cinema room for cables it ended up with a hdmi cable and a digital audio cable for my subwoofer in it. It was not planned for needing it but I could see it would give me more options and keep the room cable free if I did, in your case if it's is possible to get a long run into it it would also trap any leaks from that pipe and give you possibly a way to see if it starts to leak at the low end of the duct you put in. Just watch the bends it may not be possible to bend the duct pipe very much and still thread your pipe past it. If you have a sharp bend it may pay to restart the duct at that point and make an easy access in your floor at that point and use a normal joiner to make the bend up.
You would also have to use the long rolls of easyfit water pipe in your diy ducting....so no joints at all.in the duct run.

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Not using any thing to treat the water, when I build my own house i will be using blue water pipe, i like your idea of easy access place at joints/bends etc