Grass Leys and DD
- Thread starter Wigeon
- Start date
2yr ryegrass into chopped wheat straw. Vaderstad using just the coulters. No fert. Topped for weed control to comply with greening. Very low income in year one as it was there for a EFA purpose. Latterly made some silage. This was the experiment but now rolled out, but used situationally rater than rotationally. Followed by wheat which we cultivated for. Next year linseed which has also been lightly cultivated. Dont underestimate what a mess some sheep can make of the top inch or two of clay in just 2 months with low rainfall! Not certain of the OM increase if you are taking silage off it unless spreading muck back on. Certainly better than crappy beans.
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Still scratching my head over how to turn the grass into profit though. Made some haylage; fed some to cows; had some sheep come and graze what was left over. But even with a horde of metal detectorists each paying a tenner, I dont think the grass will pay a cash profit after rent is paid. So it had better add to the intangibles:
a) somewhere to spread muck / digestate / lime / gypsum at times inconvenient for others,
b) extending the rotation to produce better yields,
c) for those who are not 100% DD, a 4yr ley mole-ploughed and cultivated in June gives a great OSR entry, and clear reduction in slug pellets, graminicides etc.
d) dont need to grow beans!
a) somewhere to spread muck / digestate / lime / gypsum at times inconvenient for others,
b) extending the rotation to produce better yields,
c) for those who are not 100% DD, a 4yr ley mole-ploughed and cultivated in June gives a great OSR entry, and clear reduction in slug pellets, graminicides etc.
d) dont need to grow beans!
Most profitable crop on our farm. If wheat fails all we loose is money if grass fails we need to buy feed in for 500 cattle all winter and 700 sheep through Jan and Feb which would be quite expensive
ollie989898
Member
As you say, a superb entry to OSR and any pesky ryegrass can be kerbed out.
ollie989898
Member
Also, beware of just how much you can push IRG about when you are talking about blackgrass. I have seen patches where the establishment of the grass was not ideal and the blackgrass came on strong later on and literally swamped the grass out.
I truly believe you need 3 years in grass minimum to beat a serious blackgrass problem- obviously it is an annual so you can stop it seeding, but more importantly any dormant seeds under the ground are supposedly unable to survive much longer than a few years down there, it is a different beast to wild oats.
Active management of IRG and cutting leys is key. Cut it and feed it. Looking too strong in the winter after establishment? Get the sheep on it. The more you attack it, the harder you are making life for the blackgrass- it's only an annual. The ryegrasses aren't.
Keep your seed rate at 16kg/acre, not less. It is generally a huge seed and some mixtures and varieties are particularly poor in the ground cover stakes. All of my shorter term cutting mixtures are sown at this rate, if it's late after maize or beans it's 18kg/acre (obviously reduce where clover or lots of diploid is used).
And watch for slugs. They will attack grass just as soon as they will attack your OSR and wheat.
I truly believe you need 3 years in grass minimum to beat a serious blackgrass problem- obviously it is an annual so you can stop it seeding, but more importantly any dormant seeds under the ground are supposedly unable to survive much longer than a few years down there, it is a different beast to wild oats.
Active management of IRG and cutting leys is key. Cut it and feed it. Looking too strong in the winter after establishment? Get the sheep on it. The more you attack it, the harder you are making life for the blackgrass- it's only an annual. The ryegrasses aren't.
Keep your seed rate at 16kg/acre, not less. It is generally a huge seed and some mixtures and varieties are particularly poor in the ground cover stakes. All of my shorter term cutting mixtures are sown at this rate, if it's late after maize or beans it's 18kg/acre (obviously reduce where clover or lots of diploid is used).
And watch for slugs. They will attack grass just as soon as they will attack your OSR and wheat.
mikep
Member
- Location
- Arse end of Surrey, UK
Why IRG especially when looking at more than one year the only advantage of it really is rapid production of vegatative growth with 150 units N.
It's fine for huge silage cuts and some grazing but being only ever a sheep man I would insist any new grass was free of all rye grass.
If you look at its disadvantages it seems not fit for purpose in an arable rotation.
Poor ground cover especially year 2 on
Needs large inputs
Doesn't leave a lot behind.
Waste of time and money adding clover.
If I was doing 3 yr let here it would be Timothy and fescues with kww clover, the Timothy gives some bulk and the fescues fill in the bottom. Great for grazing and if cutting would add a bit of sweet vernal for the wonderful scent (true romantic).
It's fine for huge silage cuts and some grazing but being only ever a sheep man I would insist any new grass was free of all rye grass.
If you look at its disadvantages it seems not fit for purpose in an arable rotation.
Poor ground cover especially year 2 on
Needs large inputs
Doesn't leave a lot behind.
Waste of time and money adding clover.
If I was doing 3 yr let here it would be Timothy and fescues with kww clover, the Timothy gives some bulk and the fescues fill in the bottom. Great for grazing and if cutting would add a bit of sweet vernal for the wonderful scent (true romantic).
Timothy establishment vs BG is not good.
Best rooting and happiness in cold and damp would be tall fescue. Unsure what beasts would make of it.
Cows currently munching through the PRG haylage, although we now have enough for several years it would seem.
Ideally, I would do 4 years grass, 4 years arable.
Best rooting and happiness in cold and damp would be tall fescue. Unsure what beasts would make of it.
Cows currently munching through the PRG haylage, although we now have enough for several years it would seem.
Ideally, I would do 4 years grass, 4 years arable.
Festulolium type for potentially best of both?
- Location
- Welshpool Powys
What drill have you got there?
Weaving gd 4m mounted
mikep
Member
- Location
- Arse end of Surrey, UK
In the dim distant past I recall seeing a paper on grass species growth and palatability. The best grass for low input was Yorkshire fog ( holcus molis?) It grew fast covered ground well and needed little fertiliser, if it was grazed tight it produced well but the problem was as it approaches heading the palatibility went west faster than most. There was talk of a breeding programme for it but I suppose fertiliser was too cheap to make it worthwhile.
holcus iantus?
holcus mollis is different. iantus is the one with the shaggy seed heads that go a nice purple and make the hay look pretty.
I always thought that rooting depth and cutting were linked, hence I dont like to see new grass shaved to nothing. On a four year cycle, I would be aiming to take one massive and quite late cut for haylage and either a second late cut or some light grazing.
Could be. Would have to make sure seed price wasnt horrible!
holcus mollis is different. iantus is the one with the shaggy seed heads that go a nice purple and make the hay look pretty.
I always thought that rooting depth and cutting were linked, hence I dont like to see new grass shaved to nothing. On a four year cycle, I would be aiming to take one massive and quite late cut for haylage and either a second late cut or some light grazing.
Could be. Would have to make sure seed price wasnt horrible!
- Location
- Welshpool Powys
Direct drill mix I've had made by hurrells seeds
Containing lofa festololium and Gemini Italian ryegrass plus Roy perennial ryegrass
- Location
- Cornwall.
I've never heard of Roy I can't see it's listed what were the reasons for choosing it?
- Location
- Welshpool Powys
It's unique to hurrells
Will Blackburn
Member
- Location
- Cheshire
Roy is the guy who swept out the shed and bagged it up.