Damp in old farm house

Sir loin · Nov 21, 2017

Live in a house built 1870,s so no cavity. Walls are at least 2 feet thick. The house has had lime pointing removed and cement pointing replacing it but we still get damp coming through the walls as stonework is sandstone. Is there anything you can personally recommend that I can spray/paint walls with externally to waterproof the walls to prevent damp coming through.

milkloss · Nov 21, 2017

Not sure using cement pointing was a good move but I’m not too knowledgable on that stuff. We use Johnson’s waterproofer on our single skin cottage, makes it loads warmer too. Spray it on with a cheap 5l sprayer.

curlietailz · Nov 22, 2017

Hi Sir Loin
We have a few old cottages exactly the same, 2' thick solid sandstone .

The point is, they are supposed to breathe..... Water soaks in or up and evaporates out..... Lime pointing and plaster are meant to be used as the lime attracts moisture from the sandstone and evaprates it outside..... If you cement it / use moisture repellent surface or cement/waterproof plaster then that doesn't happen, the sandstones retain the moisture and the stones rot and crumble away....

I'd advise repointing with lime mortar and putting a false wall/vapour barrier/insulation/ventilation holes on the inside of the walls...... That way the old stones breathe in and out, but your internal walls are dry and the decorating stays on the wall !

Jameshenry · Nov 22, 2017

Stonetone plus 10 , mate of mine did his cottage with it and cured the damp problem , and apparently still lets stonework breathe

PSQ · Nov 22, 2017

Make sure the gutters, down pipes and drains are in good order, and that any soil levels around the house are at least lower than floor level (dig a trench if needs be).
As mentioned above, good lime pointing. We tried a few builders before we found one that knew how to *properly* point with non hydraulic lime. Where one ‘builder’ used cement pointing the stone is rotting around it.
Old stone houses need to breathe, end of.

7610 super q · Nov 22, 2017

Errrr............yes, but, there isn't much wall breathing going on here in crapweathershire. It hasn't stopped raining for 3 years. The skills to do a good job with lime pointing/ rendering are thin on the ground. You also need to whitewash yearly, if you want the house to look nice.
Some parts of our house date back to the 15th C. Walls up to 4 feet thick, no damp proof coarse, and built into a bank. 3 dehumidifiers running round the clock, and not making much impression.
10 fireplaces, so I'm guessing if all these were lit, problems would be solved. Not got time for faffing about with fires with a one man band operation though.

What's needed is a 1976 type summer. Every year.

Pilgrimmick · Nov 22, 2017

7610 super q said:
Errrr............yes, but, there isn't much wall breathing going on here in crapweathershire. It hasn't stopped raining for 3 years. The skills to do a good job with lime pointing/ rendering are thin on the ground. You also need to whitewash yearly, if you want the house to look nice.
Some parts of our house date back to the 15th C. Walls up to 4 feet thick, no damp proof coarse, and built into a bank. 3 dehumidifiers running round the clock, and not making much impression.
10 fireplaces, so I'm guessing if all these were lit, problems would be solved. Not got time for faffing about with fires with a one man band operation though.
What's needed is a 1976 type summer. Every year.

Obviously you do not need to faff about with the fires, just tell the butler to get one of the maids to do it! Not rocket science!

haulmblower · Nov 22, 2017

PSQ said:
Make sure the gutters, down pipes and drains are in good order, and that any soil levels around the house are at least lower than floor level (dig a trench if needs be).
As mentioned above, good lime pointing. We tried a few builders before we found one that knew how to *properly* point with non hydraulic lime. Where one ‘builder’ used cement pointing the stone is rotting around it.
Old stone houses need to breathe, end of.

It's amazing how soil builds up around a house over the years. Before you do anything else do this please.
I have seen personally how much improvement this can make

Land Rover · Nov 22, 2017

I feel your pain , exactly the same house set up here .
From my own struggles the 3 big things that wanted looked at were :
1) Loft ventilation - originally the roofing felt would have been breathable horse hair , modern felt is bitumen and non breathable . Get some roof or ridge vents in , this is where the house breathes .
2) Underfloor ventilation , or lack of . Only 1 ground floor room had under floor ventilation . The rest were completely unventilated , although some evidence of old vents existed .
3) Penetrating damp from ground around the house , leaking gutters and high ground levels . Albeit the toilet waste pipe suggests that the ground level has always been above ( well since the khasi was installed at some point ) joist and floor level .

Kevtherev · Nov 22, 2017

Any earth up around house?
Damp comes up through the floors old stone houses need to breathe.

Dry Rot · Nov 22, 2017

The first task is to work out where the damp is coming from.

We had the house from hell in the Scottish islands. In wet windy weather, water would actually be running down the inside walls. Tried all the above to no effect. The house was sold and bought by the local plumber who had failed to cure the problem before he bought it! Guess what happened next!

The answer was blocked down pipes from roof guttering. Either that, or the soakaways to the down pipes were not sufficient to let the water away. The gutters would then fill with water in a storm and the wind would then blow this up under the slates where it would find it's way into the walls.

7610 super q · Nov 22, 2017

Dry Rot said:
The first task is to work out where the damp is coming from.

We had the house from hell in the Scottish islands. In wet windy weather, water would actually be running down the inside walls. Tried all the above to no effect. The house was sold and bought by the local plumber who had failed to cure the problem before he bought it! Guess what happened next!

The answer was blocked down pipes from roof guttering. Either that, or the soakaways to the down pipes were not sufficient to let the water away. The gutters would then fill with water in a storm and the wind would then blow this up under the slates where it would find it's way into the walls.

Just noticed this outside now. Torrential rain for an hour, and the modern plastic gutters put up by a previous owner just aren't coping.
You really need to walk round the house during a downpour to see what's going on......

renewablejohn · Nov 22, 2017

You really need to understand how this type of wall structure works and then you will end up with a dry warm house. Mine is an old farmhouse similar wall construction to yours but about 200 years older. As others have said the whole idea is the walls breath so no modern cements or thistle plasters only lime mortar and lime plasters. With breathable natural paints or lime wash instead of emulsions and gloss. Our house had "rising damp" 4ft up the walls which the mortgage company where insisting we treat with an injected damp course. Fortunately with the aid of English Heritage we enlightened the mortgage company into the real problem that the plaster had been taken down to the ground therefore creating a moisture bridge. Just by exposing the first 9 inches of stone and repointing with lime mortar the "rising damp" disappeared. Other areas of damp have been due to modern plaster which when stripped off and replaced with lime plaster the damp has disappeared.
Barn conversion next door has been pointed with modern cement and the stone is exploding badly, thankfully ours is lime mortar. Could not find a builder who new anything about Lime so went on a course at Ty Mawr which I would recommend to anyone with an old house with this type of construction. Even if you dont use the skills yourself at least you know when a builder is trying to pull the wool over your eyes.

renewablejohn · Nov 22, 2017

Forgot to mention first job I would do is take out all the cement pointing and repoint with lime mortar. If you want to learn how to do lime mortar or just have a nosey your quite welcome to come and visit as we still have about a years worth of work to do before its all finished.

Ffermer Bach · Nov 22, 2017

I would recommend getting rid of all the cement pointing between the stone, then re pointing with NHL 3.5 hydraulic lime, also possibly hacking off inside and re plastering with NHL 2 hydraulic lime, and floors up (guessing they are concrete with plastic under?) and replacing with a limecrete floor (and expanded glass beads as insulation) and no dpc. All expensive, but I think far better than trying to "encase" the house in cement, which in the long run, will cause the stone work to spall and increase damp in the house. I am just starting on all that on my house at the moment, but installing external wall insulation (of cork), and a lime based breathable render over it, then the plan is to paint the wall with a breathable paint (all from Tymawr Lime near Brecon)

Woolgatherer · Nov 22, 2017

Ours is an old stone cottage, 4' walls, no damp course, no foundations, stone flags laid straight on the soil. We run a multi fuel stove and in the really cold weather we light the open fire in the bedroom. We keep the vents open on the windows, have natural underlay and carpets to help with the damp in the floors. We run a huge dehumidifier as well. We also lowered the ground level around the cottage. We try to work with the age of the house, use it the way it was built! Apart from having double glazing everything else is as it was built. That way we've managed to get rid of a pond in the middle of the sitting room, mushrooms under the beds and no longer have the wallpaper hung by staples! It's a waste of time trying to fight it and make it modern!

phillipe · Nov 22, 2017

There is a lot of tripe spoken about lime mortar and cement mortar,sandstone walls will breathe whatever you put in the joint,the problem you have is a bit of rising damp and condensation,central heating in a old house sucks the damp out of the walls ,cold wall hot air =condensation,probaly got nice new windows so no drafts or nobody leaving a window cra ked open to let the place breathe,i will get shouted down for decrying lime mortar but thats what i think,i live in a 300 year old house its rendered and painted outside and rendered and painted inside no lime mortar ahy where on the outside ,i have no damp .but i have ventalation and breathable felt ,always have windows open also having wood fies so dont put central heatin on much,i dont have the house two hot ,i have dug all the way round and french drained it so water has a way out,water will find the easist route so down and away little things help

renewablejohn · Nov 22, 2017

skinnyhoskins said:
There is a lot of tripe spoken about lime mortar and cement mortar,sandstone walls will breathe whatever you put in the joint,the problem you have is a bit of rising damp and condensation,central heating in a old house sucks the damp out of the walls ,cold wall hot air =condensation,probaly got nice new windows so no drafts or nobody leaving a window cra ked open to let the place breathe,i will get shouted down for decrying lime mortar but thats what i think,i live in a 300 year old house its rendered and painted outside and rendered and painted inside no lime mortar ahy where on the outside ,i have no damp .but i have ventalation and breathable felt ,always have windows open also having wood fies so dont put central heatin on much,i dont have the house two hot ,i have dug all the way round and french drained it so water has a way out,water will find the easist route so down and away little things help

Come to our house and I will show you the difference between lime mortar and cement mortar. The Barn next door was only renovated about 25 years ago with cement mortar and already the sandstone is shattering very badly and we have not had any really hard frosts recently. Upto the renovation the sandstone was in good condition.
As for drafts where trying to seal up as much as possible with 3G windows, Swedish doors, external fire vents but compensated by a MVHR system (with pollen filter)

Still Farming · Nov 22, 2017

Drafty cold old houses=no damp.
Stud partion or dry line inside best.
External cladding also way forward

bobk · Nov 22, 2017

Turn the f**kin heating on , houses don;t dry themselves .

Damp in old farm house

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