Is handling now permitted?

Dealer

Member
Location
Shropshire
I was not disputing the fact that he won the euros by not handling it was his general comment that most of what Harry says was rubbish his words


I don't believe I have ever met the man in person or seen him ploughing so I did a quick Google search

The 3rd item on the list was that match so I watched it. And was surprised at what I have seen.

I have no intention of defending anyone else's argument on here but thought it was necessary to show a point of fact that this video exists.

I have made my views known on here and that is enough yes I have picked straw and walked on my ins and outs as this is what I thought you did as my peers have done.

All this crap that goes on away from the field has curtailed my enthusiasm for the sport some what which is disappointing given the investment in time and money I have spent to get to an average standard. Of what started as a hobby to use the kit I had in the shed.
 

yellowbelly

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
N.Lincs
All this crap that goes on away from the field has curtailed my enthusiasm for the sport some what which is disappointing given the investment in time and money I have spent to get to an average standard. Of what started as a hobby to use the kit I had in the shed.
As an outsider, looking in, I can understand that.

I suspect anybody looking in here who had half an inkling to buy one of these....
images

....may well think better of it and just carry on with one of these....
images
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:
 

Dealer

Member
Location
Shropshire
Don't get me wrong I enjoy the days out made some new friends had a laugh and a joke ( sometimes at me).

It just the politics and personal stuff that taints it

Some times it even looks like I know what to do

We all push boundaries and rules in life but sport of any kind with known rules should be respected as courtesy to the sport and more importantly fellow competitors.

If you break the rules then you are cheating some are grey but the one in question is not as it states no handling of furrows, perhaps I am expecting to much. Who knows.
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
All this crap that goes on away from the field has curtailed my enthusiasm for the sport some what which is disappointing given the investment in time and money I have spent to get to an average standard. Of what started as a hobby to use the kit I had in the shed.

I have contributed to, read and reread all the threads on handling. At one time the substance of every thread was re directed to the handling issue.

I have ploughed throughout England, Scotland and Wales. I have however always ploughed to the rules applied on the day as have all those European winners amongst us, including the qualifying rounds. I have ploughed for at least 20 years. Let me tell you one very pertinent fact. NOTHING has changed. Nothing at all. The winners are all still winners, a fact that revolves around their will to win. The handlers are still handlers. I speak for the scruffy classes which by and large paint a reasonable picture of results with one or two notable exceptions among the establishment figures who judge. That has always been the same.

Social media does have a good side. Many newcomers and those wishing to improve have been helped on here. All this banging on about handling will not change things. I said earlier nothing has changed. The fact that it is in people’s conscience might well be a shift in mindset. On the ground nothing has changed.

It has not stopped the SOP doing whatever they please, stretching and manipulating by use of proxy votes - genuine or otherwise. Nothing has changed (apart from one significant change to the filed accounts with companies house).
It would appear that recently a dearth of Directors has arisen by stealth. Nothing has changed.

One thing that social media has done is cause division and bad feeling. A veritable furnace stoked by an army of keyboard warriors naming and shaming - nothing good has come out of it and yes you guessed - nothing has changed.

One of the good things I always took from ploughing was the vast number of genuine and good people involved. Nothing has changed. Just get on and plough. It’s still the same as ever it was. People always have had their own opinion. They always will. Nothing has changed.

If you are not happy with the rules or the score sheet, then make your own - apply them as you see fit. All of you at grass roots level just take a step back. There now - nothing has changed.

So nothing having changed - not even the fact that you don’t need to handle to produce a World / European beating plot. What’s the problem Harry. Might be nothing to do with handling. Could it be a simple vacuum of skill technique and funding. Free for all Aitch - ploughing for England next then?
 
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Dealer

Member
Location
Shropshire
Mr Howard. Nothing might have changed but that does not make I right

The constant thing that gets my goat up is that just because someone has not won at a higher level does not mean that their opinion does not count or have any more influence than someone that has

I may be a sh!t ploughman or a keyboard warrior in the eyes of the upper echelons but having a view on something is not exclusive to former champions.

As for sop or anything else they like anything else should be judged on what they do.

Having an opinion that is different than others is nothing new to me the one thing I have learnt is it does not help you get better scores
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
As an outsider, looking in, I can understand that.

I suspect anybody looking in here who had half an inkling to buy one of these....
images

....may well think better of it and just carry on with one of these....
images
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Wash your mouth out. Go the whole hog
804C97FF-8522-4C43-A418-F053968586E2.jpeg

Get thisen one o’these.

Many a poor ploughman suffered the taunt. “Ne’er mind owd lad - nowt that a good Power Harrow could not put to rights”.
 
Last edited:

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
As I believe you yourself mentioned, getting to the European was the hard bit, and uninhibited furrow manipulation would certainly help there.
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
Mr Howard. Nothing might have changed but that does not make I right

The constant thing that gets my goat up is that just because someone has not won at a higher level does not mean that their opinion does not count or have any more influence than someone that has

I may be a sh!t ploughman or a keyboard warrior in the eyes of the upper echelons but having a view on something is not exclusive to former champions.

As for sop or anything else they like anything else should be judged on what they do.

Having an opinion that is different than others is nothing new to me the one thing I have learnt is it does not help you get better scores

Nor was it necessarily right before any of us came along. Nor will I apologise for my viewpoint as a former champion. It is unfortunately the only one I have and you should respect that every bit as much as I respect your viewpoint.

The thing that has changed is your perception of things, possibly a crisis of confidence made even more incandescent on here by a certain significant other.

Please Rob. Stop all this bigotry that causes so much division and bad feeling - just get out there and plough. Whatever your feelings as you plough now - it’s tougher at the top. Plough to the rules as applied on the day.
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
I have contributed to, read and reread all the threads on handling. At one time the substance of every thread was re directed to the handling issue.

I have ploughed throughout England, Scotland and Wales. I have however always ploughed to the rules applied on the day as have all those European winners amongst us, including the qualifying rounds. I have ploughed for at least 20 years. Let me tell you one very pertinent fact. NOTHING has changed. Nothing at all. The winners are all still winners, a fact that resolves around their will to win. The handlers are still handlers. I speak for the scruffy classes which by and large paint a reasonable picture of results with one or two notable exceptions among the establishment figures who judge. That has always been

Social media does have a good side. Many newcomers and those wishing to improve have been helped on here. All this banging on about handling will not change things. I said earlier nothing has changed. The fact that it is in people’s conscience might well be a shift in mindset. On the ground nothing has changed.

It has not stopped the SOP doing whatever they please, stretching and manipulating by use of proxy votes - genuine or otherwise. Nothing has changed (apart from one significant change to the filed accounts with companies house).
It would appear that recently a dearth of Directors has arisen by stealth. Nothing has changed.

One thing that social media has done is cause division and bad feeling. A veritable furnace stoked by an army of keyboard warriors naming and shamingnothing good has come out of it and yes you guessed nothing has changed.

One of the good things I always took from ploughing was the vast number of genuine and good people involved. Nothing has changed. Just get on and plough. It’s still the same as ever it was. People always have had their own opinion. They always will. Nothing has changed.

If you are not happy with the rules or the score sheet, then make your own - apply them as you see fit. All of you at grass roots level just take a step back. There now - nothing has changed.

So nothing having changed - not even the fact that you don’t need to handle to produce a World / European beating plot. What’s the problem Harry. Might be nothing to do with handling. Could it be a simple vacuum of skill technique and funding. Free for all Aitch - ploughing for England next then?
Et tu Brutae? In a way your right, its not all to do with handling, much more to do with unenforced and largely unenforceable rules. Going back in time to your interpretation of the handling rule, in that any hand contact for what ever reason is an offence, then a plough man who gets stuck in a stone cannot remove it, he must lift the plough over it, not always possible. and how about the man who choke his plough with wet straw and dirt, he cant clean it, in fact he couldn't even scrape the boards.
Skill technique, funding? Probably, but good enough to finish in the pack at the national. Plough at the world? No, my nerves would not stand it, kit would be back on the truck at the first mistake, real or imagined!
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
As I believe you yourself mentioned, getting to the European was the hard bit, and uninhibited furrow manipulation would certainly help there.

Time to put the shovel down Aitch and throw away that damn pick. Your hole appears at present deep enough, perhaps a little too deep. If you are to quote then at least make it a reasonable semblance of what was said.

Quote “ it’s not winning the European - it’s getting there in the first place”

Yet again you twist things round to handling. Plough to the rules as applied. Possibly it escaped your attention but handling at the National is strictly policed, and surprisingly enough the British National being the qualifier for the European. So not guilty as charged.

You are though stirring up a storm of severe malcontent and spoiling a leisure pursuit for people on both sides of the fence.
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
Nor was it necessarily right before any of us came along. Nor will I apologise for my viewpoint as a former champion. It is unfortunately the only one I have and you should respect that every bit as much as I respect your viewpoint.

The thing that has changed is your perception of things, possibly a crisis of confidence made even more incandescent on here by a certain significant other.

Please Rob. Stop all this bigotry that causes so much division and bad feeling - just get out there and plough. Whatever your feelings as you plough now - it’s tougher at the top. Plough to the rules as applied on the day.
Be nice if they were to be the same every day, or at leased enforced that way!
 

Dealer

Member
Location
Shropshire
I was not asking for any apologies nor have I ever said that those that have gone before me don't have a view that I respect or don't consider

Anyone that has won anything at a national level deserves respect as they have earned it and rightly so.

Bigotry of no sort. If you read my input on the title of the subject of the thread my view has been constant. Tho should abide by the rules or be called a cheat.

What I find difficult is that not all seem as enthusiastic in seeing things done correctly.
As they are happy for me to enter and pay my entry fee that they will win, so when they win they should do it fairly.

The onus should always be on the competitor to follow the rules first and blaming the lack of stewards is just a cop out.

Am I jealous of those that are better than me, not really I am probably better at other things than them in life that's just the way thing are.

Crisis in confidence not really I have never blamed anyone for cheating on my ploughing scores.

I have a few years ahead of me so as in all things time will tell if I will be any good.

As for any individual having an influence on my opinion on this or any other post then those that know me will tell you that is world's away from reality.

Yes I will plough on if I never win another match as long as I enjoy it and feel that I am achieving something worthwhile I will continue.

I certainly don't hold grudges or bad feeling against those that don't share my point of view.

I treat everyone as I would want to be treated.
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
Time to put the shovel down Aitch and throw away that damn pick. Your hole appears at present deep enough, perhaps a little too deep. If you are to quote then at least make it a reasonable semblance of what was said.

Quote “ it’s not winning the European - it’s getting there in the first place”

Yet again you twist things round to handling. Plough to the rules as applied. Possibly it escaped your attention but handling at the National is strictly policed, and surprisingly enough the British National being the qualifier for the European. So not guilty as charged.

You are though stirring up a storm of severe malcontent and spoiling a leisure pursuit for people on both sides of the fence.
take two to tango, and from my position, the wind is blowing hard in my direction, so the storm centre is else where, as is the agitation unit!
 

Howard150

Member
Location
Yorkshire
Et tu Brutae? In a way your right, its not all to do with handling, much more to do with unenforced and largely unenforceable rules. Going back in time to your interpretation of the handling rule, in that any hand contact for what ever reason is an offence, then a plough man who gets stuck in a stone cannot remove it, he must lift the plough over it, not always possible. and how about the man who choke his plough with wet straw and dirt, he cant clean it, in fact he couldn't even scrape the boards.
Skill technique, funding? Probably, but good enough to finish in the pack at the national. Plough at the world? No, my nerves would not stand it, kit would be back on the truck at the first mistake, real or imagined!

Enough of being silly to the point of stupidity Aitch. Handling apertains to the ploughed work nothing more nothing less. If you encounter a stone then lift up, dig it out, leave it where it can be seen by the judge and is a position which allows you to carry on.

Whatever your hidden meaning or message with regard to clearing blockages from a plough or even scraping off stuck mouldboards then it leaves me perplexed to say the least. Just when I think you have strained the boundaries to bursting - off you go again - and how. Whatever cleaning, clearing or adjusting the plough has to do with handling or shaping furrows then I am sorry but the logic escapes me.

However you can derive this from the rules as written suggests to me a problem. The context is “Handling, treading or shaping of furrows” The plough is never mentioned. If you need to further your cause Harry then surely it would be better done with fact rather than fiction. As I said earlier. It might well be alright among the grown ups but it is very very unfair to impose such a vengeful or spiteful onslaught on those newcomers not conversant with the rules.

Just a small point but on TFF since November 16th 2013 you have made 3787 posts. You have in that time accrued 1983 likes which in real terms is 2-1 against. You are upsetting a lot of people on both sides of the fence. Time possibly to call it a draw - especially after this last round was provoked by you not being asked to plough at the local judging seminar.
 

Roy Stokes

Member
Location
East Shropshire
Just a small point but on TFF since November 16th 2013 you have made 3787 posts. You have in that time accrued 1983 likes which in real terms is 2-1 against. You are upsetting a lot of people on both sides of the fence. Time possibly to call it a draw - especially after this last round was provoked by you not being asked to plough at the local judging seminar.

I also think it's well overdue to call time on this although an apology from Harry to those he has named on this and other threads who are not here to defend would be most welcome, might even get you a few more likes Harry
 

Ley253

Member
Location
Bath
Well well, how do you square that diatribe with the castigation I received for trying to find and remove a stone in my plot at Sarn?
 

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