- Location
- Berkshire
Not something we see on light downland chalks, our disadvantage being flints and Sarsen stones!!
OSR next year
- Thread starter Banana Bar
- Start date
Yep I wouldn't want that situation neither. Potatoes are harvested from mid-April onwards continually through to the Autumn in Cornwall. Salads provide the perfect timing to get OSR established and correct the soil damage. No DAP required, no soil pests, no volunteers to spray. Also sow oil radish cover crops into spud ground, spray off in Feb then tickle with a Carrier then direct drill. We grow OSR so land not suited to other brassicas but many get three crops in one year. Early spuds, followed by Cauli/cabbage followed by SB. The spuds leave plenty of phosphate behind, the Brassica boys plenty off lime and N. Normally very high SB yields following a very profitable double break for no work or risk, other than perhaps a mess to sort. A pass with a Sumo/Topdown is not really that expensive compared to the overheads saved and higher margins returned. For some to adopt a full approach to direct drilling would make no sense in certain parts of the country. Every business is different and so are farms and different areas of the country.
Very true. Direct drilling here on hanslope clay (if done properly and well) is the way foward for us. We can’t grow many crops like you boys! Three crops in a year is awesome.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
We have been paid for ours about three weeks ago. Has been almost too helpful for cashflow. Haven't had to spend to establish a lot of crops this year, didn't have to spend a lot up front, and now have the money in when usually I would only get it in a year's time when we would have sold the grain we're now not growing. Got the money too on our second Mid Tier scheme too, and BPS turned up promptly. One payment is a few thousand short, which I need to query, but otherwise pretty happy at the moment.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
How much N had you put on before you decided to pull the plug? What date was the OSR drilled?
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
I take a lot what farmers say about their own successes particularly with a pinch of salt. We are all motivated to portray to others an overly rosy assessment of reality. For example, some no till farmers like to explain away failures / reduced yields as just a one-off, or down to some other factor rather than their down to their new system, whereas any perceived improvements are automatically entirely due to their new favours system. Some are worse at this than others of course.
- Location
- Bury St Edmunds
[emoji106]
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
On the original topic, we have two halves of OSR this year. That which was planned and drilled early, and then a panicked 150ac which we put in later worried about tariffs in a no deal scenario. First half has been so much easier to grow. Thought OSR was going backwards a month ago, but has now pulled together in even 70ac of the later drilled 150ac. Overall have 100ac out of 480ac which is unacceptable (i.e. sure it won't do 1 t/ac) if it becomes the new normal. Lessons: drill very, very early. Would start on 25th July if I could, but can only start 1 August this year due to scheme rules. Apply a lot of early N. Use FSS & no pre-em. Claydon followed by rolls fast behind to conserve moisture. Don't go deep and lose moisture and create clods.
Government needs to look at the rules on this. OSR ran out of N this year even in bits (overlaps) that had twice the allowed amount. Only area of OSR that has looked superb all season had winter barley sprayed off in May last year and had probably equivalent of 100 kg/ha N to play with. You need big, big plants as quickly as possible and then early N in the spring to power the plants away from the larvae. As @teslacoils says though, this is becoming higher and higher risk. Putting a lot of N on in the summer and having the crop fail is quite a lot of N to waste. Will see what the yields we get this year, but if it still gives a decent margin (until oil price crash would have been highest GM crop for the 4th year running I think) we will probably roll the dice until we get a proper disaster.
Government needs to look at the rules on this. OSR ran out of N this year even in bits (overlaps) that had twice the allowed amount. Only area of OSR that has looked superb all season had winter barley sprayed off in May last year and had probably equivalent of 100 kg/ha N to play with. You need big, big plants as quickly as possible and then early N in the spring to power the plants away from the larvae. As @teslacoils says though, this is becoming higher and higher risk. Putting a lot of N on in the summer and having the crop fail is quite a lot of N to waste. Will see what the yields we get this year, but if it still gives a decent margin (until oil price crash would have been highest GM crop for the 4th year running I think) we will probably roll the dice until we get a proper disaster.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
It's too high risk. Anyone care to calculate even a low input system including land work and rent, up to mid Feb? Gone are the days of 4.5t a hectare at 360 a ton.
I'm even considering......winter beans.
I'm even considering......winter beans.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
Rape at least has the chance of making a positive margin. Beans are more consistent – we lose money on them every year!!! (We are hopeless at growing beans, but we still persisted for a very long time.)
drilled September 1st which was earliest we could with weather harvest delays and straw removal
had had 80kgs N total which is now seedbed N for the linseed, will top up to 110kgs when all linseed is full row and it’s raining
SilliamWhale
Member
So is the stuff that didn't do very well a result of you not adopting a full inversion soil tillage system?
confirmation bias is hard to avoid - no till or other, imo the guys that insist that zerotill can’t work are every bit as bad (if not worse) at reassuring themselves they are right
i try to share success and failure on TFF - we have certainly had some massive cock ups and fails over the years that i have posted about on here - my dad, agronomist, staff and many neighbours are all members on here which keeps things open and honest !
all farming systems have there good and bad results, i doubt many farmers could claim much consistency when dealing with variables like weather etc
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
The biggest effect was drilling date (which is complex mix of soil moisture levels and flea beetle pressure). Second biggest was applied N amounts in the summer. Third biggest was straw spread combined with untimely volunteer Falcon spray. That's my best assessment, which is far from certain.
Remember it’s usually down to poor management (I.e me!) rather than the system.
wellingtonfarmer
Member
- Location
- Herefordshire
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
I though some management systems are more forgiving that others though in the short term. I.e. might be on the road to ruin but less likely to have a complete disaster in any one year. OSR feels like that now. You can say it was my fault for 100 ac of rape being rubbish because it drilled it too late and that probably was foreseeable, but it's quite unforgiving when you get a crop having to be written off now that looked fine even in February.
I would say its down to the weather and how it suits a system. I would say good management is about being flexible and adapting to the weather. No one has perfect crops all the time nor sells everything at the top of the market. What is interesting with farm benchmarking is that the top 10% of producers with respect to profit can, but not always, have high input systems, but have consistent high output. It is a really useful exercise to get consultants such as Andersons etc to analyse actual performance within a given sector and not many of the top 10% have very low input systems. By the way the only drill we own is a 750a so do DD when appropriate and a Bio-drill on a Topdown.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
I get that warning every year. This year I wasn't sure whether I had a bit of it where leaves turned a bit purple. Pulled a few plants out but didn't trust myself enough to know if there was any or not. I decided in the end it was more likely to be N deficiency. Seems there is a risk of root fly, but a near certainty of CSFB if planted later. I'd rather take a chance on the root fly and avoid the CSFB rightly or wrongly.