"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
in nicole masters' book it says plantain can be a sign of low phos. @som farmer
read that ,elsewhere, as well, pk indices were on the low side, and we have 'topped' them up. Where they are really growing, is grazing ground only, with good indices. But will be keeping an eye, on them. Another thing i learn't, they are acidic soil tolerant, down as low as 4.5, fields they are in, were limed last year. Combine both, seems to point towards a problem, some more soil sampling, i think.
 
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holwellcourtfarm

Member
Livestock Farmer
herbal leys are coming in for more attention. We are trying various types/amounts, it would be helpful to know, what success farmers have had, or are trying. One thing we have learn't, plantains definitely likes our ground, where sown, have shot away, but wild plantain, is a very common plant here.
We've generally had success (albeit sometimes a slow start) with just air spreading on Cotswolds Seeds herbal over-sseding mix https://www.cotswoldseeds.com/products/1566/herbal-over-seeding-mixture-deep-rooting-herbal-ley

I've just spread it on and let the cows tread it in. Take in the first year is variable but is thickens up over time.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
Livestock Farmer
You guys and gals might like to join me at @Sheila Cooke latest webinar on Silvopasture design next week:

 

Humble Village Farmer

Member
BASE UK Member
Location
Essex
herbal leys are coming in for more attention. We are trying various types/amounts, it would be helpful to know, what success farmers have had, or are trying. One thing we have learn't, plantains definitely likes our ground, where sown, have shot away, but wild plantain, is a very common plant here.
It seems that "what likes your ground" is very relevant. I'm on my second one having destroyed the first one, in which everything came up and was really successful. I thought I was an expert after one go but this one isn't nearly as good. Some patches virtually bare and a lot of the expensive seed doesn't seem to have done much at all. I redrilled quite a bit over the summer.

Looking back, I probably could have cut the herbs right down to say 0.1 to 0.5 kg per ha for each species considering how sparse they are.

I also think next time I will put 2 to 3 kg of westerwolds to bulk up the first season and in our case, give the black grass a run for its money

What does seem reliable is cocksfoot and chicory but that may be just on our soil type. I have a nagging doubt that a soil test might reveal some deficiencies which have stopped the other stuff growing
 

Bury the Trash

Member
Mixed Farmer
I have tried Plantsnap (I think) but it's hopeless on grasses. You really need a proper "textbook" with details of the ligule etc rather than trying to identify things off their seedheads.

Various threads on here show that people will identify browntop as tall fescue 🤣
It came today :love:

'we' have 160 types of grass which i didn't know :rolleyes: not a large figure though of the 10k types o_Oworld wide.....
How many in NZ ? i wonder....
747086539_20201021_133002_3670674_resized.jpg

don't even need a smart phone to read it 😏
 

Rob Garrett

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Derbyshire UK
It seems that "what likes your ground" is very relevant. I'm on my second one having destroyed the first one, in which everything came up and was really successful. I thought I was an expert after one go but this one isn't nearly as good. Some patches virtually bare and a lot of the expensive seed doesn't seem to have done much at all. I redrilled quite a bit over the summer.

Looking back, I probably could have cut the herbs right down to say 0.1 to 0.5 kg per ha for each species considering how sparse they are.

I also think next time I will put 2 to 3 kg of westerwolds to bulk up the first season and in our case, give the black grass a run for its money

What does seem reliable is cocksfoot and chicory but that may be just on our soil type. I have a nagging doubt that a soil test might reveal some deficiencies which have stopped the other stuff growing
Have found that spring sown herbal ley under a pea/barley nurse crop (max 50kg/acre) works best here, but must get pea/barley silage off early (barley @ milky stage). Also pays to get soil going right @ least 12 to 24 month before sowing ley i.e. lime, grazing cover/catch crops, lashings of box muck, cell grazing cows on deferred grass etc etc

Agree with you about the herbs, plantain, chicory & yarrow work here but not much else, thinking this could be a result of management/system. Trefoil grows along the roadside just over the wall, but not in the field, too much fertility? Feels like trying to do two different jobs; grass likes fertility, herbs don't.
 

Rob Garrett

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Derbyshire UK
read that, as well, pk indices were on the low side, and we have 'topped' them up. Where they are really growing, is grazing ground only, with good indices. But will be keeping an eye, on them. Another thing i learn't, they are acidic soil tolerant, down as low as 4.5, fields they are in, were limed last year. Combine both, seems to point towards a problem, some more soil sampling, i think.
Cheeky question:
Any chance I could have a loan of your Nicole Masters book please? [emoji16]
 

DanM

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Country
Yes special mix £15.43/acre. Thinking behind it was diversity of root types, canopy heights etc. Cropping was: winter barley, stubble turnips (drilled 1st week Aug, grazed March left 20% of bulbs), turnips/weed regrowth grazed with cows June/July (that dry time). Twice over with big Disc a go go, broadcast, roll cover mix, July (bit late!). Will be going into herbal ley this spring. Borage & linseed hasn't killed them yet!
View attachment 915477View attachment 915478View attachment 915479View attachment 915480View attachment 915481View attachment 915482View attachment 915483View attachment 915484
Do you make them eat the turnip bulbs - or happy to leave them?
 

tinsheet

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Somerset
Not sure the drovers up cutcombe could handle goats 😜🤣


Only stayed for fat lambs today, 2nd half (where mine were 🤦‍♂️ was a bit disappointing, trade must have dropped £10 from start to finish
You'd be surprised we've had em up here before, sold well to be fair.
Just got in, trade defo back abit, £1.80 average on the fat lambs, (n)
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
It came today :love:

'we' have 160 types of grass which i didn't know :rolleyes: not a large figure though of the 10k types o_Oworld wide.....
How many in NZ ? i wonder....
View attachment 915537
don't even need a smart phone to read it 😏
There will be a lot.
(I would be really interested to know!) Certainly a lot of your "wild" species wouldn't have made it here as the early settlers would have seen no commercial reason to bring them in; but I could find at least 50 common grasses if I went for a scout down the roadsides.. cocksfoot and bromes and fescues being the main types "that just grow", in fact at the head of the lake behind me, they are virtually wall-to-wall tall fescue now they flood.

Once upon a time they were paddocks with sheep on them, but the bar shifted and the level rose a few inches and they were left to nature.
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
Which book is this?
As per @Bury the Trash's post #16,199, I presume

Grasses: A Guide to Their Structure, Identification, Uses, and Distribution in the British Isles
Front Cover


Charles Edward Hubbard
Penguin Books, 1992 - Gardening - 476 pages
0 Reviews
After the concise and informative descriptions of the structure of grasses and their flowers, there are lists of grasses for various habitats, followed by a key to grasses in flower. It provides excellent scientific illustrations of the major grasses found in the UK and information on the preferred conditions for each grass.
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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