Insurance cost

NLF said:

I wouldn’t touch Acres with a barge pole. Acres has negative shareholders equity. Nigel Wellings and his backer should capitalise their business properly with some of the money they made selling Farmers and Mercantile. Acres may only be a broker but they still handle client money and besides if your broker goes bust you’ll find it much harder to make a claim.

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Nigel Wellings said:

You have your facts WRONG. Acres do not handle client money. We are members of Broker Network Ltd, the largest Broker Organisation in UK, all premiums are paid to and handled by Broker Network. Both they and ourselves are authorised by the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) and we both fully comply with the capital adequacy rules.

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NLF said:

It’s hard to say without knowing more about your business. People on here seem to like F&M. Surely for anything farming related you’ve got to start with NFU. I also use SPF (which used to be Savills Private Finance), but only for non farm stuff.

Some people here have a pathological hatred of NFU Mutual for reason beyond my understanding (they appear to confuse the insurance co with the trade body - read all the Red Tractor threads if you suffer from insomnia, yawn). You’ll notice that a lot of people who complain that they are expensive appear to be accident prone. My interpretation is that they are quite good at pricing for risk, so risky people find them expensive, those of us who rarely claim find them competitive (in contrast the job of a broker is to find underwriters who under price risk).

I find NFU competitive on my main farm, tenanted farms (where they beat a broker by a wide margin recently), rental properties, even classic cars. There are some things where they were way off the mark (i.e. they didn’t like the risk) such as my main home in London (it’s in a high subsidence risk postcode) and cars parked on London streets (who can blame them). The service is as good as your local agent but I find ours very good. I’ve only claimed twice in perhaps 20 years, both times from the NFU and never had any trouble.

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flyonthewall said:

As others have said NFUM are probably the best within their experience of risk, but not on price. For example I’ve put business with NIG through a broker, reading the small print they would repudiate any claim on a number of technicalities eg not fit to drive, influence of drugs/booze albeit they were half the cost of NFUM. Whether these exclusions would meet the requirements of the Road Traffic Act is questionable and something I hope not to test, reading a NFUM policy appears far less stringent and generous eg unattached implement theft coverage.

Having said this NFUM have been a complete ball ache on a subsidence claim which we have lost a considerable sum in rental income on and they seem disinterested in resolving. Moreover their handling of COVID interruption claims has been diabolical for a Mutual and no different from any other firm.

Personally for your type of business which sounds automotive repair I’d be looking at specialist broker and then spend a few hours looking at the policy booklet to make sure it covers what you expect it to. Even then be wary, we had a very slippery loss adjuster repudiate what I read to be a legitimate claim on behalf of a contractor we used to lay a new yard with product liability. Turned out concrete only had half of the required cement because insurance wouldn’t cover the loss we ended up successfully begrudgingly litigating the contractor who should have been covered for the £70k bill because the L/A and/or insurer was a crook. I should add his solicitor had a decent £8k cut, our only cost ended up as a £400 expert witness bill.

Caveat Emptor: Buyer Beware!

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NLF said:

I stand corrected. But it would be fairer to say that ONE of my facts was WRONG. The others were RIGHT, i.e. Acres has £100 called up capital, it has £248k accumulated losses (figures from your unaudited accounts) and if you go bust, your clients will find it much harder to claim on their policies. And my conclusion still stands, until you choose to capitalise your business properly I won't do business with you. Others are free to make their own choice.

Whilst I am relieved to learn that the FCA don't allow you to handle client money, many brokers do handle client money and have to be capitalised accordingly. Acres would appear to be a tied agent providing products and services from The Broker Network which is why you are able to trade with negative equity.

Having said all that, you did a great job with F&M (though I don't think the people who bought it would agree). I'm not sure if you were the original founder, but as noted above, F&M (amongst others) pushed a complacent NFU mutual to provide sharper pricing from which we all benefit.

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Clive said:

as i understand it you are insured by a underwriter

a broker just sells the deal on a commission basis

surely locsl NFU secs are just brokers for the NFU M ?

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Clive said:

I'm not really "saying" anything - I don't really understand the complexities of the insurance world

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Clive said:

All (NFU, F&M, and acres) paid out fine when I had valid claims, off all 3 though NFUM were the hardest work and wriggled the most in my experience

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Sid said:

Get 3 quotes,
don't auto renew,
Make sure cover is comparable.




Does depend on the claim type tbh.
Each claim is different especially multiple claims!

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bobk said:

Auto renew should be banned , it's lazy and immoral .

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Fruitloop said:

Do you know who the contractor was insured with?

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Sid said:

Get 3 quotes,
don't auto renew,
Make sure cover is comparable.




Does depend on the claim type tbh.
Each claim is different especially multiple claims!

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Nigel Wellings said:

Acres Insurance Brokers has sufficient capital adequacy whether we handle client money or not. We produce 6 monthly returns to the FCA that confirm this. We are also externally audited by Broker Network. Risk transfer operates on all policies we sell, meaning as soon as the client pays their premium to Broker Network, it is deemed to have been received by Insurers.
We are Insurance Brokers not an Insurance Company. We do not underwrite risks, we purely place them with Insurers. We do not therefore require large amounts of capital. The accounts you refer to were in 2019 when we had just started trading. The equity position will change but it is of no relevance to customers who are fully protected by Insurers and the FCA.
Acres are not tied agents of Broker Network, we are independent Brokers with agencies with all major Insurers and members of Broker Network. All Insurers and Broker Network have done extensive due diligence on us, including capital resources.
I was the founder of F&M IN 1996 and was a Director there until 2018.
My aim has always been to bring the best independent advice coupled with competitive premiums to the Farm Insurance market. That model worked well, but in my opinion became a challenge under corporate ownership. Hence Acres Insurance Brokers was set up with the same aim- Independent cover and service at the right price.
I have been quite transparent in all my posts on TFF, I have a sneaking suspicion that you have a vested interest somewhere along the line within the insurance market. You should therefore be prepared to reveal what that interest is.

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