New Animal sentiant laws thanks to Boris' squeeze

Agrivator

Member
There is a major difference between humans and domestic farm animals.

Humans have a clear sense of time. As Robert Burns emphasized in his address to the mouse he disturbed while ploughing.

Still, thou art blest, compar’d wi’ me!

The present only toucheth thee:

But Och! I backward cast my e’e,

On prospects drear!

An’ forward tho’ I canna see,

I guess an’ fear!


In other words, if our domestic animals have no sense of time, their lifetime will seem an eternity, no matter how long or short on a human time-scale. And just as significant, they have no sense of life or death as we know it.
 
Apparently rabbits are one of the most efficient converters of grass to meat so you are absolutely correct

Im well aware of that fact, and it’s a nice one. But I just find it a little bit bizzare that they omitted the fact that he grew up on a cattle farm. Like cow folk are bad folk, but guinea pig cuddlers are nice folk ..... say what? Odd reporting.
 

topground

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North Somerset.
The lawyers to whom the likes of Packham and May turn will be rubbing their hands at the prospect of badly drawn up legislation which will provide rich pickings as ‘ animal rights’ and vegan extremist groups seek to use such legislation as a means of outlawing the keeping of animals in any circumstances.
How sentience is defined in law and how that can be enforced will be key but unfortunately politicians and the civil servants drawing up such legislation are invariably one step thinkers who do not understand how such law will work in practice.
In anticipation I have asked the cows this morning how they feel and could they record their feelings on a graduated scale At the moment they are struggling with ticking boxes but I am sure DEFRA and Red Tractor and all the other parasites will have found a way by the time this hits the statute book.
 

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
You can understand the good intentions of proposing such a bill but it is a road map to hell, not just for those who care for animals but the animals themselves.

I will use bats as an example as I have a particular fondness for the amazing creatures.
I was originally very pleased that their needs were taken into account in terms of planning. The trouble is, this made their presence very expensive and whereas people were not previously concerned, they now had a large financial incentive to make sure they were absent.
A bat would now be also considered a sentient animal [it has a backbone] so you would have to prevent disturbing them mentally as well as physically. This could make it even more important to make sure they were not present where anyone wants to do building work.
At the same time many are against livestock farming which is essential for bats to survive.

“Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.”
Luke 23:34
 

topground

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North Somerset.
“Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.”
Luke 23:34

Unfortunately those who propose this type of legislation know full well what they do. It is the politicians who enact it but don’t have to suffer the consequences who don’t know what they are doing in their quest for the votes of the detached dopey urban masses.
 

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
Unfortunately those who propose this type of legislation know full well what they do. It is the politicians who enact it but don’t have to suffer the consequences who don’t know what they are doing in their quest for the votes of the detached dopey urban masses.

I disagree.
They are blinded by their own enthusiasm and don't understand that adding costs and pressures for people to comply to doing 'the right thing' actually gives incentive to do 'the wrong thing'.

This is very 'new labour'. It will keep all the legal chums busy for years. Any case involving animals will have to be 'tried' anew.

There is also an explicit link between rights and responsibilities.
If a sentient animal is afforded extra rights then how can it be made responsible for it's actions....
Are my sheep aware of how they drive me insane.
Are they aware that the times when I'm causing them the most distress, it is for the benefit of their welfare.
 

farmerm

Member
Location
Shropshire
I'm sure George Useless believes this as he has been sold the idea that this is an inconsequential virtue signal that makes the party look good. Being completely useless he fails to understand that this is a irreversible step which could have huge implications whereby anyone caring for animals could face huge legal costs trying to prove the animals in their care are 'happy'.

Is happiness even a natural state?.......
Would that mean intensively farmed and permanently housed animals would be preferred to animals 'suffering' weather?
Or would there be a minimum sized home relative to a size of pet..........

The potential impact is endless with little or no established benefit.
an antelope drinking from a croc infested river is a natural state, the antelope never look happy doing so though...
 

unlacedgecko

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Fife
I disagree.
They are blinded by their own enthusiasm and don't understand that adding costs and pressures for people to comply to doing 'the right thing' actually gives incentive to do 'the wrong thing'.

This is very 'new labour'. It will keep all the legal chums busy for years. Any case involving animals will have to be 'tried' anew.

There is also an explicit link between rights and responsibilities.
If a sentient animal is afforded extra rights then how can it be made responsible for it's actions....
Are my sheep aware of how they drive me insane.
Are they aware that the times when I'm causing them the most distress, it is for the benefit of their welfare.

No they're full aware. "Death by 1000 cuts".

The AR extremists are determined to end any and all human/animal interaction by any means necessary.
 
Location
southwest
It sounds an excellent idea to me.





As long as all imported food is produced to the same rules.

Fully agree with the above, but.......

Would denying an animal proper treatment when it's ill (eg no AB's on an organic system) be treated the same way as parents who deny their children medical treatments on religious grounds?
 

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
No they're full aware. "Death by 1000 cuts".

The AR extremists are determined to end any and all human/animal interaction by any means necessary.

They are fully aware of the damage to livestock farming and other businesses.
One would hope they haven't done this knowing that it would have negative implications for animal welfare.
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 81 42.2%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 68 35.4%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 15.6%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.6%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,294
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top