Logic went out of the window 30 years agoThis is quite correct. Unfortunately the organisation who are suggesting this ban are the same organisation who think its a good idea to not dredge rivers/ditches in an effort to slow down water flow to help flooding. Logic is not involved here.
Autumn manure banned
- Thread starter l'ordinary bonville
- Start date
I think this has been brewing for a while, when FRFW first came in there was a message sent from the EA that they would provide advice to anyone found not to comply and it would be all very 'light touch' unless there was significant breach leading to pollution incident etc. Many took this as a sign to ignore etc etc and I suspect that this is just the next step up to escalate the original policy.
There are ways round this but it's going to require a bit of thinking about to demonstrate justification - no box ticking on this anymore.......
1st step would be download and understand the following:
RB209 Section 2: Organic materials
RB209 Section 3: Grass and forage crops
RB209 Section 4: Arable crops
2nd step to then prepare:
A risk map of fields, based on - slope/topsoil type & depth/subsoil type/proximity to ditches,streams,rivers,boreholes/field drains/soil condition eg compacted/other pathwayts for surface run off to get into ditch etc etc.
3rd step:
Understand what soil analysis is telling you ie. Is a field at high/optimal/low nutrient concentrations......?
It'll be hard for a couple of years but it gets easier........ will also probably save money in the long run.
I hope you are correct with the above but I fear a ban will be just that.
- Location
- Matching Green
I'm struggling to see how I will deal with FYM applications other than in the autumn on my ex aerodrome Ragdale and heavier phase Handslope soils. I currently apply around 700t FYM each autumn spread thinly at 15t/ha in front of winter wheat, either after wheat or herbage seed stubbles.
I also spread about 6500t slurry per annum of which 1500t usually goes on in the autumn in front OSR and second wheat at 20 to 25mĀ³/ha. I could probably do all the slurry in the spring although it would be logistically challenging given that it is spread with a tanker with a 16m boom. All my muck comes from a muck for straw deal with a local pig farm, 30 years for FYM and over 20 years for the slurry. The easy option for me is to pack it in but it may well leave my pig farmer up the proverbial creek, I have never known him so stressed about anything and they have suffered some unfortunate incidents over the time I have known them.
I foolishly hope common sense will prevail, but worry that point has passed us by.
I also spread about 6500t slurry per annum of which 1500t usually goes on in the autumn in front OSR and second wheat at 20 to 25mĀ³/ha. I could probably do all the slurry in the spring although it would be logistically challenging given that it is spread with a tanker with a 16m boom. All my muck comes from a muck for straw deal with a local pig farm, 30 years for FYM and over 20 years for the slurry. The easy option for me is to pack it in but it may well leave my pig farmer up the proverbial creek, I have never known him so stressed about anything and they have suffered some unfortunate incidents over the time I have known them.
I foolishly hope common sense will prevail, but worry that point has passed us by.
If tomorrows announcement does prove to be a worse case scenario then anyone with a lagoon or slurry tower with spare capacity should be in a very strong position.
Unless the lagoons / Towers are fully covered, protected from run off into the lagoons - surely they are going to suffer as well due to the inclement weather..
I fear the pain may be suffered by everyone, as this shenanigans is not fully thought through imho, nor is it able to be truly substantiated by science, because it is part of the equation serving only one side of the equation due to vested interests..
This whole situation needs to be rationalised and then challenged with unadulterated facts driven out into the open for consumers to see via media / marketing etc, unless of course - they speak the truth and the industry knows this....
Sitting on the sidelines expecting others to fight the corners is not helping anyone..
- Location
- Essex
This isn't red tractor we're talking about. There will be science behind the decision.
But, as for all Science's - you can challenge the thesis in question with counter information to mitigate the belief pushed... If you want to and have the counter evidence...
- Location
- Bedfordshire
Don't you think we do that anyway??
I am BASIS, FACTS and BSc, 'SOYL' map all my fields etc etc etc
This is the trouble - the EA and DEFRA think we are all idiots.
- Location
- Bedfordshire
No it is not science.
It is an interpretation of limited science, with no account of agriculture, practicalities, air quality or any consultation, and no concept of 'exporting the problem'.
- Location
- S.E
This is not science. Its a very blinkered view of a problem that no one fully understands. Refusing to look at the whole picture is irresponsible and will have unintended consequences as we saw with the neo nic ban.
I suggest any organic manure that can't be spread in the Autumn be dumped at the door of the EA offices for them to deal with. They would in France.
I suggest any organic manure that can't be spread in the Autumn be dumped at the door of the EA offices for them to deal with. They would in France.
Ok the other side of the argument there is huge problems with phosphate levels in the wye due to so much chicken muck thrown around at the wrong time. As much as this whole thing is pissing me off this industry and the way quite a lot of farmers go about things is partly to blame.
- Location
- S.E
What issues are the high phosphate levels in the wye causing?
High phosphate causes loads of issues, you must know this.
And the specific issues in the Wye are?
- Location
- Essex
Maybe phosphates in the water?
Affecting wildlife I believe. Thereās a lot of stuff online about it. Some would be down to sewage but lots down to agriculture.
Farmers have got to be realistic and learn to take ownership of their issues. This is exactly why we are in this position.
- Location
- S.E
The point I'm trying to make is what is the actual damage caused by the alleged high phosphate (which may or may not of come from agriculture)? Yes we must try and mitigate it but at what cost? Where is the balance? Trying to get to zero is unrealistic and uneconomic on so many levels.
You see therein lies the problem.
āAffecting wildlife i beleiveā what source and what facts for such a statement?
āLot of stuff online about itā ā¦ā¦.. thereās plenty of āstuffā online about a lot of things, doesnāt mean itās true.
Itās too easy for agriculture to be made the scapegoat, say these things often enough and it suddenly becomes the accepted norm even if there is no evidence for it.
We need to understand where all the sampling points are in relation to sewage discharge points etc.
Itās really important we remain objective and challenge unsubstantiated claims. Even if itās not in our area it is important that as an industry we stand together. The issues you face and may be responsible for are very different to those I face in my area.
Letās not give those who wish to regulate us unnecessary ammunition from ill thought out comments and evidence. All IMHO.
- Location
- South Molton
So what about straw that's incorporated or a grass/legume/cover crop that is ploughed down or incorporated.
That will cause a release of nutrients that may or may not be utilised by the plant.
Ban of autumn planting as well?
The Crap App I have on my phone shows 30 units of N not avaliable in autumnal application v spring
That will cause a release of nutrients that may or may not be utilised by the plant.
Ban of autumn planting as well?
The Crap App I have on my phone shows 30 units of N not avaliable in autumnal application v spring