£200/t wheat ...

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
Plenty of agricultural commodity producers have done very well out of the game in the last 30-40 years also?

traders / processors maybe but can’t think of many primary agricultural commodity producers that will have done anything particular extraordinary over that period

30 years is pretty much my entire farming career to date, owning land / property has been kind over that period but never made more than a fairly low % return from actually growing anything really
 
Last edited:
traders / processors maybe but can’t think of many primary producers that will have done anything particular extraordinary over that period

30 years is pretty much my entire farming career to date, owning land / property has been kind over that period but never made more than a fairly low % return from actually growing anything really

'You can't think of many primary producers...'

Have you considered those growing wheat and other soft commodities abroad?

You need to recognise that you are in the UK which has damp, maritime climatic conditions and with expensive labour. It also has a relatively high cost infrastructure system. This may not be the ideal location to grow wheat or such commodities. Other producers in other countries, who have much lower costs when it comes to acquiring land/labour, may well be living the dream when wheat reaches the price levels we are experiencing. They may well not have sufficient rain to get 10t/ha, but if they have endless areas to grow the stuff and aren't spending £30/acre on Pacifica maybe it doesn't matter?

It is the same reason British coal producers might have similar complaints to you. Land expensive, can't get labour, environ-mentalists against everything you do. Go to Australia or elsewhere and it's a serious business.

If you are concerned with such a low return on capital employed from farming why would you bother with it?
 

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
'You can't think of many primary producers...'

Have you considered those growing wheat and other soft commodities abroad?

You need to recognise that you are in the UK which has damp, maritime climatic conditions and with expensive labour. It also has a relatively high cost infrastructure system. This may not be the ideal location to grow wheat or such commodities. Other producers in other countries, who have much lower costs when it comes to acquiring land/labour, may well be living the dream when wheat reaches the price levels we are experiencing. They may well not have sufficient rain to get 10t/ha, but if they have endless areas to grow the stuff and aren't spending £30/acre on Pacifica maybe it doesn't matter?

It is the same reason British coal producers might have similar complaints to you. Land expensive, can't get labour, environ-mentalists against everything you do. Go to Australia or elsewhere and it's a serious business.

If you are concerned with such a low return on capital employed from farming why would you bother with it?

i was talking about my experience ….. which is all in the uk and as a efficient uk primary ag commodity producer
 
i was talking about my experience ….. which is all in the uk and as a efficient uk primary ag commodity producer

This was my point. You are looking from the top down. No matter what you do you are bound by intrinsically inflated labour and transportation costs because that is the nature of European agriculture. In other parts of the world being able to grow a bit of wheat worth near £200/tonne from an expanse of otherwise worthless and barren dirt is literally money for old rope.

There is no rule book that says northern Europe should grow wheat or barley. It's a damp and relatively cool climate that is conductive to some serious diseases and we have also managed to cultivate a grass weed issue. In other parts of the world blackgrass does not exist and it doesn't rain enough to cause septoria.
 

Patrick JE

Member
Location
North Yorkshire
There yer go.......
julian cope.jpg
 
2 x 10 ton lorry loads of potatoes in 1976 bought a combine harvester, albeit not a very big one but those days aren't coming back again any time soon.

If that were two artic loads of wheat now, what would the figures look like? (what's the list price of a small new combine?)

And what would it do to land values?
 

Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
Can't comment on the price of potatoes as per the original post though - even tried to look it up in FW and they have prices for cabbage, beetroot, onions, cauliflower and lettuce.....but no potatoes!
 

jg123

Member
Mixed Farmer
Theres a reason jcb etc have live link on all new machines. They want to see exactly the hours and type of use each machine is doing to put into incredibly complex algorithms so that they can increase prices constantly but keep selling kit.

Bit off topic but I had access to the tesco clubcard data for my dissertation. It was all done through a 3rd party company, tesco didnt analyse the clubcard data themselves....... it was mindblowing the data they had, and I had to sign my life away to access it and my dissertation was taken afterwards rather than in the library like everyone elses. They would tweak the cost of garlic bread if they needed to shift a load of beef mince etc.

Prices of inputs will never seem cheap again as the big sellers are far better at selling than they were in 1970 and farmers are no better
 
Last edited:

B'o'B

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Rutland
Theres a reason jcb etc have live link on all new machines. They want to see exactly the hours and type of use each machine is doing to put into incredibly complex algorithms so that they can increase prices constantly but keep selling kit.

Bit off topic but I had access to the tesco clubcard data for my dissertation. It was all done through a 3rd party company, tesco didnt analyse the clubcard data themselves....... it was mindblowing the data they had, and I had to sign my life away to access it and my dissertation was taken afterwards rather than in the library like everyone elses. They would tweak the cost of garlic bread if they needed to shift a load of beef mince etc.

Prices of inputs will never seem cheap again as the big sellers are far better at selling than they were in 1970 and farmers are no better
Sad, but ultimately true.
 

Two Tone

Member
Mixed Farmer
I've been watching an interesting program on BBC 4 called H20, the molecule that made us. It is a series in 3 parts, probably made in about 2016

If it is to believed and so far since then, everything they say is getting far worse (look at the yields in the whole of America this year!) so much water is needed for food that food prices are going to get very expensive!

Maybe, some sort of reality as regards the true value of farm produce is just around the corner!
Here, in the UK, things in farming might soon get a lot better.

Within less than 10 years, things like Stewardship and ELMs will have to be dropped like a stone, just to feed us.
 

B'o'B

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Rutland
I've been watching an interesting program on BBC 4 called H20, the molecule that made us. It is a series in 3 parts, probably made in about 2016

If it is to believed and so far since then, everything they say is getting far worse (look at the yields in the whole of America this year!) so much water is needed for food that food prices are going to get very expensive!

Maybe, some sort of reality as regards the true value of farm produce is just around the corner!
Here, in the UK, things in farming might soon get a lot better.

Within less than 10 years, things like Stewardship and ELMs will have to be dropped like a stone, just to feed us.
Western world agriculture has been for decades kitted up to feed the world as prices are going to go through the roof any moment.
The truth is right now their is so much surplus that we turn millions (if not billions!) of tons food into fuel. The government can turn those markets on and off as needed.
We live in incredibly wasteful societies all to keep a bit more money churning over.
 

Two Tone

Member
Mixed Farmer
Western world agriculture has been for decades kitted up to feed the world as prices are going to go through the roof any moment.
The truth is right now their is so much surplus that we turn millions (if not billions!) of tons food into fuel. The government can turn those markets on and off as needed.
We live in incredibly wasteful societies all to keep a bit more money churning over.
You may well be right.
But, just take a look at episode 3 (Crisis) to see how we headed for a severe food shortage as all the World's underground aquifers are depleting/if not are already depleted.
Then take a look on the Mike Mitchel YouTube channel to see his harvest results.
Look at it from 7 mins 20 seconds.
Yields of 1-2 bushels an acre that he cannot sell because he and everybody else needs it all for seed to plant next year.
I'm not sure that the market has realised just how serious the situation is yet and I'm not selling any more grain yet, in the hope that it will.
 

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
You may well be right.
But, just take a look at episode 3 (Crisis) to see how we headed for a severe food shortage as all the World's underground aquifers are depleting/if not are already depleted.
Then take a look on the Mike Mitchel YouTube channel to see his harvest results.
Look at it from 7 mins 20 seconds.
Yields of 1-2 bushels an acre that he cannot sell because he and everybody else needs it all for seed to plant next year.
I'm not sure that the market has realised just how serious the situation is yet and I'm not selling any more grain yet, in the hope that it will.

so are you buying futures ?
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 79 42.5%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 65 34.9%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 16.1%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 6 3.2%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,287
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top