But then Corbyn had always been a Brexiteer until political opportunism overrode principles!
Strangely quiet about this..
- Thread starter 7610 super q
- Start date
- Location
- Limousin, France
Part of the problem was the government tried to play within the rules, putting out information that was agreed as correct with government departments and independent economists. The leave lot said anything they liked, didn't matter if it was a blatant lie. Once lies are out there they are easily believed by those who want to believe them but they remain lies.
If you heard that Pig farmer lady on R4 she said "This isn't the Brexit I voted for" .
And face it, the farmers were promised by Gove
that the Subs would continue or be better and EU rules would be replaced by uk ones.They've shafted you.
Tough
There were three leave campaigns, too. While there were multiple Remain groups, they largely stepped back behind the official one 'Britain Stronger in Europe' (who even remembers the name of them, though??)Part of the problem was the government tried to play within the rules, putting out information that was agreed as correct with government departments and independent economists. The leave lot said anything they liked, didn't matter if it was a blatant lie. Once lies are out there they are easily believed by those who want to believe them but they remain lies.
If you heard that Pig farmer lady on R4 she said "This isn't the Brexit I voted for" .
And face it, the farmers were promised by Gove
They've shafted you.
Tough
Vote Leave (the official one), Leave.EU and Grassroots Out. Leave.EU and GO could spout off about immigrants and sovereignty with zero repercussions allowing Brexit to be all things to all people.
It was textbook how not to runa referendum which showed in the following days with the Leave campaigns almost blaming each other for wining and asking 'who has a plan?'. Farcical.
Now I fully accept we needed to Leave the EU, but the farce continues to this day in how it is being managed. And why we have left the Single Market is baffling - it was the Remain campaign that was we'd leave the SM and that's the justification the Leave campaign later used to do so. Utter madness.
And more probably would not have. Who knows?
These arguments are now totally pointless, people voted the way they wanted for a multitude of reasons personal to themselves, once remain lost that should have been it & all parties should have worked together to get the best deal possible, instead we had the farcical situation where half of parliament were undermining the government & to a certain extent still are!
Starmer would have had to accept a juries verdict if it went against him in the past, there would be no chance of asking the judge for a recount but he continued to not accept the outcome of the referendum!
- Location
- Limousin
So who are these, not haves? International companies came to the UK for access to the EU market and a flexible work force, both of which appear to have vanished.
IMO there is the real problem. Brexiters voted for themselves with no thought for the future of our young people or the country.
- Location
- Limousin
The reason the single market was out of bounds in the eyes of Brexiteers was due to freedom of movement aspect.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Could it be...£230m?
People are perfectly entitled to argue to rejoin or to move to closer alignment. We're a democracy with a plurality of views.
My post above was more about how the referendum campaign was organised than the result itself. Like I say, it was important that we did leave to respect the result, but if the result had been 52-48 in favour of remain, would the Brexiteers packed up and given up? I doubt it.
There would seem little point in ever having a referendum or an election if no one accepts the result does there, so many criticise Trump but are remainers really any better?
If remain had won the EU would see it as a green light to continue on the road to further integration. That would fuel further leave pressure than ever before. Now the EU seems to have taken on board some of the lessons given but it matters little to us now. It is a pity that our politicians did not appreciate the strength of public feeling against the decisions taken over many years.
Maybe, although Cameron had gained the opt out from 'ever closer union' prior to the referendum so it could have been seen as the confirmation of the concessions he did get.
Although Brexit is clearly more disruptive than a close remain vote would have been.
We always had the or out on ever closer union,( we always had the promise of a referendum yet werent given one over maastricht ) the problem is we never used it every time there was a move to closer union our governments approved it, why would anyone believe they would have vetoed the EU army, oops sorry defence force, we were told time and time again it wouldnt happen yet it is, remainers deny its an army, well anyone with a brain knows it is. Since 1973 the path has been in one direction, had the politicians been honest then I'm sure the leave vote would have been far higher,
Funny two days ago you claimed leave voters didnt know what they voted for, now you claim you do know what they voted for , two of us told you what we voted for and yet you ignored both of our posts.
I believe the UK being outside of the EU is in the best interests of future generations.
I'm curious, how do you feel about NATO membership?
It has kept world peace since 1945, with NATO why do we need a euro army? Have you ever heard any serving european high ranking military officer say a EU army would be better than nato ? It's a political project on the road to a us of e,
I’m not claiming I know what they voted for. I’m saying what I think they voted for. That it was not for the good of the country.
Your words were " brexiters voted for themselves with no thought for the future of their kids" it's funny how many remainers complain THEY and THEIR kids cant travel, study or work freely in the EU anymore, how many uk citizens have ever done that ? Thst is voting for themselves, which is fine but typical hypocrisy if they then complain if others do the same, travel is unrestricted up to 90 days in every 180, hardly a loss is it. As for working or studying you just have to fit the criteria just as you do in virtually every country in the world