glasshouse
Member
- Location
- lothians
Sounds like the post office scandal
RPA appeal
- Thread starter Hesston4860s
- Start date
Hesston4860s
Member
- Location
- Nr Lincoln
They won’t wear me down, Im in it till it’s run the full course however long it takes.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
Very interesting reading this thread. I have an ongoing argument with the RPA about a penalty levied on a mistake I made in a Mid Tier revenue claim form. I'll write it all up on here when I get time, but it's been a real eye opener about how dysfunctional their internal justice system is. For now I'll just copy and paste one part of their review of their performance to date. Needless to say there's quite a bit to improve on!
"In conclusion, RPA has given advice and information that is misleading, incorrect, and excessively delayed, which has caused you to waste time and effort in contacting RPA. There have been excessive delays in responding to you and dealing with your queries appropriately, and there appears to have been little effort from RPA to advise you of the delay or keep you informed of the progress of your case.
I sincerely apologise for the service provided to you, and in recognition of RPA’s poor service I have arranged for a consolatory payment of £100 to be issued to you shortly."
The £100 is nice, but it comes nowhere near the cost of my time spent arguing and chasing them, and I still haven't got the roughly £6k they withheld from my revenue payment nearly 3 years ago after they failed, IMO, to follow their own guidance consistently.
They seriously need to sort this out because people simply won't put themselves in a position where the RPA are basically in their debt given they can act as judge, jury and executioner unless you're prepared to waste tens of hours of time wading the the syrup like process of restitution.
"In conclusion, RPA has given advice and information that is misleading, incorrect, and excessively delayed, which has caused you to waste time and effort in contacting RPA. There have been excessive delays in responding to you and dealing with your queries appropriately, and there appears to have been little effort from RPA to advise you of the delay or keep you informed of the progress of your case.
I sincerely apologise for the service provided to you, and in recognition of RPA’s poor service I have arranged for a consolatory payment of £100 to be issued to you shortly."
The £100 is nice, but it comes nowhere near the cost of my time spent arguing and chasing them, and I still haven't got the roughly £6k they withheld from my revenue payment nearly 3 years ago after they failed, IMO, to follow their own guidance consistently.
They seriously need to sort this out because people simply won't put themselves in a position where the RPA are basically in their debt given they can act as judge, jury and executioner unless you're prepared to waste tens of hours of time wading the the syrup like process of restitution.
glasshouse
Member
- Location
- lothians
It was the glorious leader tony blair who changed the mindset of the civil service from helpful to just plain awkward.
Thanks tony, u pr*ck.
Hindsight
Member
- Location
- Lincolnshire
You might care to share that with the Defra's Janet Hughes who is on this forum at present seeking opinion from farmers. H
Isn’t it the case the more complicated the scheme the more chance of disputes in outcome & it‘s difficult to imagine a more complicated scheme than this ELMS fiasco
Goweresque
Member
- Location
- North Wilts
I've just posted a link to the ELMS thread
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
There are two aspects to my complaint, the unsatisfactory dealings with the RPA machine that the above quote relates to, and the judgment made by the RPA about my penalty. I have been unsure whether to raise both publicly until the full process has run its course.
For my agreement £6k was not a huge % of the annual claim, but the implication that I have acted dishonestly is the black mark that matters. Had the inconsistent application of their laws resulted in a much bigger fine, then it would not just be a reputational problem. As with others on this thread, they have the capacity to threaten the viability of businesses, and it's an issue that will make me think very carefully about whether to participate in ELMS.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
Having been part way through the mangle that is the RPA's internal justice system, it is clear that much more attention needs to be invested in making that process function more efficiently, more transparently and more fairly. As we move towards ELMS / CS making up a much larger % of farmers profits, we cannot have a quasi judicial process operating in a near kangaroo fashion in some instances.
- Location
- Glen Clova, Angus, DD8 4RD
I once heard an old experienced EA engineer tell a younger one who was complaining that "management accounts" were putting barriers in the way of the scheme he was working on: "You're under the false impression that they are here to help you. They don't care whether your job gets done, only that you follow their processes to the letter".
Sound like DEFRA / NE / RPA / FC / EA?
Sound like DEFRA / NE / RPA / FC / EA?
renewablejohn
Member
- Location
- lancs
If you want a 2nd witness then I have been shafted in a similar way. Was originally told my WGS did not affect my eligible land area which was over 5ha but as soon as I made a claim the WGS area was deducted from overall area which made my total area less than 5 ha making it so that I was no longer eligible to any payment. Then when BPS comes along yes my woodland is eligible and I have more than 5ha but only if I can show I claimed SPS back in 2008. They just made the rules up as they go along. Now there claiming the WGS payments back as they cannot see the wood for the trees. Thankfully the trees themselves are the best response to these idiots as they grow larger each year and eventually I will do guided tours to show what idiots are employed by the forestry commission.
Hesston4860s
Member
- Location
- Nr Lincoln
Thing is you couldn’t claim SPS in 2008 no way no how, I have the 2008 handbook !.
however there was a later rule change around 2012 where the EU ruled WGS should not exempt land from SPS, this is where it all falls apart from the 2008 reference year.
The RPA are using the later rules and applying them to an earlier year, it can’t and doesn’t work !.
The early woodland contracts are also different to the later schemes as well, fortunately I have all of my original scheme paper work !.
- Location
- south norfolk, uk
Hesston4860s
Member
- Location
- Nr Lincoln
Sorry bit of a late reply as I don’t really ever come on here !.
Nothing to add really, I went to the parliamentary ombudsman and well never heard a thing back from them !.
I don’t work in agriculture anymore or have my own business, this whole thing cost me a stack of money and my business for what it was !.
Glad you found yourself a new life! I hope you are enjoying it and have managed to put this sad episode behind you. All the best
glasshouse
Member
- Location
- lothians
Did u try your mp?
Hesston4860s
Member
- Location
- Nr Lincoln
Don’t really enjoy it, was alright at the start when there were new things to learn.
I’m bored with it now tbh !.
Hesston4860s
Member
- Location
- Nr Lincoln
She just said go to the ombudsman !.
- Tags
- application defra elms needle performance rpa