Off setting risk with conservation measures

Regenerativefarmer · May 16, 2022

This is my first post as a new member,

This year is my first year growing crops but the farm has grown crops for 40 years my father in-law just didn't want the hassle of all the red tape at aged 74.

Not the best year to start

After looking through the books major changes were needed.

You can't learn 40 years of experience and tractor driving !

Being quite computer friendly I went down the the technical tractor route and brought two new satellite steering tractors definitely the best investment.
To be fair I couldn't drive a straight line if I tried but the tractors can. Technology has come along leaps and bounds, I have amazed myself how accurate and efficient farming can be, best part I can do my paper work while on my tractor.

Having run other businesses I don't look at it as we farm because that's what we do its too much bloody hard work not to pay.

I've built a farm shop currently adding a restaurant and a farm park.

having been to many farming meetings I chose the regenerative farming approach using the livestock on the arable fields and using disease resistant varieties.

I spent alot of time keeping an eye out on what changes the government were likely to make and decided to enter the wildlife schemes

With the bps heading out i felt a spread betting option was my best option.

Things have changed somewhat crop prices have raised but so have running costs.

Using the schemes to contribute to black grass control and over winter green crops and low imputs.

The current status with grain prices will likely hold for some time but not for ever I still believe spread betting to be the safest option, take the straw job prices went through the roof but came back down quickly.

We have many environmental issues and I felt compelled to actively embrace restoring a balance on our farm.

I would like to hear what others have done to improve productivity or diversification.

teslacoils · May 16, 2022

I said sod it to diversification; focused on my job which is making money from crops; and grew bloody good fields of wheat. I increased productivity by lashing on more fertiliser and inputs.

Ive a mid tier scheme ending which will see me plough up nearly all my margins, and make use of only one option which is the ab6 fallow.

I own one old, highly fuel inefficient tractor which has a huge engine and is great fun.

Any help?

Regenerativefarmer · May 17, 2022

Definitely helpful, it's great to see how others approach farming, hence the forum is for sharing ideas, if this gives you the quality of life you and your family require and enjoy it's a perfect strategy.

And therefore a good business plan.

Sadly we were not in that position and needed to change.

Flat 10 · May 17, 2022

Regenerativefarmer said:
This is my first post as a new member,

This year is my first year growing crops but the farm has grown crops for 40 years my father in-law just didn't want the hassle of all the red tape at aged 74.

Not the best year to start

After looking through the books major changes were needed.

You can't learn 40 years of experience and tractor driving !

Being quite computer friendly I went down the the technical tractor route and brought two new satellite steering tractors definitely the best investment.
To be fair I couldn't drive a straight line if I tried but the tractors can. Technology has come along leaps and bounds, I have amazed myself how accurate and efficient farming can be, best part I can do my paper work while on my tractor.

Having run other businesses I don't look at it as we farm because that's what we do its too much bloody hard work not to pay.

I've built a farm shop currently adding a restaurant and a farm park.

having been to many farming meetings I chose the regenerative farming approach using the livestock on the arable fields and using disease resistant varieties.

I spent alot of time keeping an eye out on what changes the government were likely to make and decided to enter the wildlife schemes

With the bps heading out i felt a spread betting option was my best option.

Things have changed somewhat crop prices have raised but so have running costs.

Using the schemes to contribute to black grass control and over winter green crops and low imputs.

The current status with grain prices will likely hold for some time but not for ever I still believe spread betting to be the safest option, take the straw job prices went through the roof but came back down quickly.

We have many environmental issues and I felt compelled to actively embrace restoring a balance on our farm.

I would like to hear what others have done to improve productivity or diversification.

That all sounds quite self congratulatory and idealistic. Have you considered getting it published in FW? As a peasant I’m slowly making changes but none as far ranging as yours but if I required a farm shop to keep farming I’d pack up….
Yes I did get out the wrong side of bed.

Grass And Grain · May 17, 2022

Having ability to store 2× seasons grain production helps to sell for highest price. Deciding when the best time is to sell is the tricky bit!
^^^Could achieve similar by using futures? without need for 2x grain storage.

Weigh up livestock profit vs using stewardship options to help your regenerative goals. Stewardship can save a lot of time and less tying than livestock.

Diversification could be different Ag enterprises/crops to spread risk.

Regenerativefarmer · May 17, 2022

Flat 10 said:
That all sounds quite self congratulatory and idealistic. Have you considered getting it published in FW? As a peasant I’m slowly making changes but none as far ranging as yours but if I required a farm shop to keep farming I’d pack up….
Yes I did get out the wrong side of bed.

If this comes across self congratulatory I am sorry you see it this way, but I had to pull the business apart to rebuild it as it wasn't working if you can't be honest with your self then your only kidding yourself.
I started a new company and we managed to pay off the big overdraft from the old business, it wasn't of case of wanting to change I had too before we lost the lot.

I haven't taken a single penny from the farm and only invested my own money and started from nothing.
My family have suffered, my relationship has been tested to the limits, last month my wife had her first month's wages, far from easy my friend, we created the farm shop so we could fund progression on the farm a cash cow. Fair play to those who live a comfortable living debt free from straight farming we couldn't.

Regenerativefarmer · May 17, 2022

Grass And Grain said:
Having ability to store 2× seasons grain production helps to sell for highest price. Deciding when the best time is to sell is the tricky bit!
^^^Could achieve similar by using futures? without need for 2x grain storage.

Weigh up livestock profit vs using stewardship options to help your regenerative goals. Stewardship can save a lot of time and less tying than livestock.

Diversification could be different Ag enterprises/crops to spread risk.

I am totally up for looking at any opportunities we can, re time to sell,,to be honest under the old business we didn't have a clue what a crop cost to grow and therefore didn't know the price we needed to split even let alone the right time to sell. The tractors now give me a job sheet providing I enter the right information I can calculate my expenses and have some idea where I need to be.

So I guess the time to sell is when an exceptable price is reached, I completed my costings last week as offers to forward sell have come in. at £270 a tonne and a ridiculous low expected tonnage my profits were £680 per hectare, bps not included in this just straight farming including rent. have been offered £345 per tonne now so I think I will sell 25% I have taken too many risks and safety and a lower stress level could be helpful.

teslacoils · May 17, 2022

Regenerativefarmer said:
If this comes across self congratulatory I am sorry you see it this way, but I had to pull the business apart to rebuild it as it wasn't working if you can't be honest with your self then your only kidding yourself.
I started a new company and we managed to pay off the big overdraft from the old business, it wasn't of case of wanting to change I had too before we lost the lot.

I haven't taken a single penny from the farm and only invested my own money and started from nothing.
My family have suffered, my relationship has been tested to the limits, last month my wife had her first month's wages, far from easy my friend, we created the farm shop so we could fund progression on the farm a cash cow. Fair play to those who live a comfortable living debt free from straight farming we couldn't.

I can promise you my outfit is far from debt free. Nor is my living especially comfortable. It's about finding what your land can do, and what your own skillset is. For example, I'd not know one end of a spanner from another, so maintaining a fleet of vehicles would not be a wise choice.

Your farm shop for example wouldn't work here as I've neither the location nor the inclination.

Very few farming things can be taken from one farm and bolted onto another. And why should they be? If there was a blueprint to make a wodge of money then I'd have seen it on Dragons Den by now.

Regenerativefarmer · May 17, 2022

teslacoils said:
I can promise you my outfit is far from debt free. Nor is my living especially comfortable. It's about finding what your land can do, and what your own skillset is. For example, I'd not know one end of a spanner from another, so maintaining a fleet of vehicles would not be a wise choice.

Your farm shop for example wouldn't work here as I've neither the location nor the inclination.

Very few farming things can be taken from one farm and bolted onto another. And why should they be? If there was a blueprint to make a wodge of money then I'd have seen it on Dragons Den by now.

Totally get your points, location is key and making the most from what you have is all you can do, re strong points I can't work or drive our old machines like my 74 year old father in-law, so I need tractors that drive themselves I have no problems being honest, my strong points are seeing our farm for what it is and totally stopping any methods or practices that don't pay and believe me that has caused more upsets and arguments than you ever imagine.

All I am trying to do is keep my family farming the best way I can like everyone else.

It has definitely been the biggest challenge to my working career.

SilliamWhale · May 17, 2022

I met a bloke once who was highly diversified and had a great range of irons in the fire. He had contracted out what was his farm shop as he said "I could only make a living out of it", which I found quite interesting.

His point was that it was profitable but needed him to be there and beyond that it was a good living but nothing else in his absence. Always struck a cord with me and when I see a lot of farm shop owners they are working hard, putting the hours in, making a good living but I can see the limitations of it too.

The way I see it is diversifaction is one business and farming is another

teslacoils · May 17, 2022

Its always nice to hear what others are up to though. Lets face it - the best way to get a farm is probably make a pile of money elsewhere!

Humble Village Farmer · May 17, 2022

My latest scheme has expired and despite being "very environmental" in my attitude, with prices as they are, I might give it a miss for a year or two. I'm going to carry on with the options I have in place but quite honestly it's the admin and the rules I just can't really be bothered with. And with a few more acres of wheat I should be no worse off financially.

Flat 10 · May 17, 2022

Regenerativefarmer said:
If this comes across self congratulatory I am sorry you see it this way, but I had to pull the business apart to rebuild it as it wasn't working if you can't be honest with your self then your only kidding yourself.
I started a new company and we managed to pay off the big overdraft from the old business, it wasn't of case of wanting to change I had too before we lost the lot.

I haven't taken a single penny from the farm and only invested my own money and started from nothing.
My family have suffered, my relationship has been tested to the limits, last month my wife had her first month's wages, far from easy my friend, we created the farm shop so we could fund progression on the farm a cash cow. Fair play to those who live a comfortable living debt free from straight farming we couldn't.

Some on here will have started with nothing and make a living farming. Many will have also made similar sacrifices to yourself. Your father in law can’t have done so badly if he grew or kept a what sounds a decent sized business going until he was 74. I hope you have got to a point now where you and your family can enjoy it a bit otherwise it isn’t worth it.

teslacoils · May 17, 2022

At 74, most will be at the stage of doing less and living from their investment or pension. At that age, I expect my farm to be loosing £100k a year as I burn through the capital while drinking rum on a tropical beach having my wheelchair pushed by some flame-haired vixen.

Pan mixer · May 17, 2022

Keeping as many irons in the fire as possible is the best way forward I think.

Currently the arable end of my business is making a good income, the pigs losing a fortune, the sheep and cattle are holding their own as are the organic bit, the conservation areas and the farm shop.

Through matters well beyond the control of an individual farmer - as long as performance in each bit is up to par - this can all change and has changed in the past.

The modern 'regenerative' idea is only re-packaged mixed farming of the sort I do with one or two fashionable ideas added on to it like mob-grazing (time consuming, impractical and not the magic enthusiasts tell us), direct drilling (not suitable on all soils, not compatable with muck spreading and straw carting and only sustainable with much glyphosate)

However mixed farming is truly sustainable if done correctly and will on average pay as well as any other farming system.

It does rquire a lot of attention to many details at once and a clear knowledge of which things to prioritise in each enterprise.

Good luck to the OP, as said above, the secret to farming successfully is to have plenty of money before you start.

Regenerativefarmer · May 17, 2022

SilliamWhale said:
I met a bloke once who was highly diversified and had a great range of irons in the fire. He had contracted out what was his farm shop as he said "I could only make a living out of it", which I found quite interesting.

His point was that it was profitable but needed him to be there and beyond that it was a good living but nothing else in his absence. Always struck a cord with me and when I see a lot of farm shop owners they are working hard, putting the hours in, making a good living but I can see the limitations of it too.

The way I see it is diversifaction is one business and farming is another

Yes a new set of problems started with the shop, number one staffing it, we couldn't find anyone to show some interest and be trusted, butchers are like hens teeth and the red tape around a food business is unreal. Not to mention covid. The positives were some regular cash flow and investment money not from the bank.

teslacoils · May 17, 2022

Do you not work in your own farm shop? Or is it just extra staff?

steveR · May 17, 2022

teslacoils said:
I said sod it to diversification; focused on my job which is making money from crops; and grew bloody good fields of wheat. I increased productivity by lashing on more fertiliser and inputs.

Ive a mid tier scheme ending which will see me plough up nearly all my margins, and make use of only one option which is the ab6 fallow.

I own one old, highly fuel inefficient tractor which has a huge engine and is great fun.

Any help?

Slapped an aftermarket autosteer on it though....?

steveR · May 17, 2022

teslacoils said:
At 74, most will be at the stage of doing less and living from their investment or pension. At that age, I expect my farm to be loosing £100k a year as I burn through the capital while drinking rum on a tropical beach having my wheelchair pushed by some flame-haired vixen.

I suspect that expenditure budget will probably need halving after the Divorce settlement.....

Or maybe Mrs TC is dying her hair...!!

Regenerativefarmer · May 17, 2022

teslacoils said:
Its always nice to hear what others are up to though. Lets face it - the best way to get a farm is probably make a pile of money elsewhere!

In Jeremy Clarksons book he writes he's not rich enough to be a farmer god help the rest of us, my grandparents were farmer but sadly died early, they left the farm to my uncle who sold it all before the soil was set and hasn't worked a day since lazy good for nothing, in the meantime I lived with my mother and brother in a council house were things were difficult. I have managed not to borrow any money and paid for all my stock and kit when you come from nothing you have nothing to lose only my sanity.

Off setting risk with conservation measures

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