Suckler cows.. is it worth it?

hendrebc

Member
Livestock Farmer
I make a decent margin per cow kept (all calves kept through to finish or bulled) according to the figures from the welsh farm business survey we do every year but I still feel that the feed they eat could be better fed to something else because a bunch cows eat a lot compared to what they put out. Could keep 3 weaners for every cow for the amount a cow eats.
But you have to be nice to youngstock my cows get treated like second class citizens eating what sheep won't. Couldn't do that with youngstock so it's swings and roundabouts I suppose.
 
Location
Devon
Couple of questions

How do you feed a batch of calves to eat 2.5kg whilst on their mothers at grass?

on milky type cows, will the quids worth of feeding suggested boost growth rates that much plus a profit for the extra work?
100% worth feeding the calves if selling straight off the cow.

You are indeed correct thou they might not eat 2.5 kilos a day but if they only eat 1 kilo a day it will be very much worth doing!

And the cake would have to be ad lib but if the cows milk well and they have plenty of grass they will not eat anymore than 1 or 2 ish kilos a day anyway.
 

hendrebc

Member
Livestock Farmer
100% worth feeding the calves if selling straight off the cow.

You are indeed correct thou they might not eat 2.5 kilos a day but if they only eat 1 kilo a day it will be very much worth doing!

And the cake would have to be ad lib but if the cows milk well and they have plenty of grass they will not eat anymore than 1 or 2 ish kilos a day anyway.
What age do you start creeping calves?
 
I make a decent margin per cow kept (all calves kept through to finish or bulled) according to the figures from the welsh farm business survey we do every year but I still feel that the feed they eat could be better fed to something else because a bunch cows eat a lot compared to what they put out. Could keep 3 weaners for every cow for the amount a cow eats.
But you have to be nice to youngstock my cows get treated like second class citizens eating what sheep won't. Couldn't do that with youngstock so it's swings and roundabouts I suppose.
Keep going it’s not always easy buying stirks
 

Werzle

Member
Location
Midlands
100% worth feeding the calves if selling straight off the cow.

You are indeed correct thou they might not eat 2.5 kilos a day but if they only eat 1 kilo a day it will be very much worth doing!

And the cake would have to be ad lib but if the cows milk well and they have plenty of grass they will not eat anymore than 1 or 2 ish kilos a day anyway.
Im planning on doing with creep what i did with fert, spend the usual amount of money and accept what that buys. I cant see creeping anything on £400/t feed being worth while .
 

hendrebc

Member
Livestock Farmer
Keep going it’s not always easy buying stirks
That's why I've kept on with them that and tb. Stores look good on paper but I know how to run cows rearing calves I wouldn't really know where to start if I wanted to do a good job.
Gone from 25ish cows to 43 to bull this year. Might keep a few more bit don't see me with more than 50 or I'd need some muck storage....
Been offered some dairy cross Hereford calves from next door which would be ideal but I've started down the High herd health route and started a small pedigree herd not sure if it was the right decision but we will see not like dairy calves are in short supply I can always change my mind later.
 

hendrebc

Member
Livestock Farmer
Mine are free range calving now ( ie they calve all year around )

So i will put the feeder out when they go out in the spring, mixed aged and they do not eat that much daily untill Sept/ Oct when the milk/ grass quality drops off.
Mine calve in April and may and they get weaned in November when they come in and I chuck their mothers back out. Thought about creeping tjem sort of mid September onwards as they look great till then but treating the cows like second class citizens like I do means it's a bit hard on the calves at that age when they are eating a lot of grass that isn't really good enough for them. Some are OK but some of the cows probably aren't milky enough especially at that time of year. A bit of creep would probably go a long way and help with weaning check. It's a bit of a hurdle to get my head around when I don't like spending on things that come in bags.
 

Jonp

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Gwent
Mine calve early may and are weaned November. The mother's go to their off farm winter field and I keep the calves at home where they can come and go from the shed as they please. Have hay in shed for them but they tend to spend most of their time outside wandering around the fields and woods. Don't give them creep and sell well in the spring. Retained heifers go to the bull early July.
Hereford X put to Hereford bull.
Looking at the girls today they're in great condition....all they eat is forrage. Can't justify bag food, that's why I run Herefords.
 
Location
Devon
Mine calve in April and may and they get weaned in November when they come in and I chuck their mothers back out. Thought about creeping tjem sort of mid September onwards as they look great till then but treating the cows like second class citizens like I do means it's a bit hard on the calves at that age when they are eating a lot of grass that isn't really good enough for them. Some are OK but some of the cows probably aren't milky enough especially at that time of year. A bit of creep would probably go a long way and help with weaning check. It's a bit of a hurdle to get my head around when I don't like spending on things that come in bags.
If your going to creep them i would suggest starting no later than the last week/ 10 days of Aug, grass quality is already dropping off by then and they go back before you realize it if not feeding early enough.
 

hendrebc

Member
Livestock Farmer
If your going to creep them i would suggest starting no later than the last week/ 10 days of Aug, grass quality is already dropping off by then and they go back before you realize it if not feeding early enough.
Your probably right it would take them a while to start eating it if I started mid September they might not eat it till well into October....
I already have a creep feeder which has hardly been used since we don't have any autumn calvers anymore so I've just done some very rough numbers on a scrap of paper.
If 40 calves are going to eat 2kg a day for 70 days (late August till November) that's 5.6tonne. At £400/t that's £2240. So more rough numbers I'd have to sell off 2 (5% of my calves!) to pay for it :confused:
Better start breeding milkier cows and get rid of the poorer performing ones (which I'm already doing, slow job though)
Anyone want to buy a like new creep feeder?
 

Stw88

Member
Location
Northumberland
Your probably right it would take them a while to start eating it if I started mid September they might not eat it till well into October....
I already have a creep feeder which has hardly been used since we don't have any autumn calvers anymore so I've just done some very rough numbers on a scrap of paper.
If 40 calves are going to eat 2kg a day for 70 days (late August till November) that's 5.6tonne. At £400/t that's £2240. So more rough numbers I'd have to sell off 2 (5% of my calves!) to pay for it :confused:
Better start breeding milkier cows and get rid of the poorer performing ones (which I'm already doing, slow job though)
Anyone want to buy a like new creep feeder?
£56 per calf doesn’t seam bad to me. Bit feed will easily put £150+ on a suckled calf. A lot of folk wouldn’t look at them if there not nicely fleshed and shining.
 

hendrebc

Member
Livestock Farmer
£56 per calf doesn’t seam bad to me. Bit feed will easily put £150+ on a suckled calf. A lot of folk wouldn’t look at them if there not nicely fleshed and shining.
On a suckled calf it would pay yes but I don't sell mine till I've finished them so doesn't matter so much. They bloom once you turn them out I've had calves do over 2kg a day through May and June till mid July. Try and get them out grazing a bit in March it soon improves tthem. Will have red clover silage for them this winter as well that should help too.
I was just thinking how much of a job it would be to split the cows with steer calves from the ones with heifer calves and just creep the steers. Would properly mess up my grazing rotations though. Think I'll just keep breeding for more milk and get rid of the later calving cows it's always the later born ones that look poorest.
 

digger64

Member
Your probably right it would take them a while to start eating it if I started mid September they might not eat it till well into October....
I already have a creep feeder which has hardly been used since we don't have any autumn calvers anymore so I've just done some very rough numbers on a scrap of paper.
If 40 calves are going to eat 2kg a day for 70 days (late August till November) that's 5.6tonne. At £400/t that's £2240. So more rough numbers I'd have to sell off 2 (5% of my calves!) to pay for it :confused:
Better start breeding milkier cows and get rid of the poorer performing ones (which I'm already doing, slow job though)
Anyone want to buy a like new creep feeder?
I used to creep one group near home as I could logistically certainly benefitted the calves and would knock 3 weeks of the age of a finished bull ,but always seemed to loose one or two calves to bloat didnt seem to stack up then .
 

Whitepeak

Member
Livestock Farmer
I've probably done the complete opposite to most today, and put the creep feeder out! Wouldn't normally start feeding until September.
My justification is that the younger the calf, the better their feed conversion efficiency. So hopefully I'll get bigger calves at weaning that will require less concentrate over winter.
This coupled with rotational grazing to hopefully keep the cows milking better, and cutting haylage earlier so hopefully better quality for feeding to weaned calves, will hopefully mean a reduced feed bill this coming winter!
 
I've probably done the complete opposite to most today, and put the creep feeder out! Wouldn't normally start feeding until September.
My justification is that the younger the calf, the better their feed conversion efficiency. So hopefully I'll get bigger calves at weaning that will require less concentrate over winter.
This coupled with rotational grazing to hopefully keep the cows milking better, and cutting haylage earlier so hopefully better quality for feeding to weaned calves, will hopefully mean a reduced feed bill this coming winter!
I've found that a spring calf will only go into a feeder when it's has outgrown its milk supply.
I'd generally be looking at culling the mothers of calves that head to the feeders at 2 or 3 months old, unless they have the excuse of being a twin.
 
I've found that a spring calf will only go into a feeder when it's has outgrown its milk supply.
I'd generally be looking at culling the mothers of calves that head to the feeders at 2 or 3 months old, unless they have the excuse of being a twin.
I would imagine that @Whitepeak's cows, being a terminal sire breed really, have not really been selected on milk supply while on the other hand his calves will have excellent growth potential. So I can see how that would work for him. Your cows will be significantly more milky/dual purpose and really need to be providing all the calf needs, as you say.
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 79 42.0%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 66 35.1%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 16.0%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,291
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top