10 in 7 milking + summer diet

[som farmer]

our accountants are old mill, they do a lot of dairy farms, our chap is adamant the farmers making the most profit, are 120/30 cows, 7500 yield, family/low labour, x2 a day milking, with a good system running. And to be fair, they can break down a lot of dairy farms profit/loss.
next best spring grazing, low input/output His comments on high/ high, best not said, But they are talking average, and like he says, there is a vast difference between top and bottom. And how some continue, is amazing.
But the one trait through, is decide what you want to do, where you want to end up, and stick to it, and do it to the best of your ability. For you, l would say, 2x day, and get someone to take on your outside work, when you can't manage. Its milk that pays the bills, and that time spent milking, is your most profitable.
One thing that is certain, dropping/changing etc, isn't going to impress him, and looking forward, at where prices are heading, you seriously need to keep him happy. When you have got 'going' and doing well, then that is the time to 'experiment', but you have to get going first.

 

[Jdunn55]

I'm just going to throw this out there and see what happens. Brace yourself...

Hit the nuclear button and sell the cows. Disappear abroad for 12 months and milk anywhere that will take you. See the world, learn different ways of doings, experience new things.

Come back refreshed, total new set of eyes on the world and go again.

I'm going to hide behind the sofa and wait for the inevitable onslaught. But I just wanted throw it there.

I guess that is a slightly different angle...

But there is no chance of me ever selling my cows willingly. I would have to be dragged kicking and screaming and when that last cow has been loaded you would find me hanging from a rafter

I know they're just cows to some people but they are honestly everything to me, I've already lost ons herd of cows, I would never ever forgive myself let alone be able to live with myself if I lost them again

 

[som farmer]

I'm just going to throw this out there and see what happens. Brace yourself...

Hit the nuclear button and sell the cows. Disappear abroad for 12 months and milk anywhere that will take you. See the world, learn different ways of doings, experience new things.

Come back refreshed, total new set of eyes on the world and go again.

I'm going to hide behind the sofa and wait for the inevitable onslaught. But I just wanted throw it there.

why hide, its actually quite solid advice.
the problem, is he has a tenancy, and they are extremely difficult to get, and would he get another chance ?
I think there may be more tenancies about, the sheer cost of feed fert etc, is going to force some 'inefficient' farmers, esp sucklers, out. Dairy land around here to rent, is around £200 acre, no sfp. Driven by the pink trouser brigade, looking to maximise their commission, on short term fbt, the result, the land is basically raped, which as we know, eventually lowers the rent, because its screwed.

We were lucky enough to pick up 56 acres, very close to home, 3 people claimed they 'had' it because they tendered the highest rent. We had been asked, if we would like, signed and sealed, weeks before the above, and at less than half, that some tendered, one chap was quite upset, he had drawn up his plans for organic conversion, and bought seed for it. He's stopped putting his hand up, when we pass.

 

[Rossymons]

I guess that is a slightly different angle...

But there is no chance of me ever selling my cows willingly. I would have to be dragged kicking and screaming and when that last cow has been loaded you would find me hanging from a rafter

I know they're just cows to some people but they are honestly everything to me, I've already lost ons herd of cows, I would never ever forgive myself let alone be able to live with myself if I lost them again

I've also lost a herd of cows as well and what i'm suggesting you do is something that I should have done myself.

You see it as a weakness but it isn't - I would say it's a sign of maturity. If we were to look back through your posts on here you've seemingly lurched from one crisis to another. Remember the state you got yourself worked up in when you read the calendar wrong and got your TB and Red Tractor dates mixed up? If it's not that then it's been issues with your milk buyer, your landlords, relief milkers and i'm sure the list would go on.

The next 12 months isn't going to be any easier neither. What if you're too busy chasing around and do your leg in or break an arm? What happens then? Look at the cost of feed, fertiliser, lack of staff plus a whole load of other crap we don't know about yet that will probably blindside you on some idle Tuesday afternoon. What effect is that all going to have an undoubtedly hard working and enthusiastic young man who is having to carry all that on his shoulders? Why should you have to and why should you want to?

Or...

You could sell the milkers and everything due to calve over the next 6 months. Cow price is good and you have good cows. Clean your heels with the bank - they might even agree to a holiday on any debt you have. If your Dad can look after sucklers he can feed your youngstock. Run a beef bull with the heifers to get them incalf. Go anywhere you want - NZ, Australia, US, Canada, Ireland - wherever. Someone like you will be welcomed with open arms.

See the World for what it is, learn from these people, bring all that experience home with you and come up with a plan - a better one than now - and put it into action starting from day one. The World and your World will have settled down then.

You'll see it as a failure but it isn't it. A failure would be to not look at all viable options including the uncomfortable ones. This whole "kicking and screaming" attitude shows a level of immaturity that could seriously be your undoing. The way things are going you could well end up with no cows in the next couple of years. Then what?

All this reminds of a self defence course I done with YFC years ago. The question was asked "What do we do if theres loads of them attacking us?"

"Simple." Said the instructor. "This isn't the movies, guys. You won't beat 5 guys beating the sh!t out of you at once. What you need to do is damage limitation and somehow get out of there, get away safely. Make a plan and go at them with a massive cricket bat with a nail in it!"

That's what you'll be doing. You'll be getting limiting the damage, get away safely and when ready you'll be back to kick the crap out of all of them!

 

[Dairyfarmer2016]

I am a fairly newish starter started milking in 2018 at the age of 32 first generation I bought absolutely anything and I mean anything started with 24 cows, I have always had the attitude that the milk in the tank makes the money. I do all the milking and have a part timer that comes to do up, when I need. With doing all the milking myself I know what every cow gives morning and night I’m now milking 85 cows got up to 120 last year and found all’s I was doing was buying feed/forage and running round like a dic i am now better of financially got two bays of silage left by slowing down a bit and producing less but doing a better job of it! I just plan my job so when I’m on my own the cows get a bit more silage in the feeder so I can feed them after breakfast, when my lad is in I give them a bit less, it works very well I’m not dependant on anyone or anything he can milk the odd time I can’t but I am always surprised at the milk ticket when I don’t milk 1-200 litres down which if you add up is a lot of money. I milk twice a day the morning is set in stone the afternoon is a bit more flexible if I’m busy I might not start till 6 if I’m not and want to get done I start at 4 it works for me. Why not strip the job right back do 90% of the milking and feeding calves yourself get a young someone to come and do up people seem to like been out and about a lot more than stood in a pit that’s my thoughts anyway

 

[easy farming]

@Jdunn55

We've tried in the past to help you but you always seemed blinkered on one idea or another. I've been there where you've been you've got your plan and you're bloody going to make it work and that you know best. Trust me, i've been there.

But it seems the penny has dropped now and that you're happy to be helped so go through this thread and listen to some of the advice given. Not all of it will appeal to you but some of it will.

If it was me doing this I would ditch the idea of 7000l cows especially with the cost of various inputs. Why spend so much money making it? Staff are causing you an issue, you have the gear to make silage plus whatever else you need to do. Ditch that extra 1000l thats TAD will give you, make life easier for yourself and learn to chill out a bit.

Would be my advice for you. You're only your age once and trust me - there is more to these summers on earth than worrying yourself milking cows.

I think he is a member on here of one of the best discussion groups that I have ever attended.

 

[early riser]

@Jdunn55 I might be missing something but if milking only takes 90 mins each end of the day why don’t you just milk your own cows and get someone else to do the tractor work I.e. a contractor, then you can get away with running minimal kit as well.

if milking was a 3-4hr job each end of the day then fair enough, but 90 mins each end of the day surely not much of a issue is it?

I’ve been in a similar situation to you running round like a headless chicken and my advice would be get someone in to do the other work and concentrate on the cows. It will be far easier to find someone to steer a tractor or do fencing etc than it will be to find a decent milker you can trust

just my 2p worth

 

[RJ1]

@Jdunn55 I might be missing something but if milking only takes 90 mins each end of the day why don’t you just milk your own cows and get someone else to do the tractor work I.e. a contractor, then you can get away with running minimal kit as well.

if milking was a 3-4hr job each end of the day then fair enough, but 90 mins each end of the day surely not much of a issue is it?

I’ve been in a similar situation to you running round like a headless chicken and my advice would be get someone in to do the other work and concentrate on the cows. It will be far easier to find someone to steer a tractor or do fencing etc than it will be to find a decent milker you can trust

just my 2p worth

With the crazy and ever increasing cost of machinery, this is surely getting to be a bigger consideration. Minimal kit is how I see us proceeding - do the fert and mowing.

 

[som farmer]

take a look at history, in the 1920's where ag was dire, the dog and stick approach kept many going through those times.
While ag prices are better, they still lag behind costs. Many farmers have, and like, big expensive machinery, perhaps we should look more closely at some of the things we do, and even dare, to take a few steps back. I can remember being told, in 2000'ish, that dairy farmers should have no need, for a tractor bigger than 100hp, we have one at 160. Many farmers seem to think, bigger is better, not just in machinery either, beef, yields, herd size, just perhaps, we ought to think about that policy.

 

[dinderleat]

@Jdunn55 theres plenty of options you can do, not just 2. If you can’t milk the cows yourself in your situation then something Fundamentally is going wrong either time management or not prioritising the cows. The cows will nearly always pay the bills. Just stick with a decision and get your head down, you are more than capable as you’ve shown how far you have come.

 

[Jdunn55]

Right long story short I'm accidentally trying it...

So I had no intentions of doing this right this second but:

Yesterday morning I milked at 5:30am as per normal
I had a day of problems (main one being scraper tractor went bang and no evening relief milker), didn't start milking until 9:30pm and finished at 11pm, by the time I made and ate tea I didn't get to bed until midnight and then wasn't feeling very fresh this morning, so didn't start until 8am (cows weren't remotely fussed)
I've had loads to catch up on today (because of yesterday) and have just finished feeding the calves, I went to go and turn the parlour on having got the cows in from the field just before I fed the calves, every single cow was either lying down in a cubicle or eating silage. There was not a single cow waiting at the back of the parlour (doors were all open) waiting to be milked like normal and so I have said f*ck it, but will be up early tomorrow instead just in case.
Relief is meant to be in tomorrow afternoon and then Monday I am on my own anyway, so I shall see what the collection is like tomorrow before i decide what to do for Monday

I'll keep you updated

 

[Dairyfarmer2016]

I wouldn’t feel comfortable changing and flitting to one thing then another milk twice a day morning set in stone two hours every morning at the same time end of. You have the rest of the day until 4/5 pm to do what ever calves fencing field work etc hour and a half in the evening you milk again press the red button and get yourself in! Alls in my mind you are doing is complicating a fairly easy routine and as I have learnt in my short time milking is complication costs an absolute fortune financially and mentally! Life is complicated enough without adding to it!! Keep it simple for your own sake! If your relief can’t turn up at fixed times what hope in hells chance have you got him coming at different times every day

 

[Jdunn55]

I wouldn’t feel comfortable changing and flitting to one thing then another milk twice a day morning set in stone two hours every morning at the same time end of. You have the rest of the day until 4/5 pm to do what ever calves fencing field work etc hour and a half in the evening you milk again press the red button and get yourself in! Alls in my mind you are doing is complicating a fairly easy routine and as I have learnt in my short time milking is complication costs an absolute fortune financially and mentally! Life is complicated enough without adding to it!! Keep it simple for your own sake! If your relief can’t turn up at fixed times what hope in hells chance have you got him coming at different times every day

Don't worry I am far from comfortable, already getting cold feet, going to have tea and I'll head back out in a bit and see what theyre up to, if they are waiting (and trust me theyll let me know) for milking I'll start the parlour up but if they are still seemingly happy I shall give it a go. If it doesn't work this time I won't try it again so it is one shot and one shot only.
Regarding the milker, if i go down this route he won't be coming in at all...

 

[coomoo]

Don't worry I am far from comfortable, already getting cold feet, going to have tea and I'll head back out in a bit and see what theyre up to, if they are waiting (and trust me theyll let me know) for milking I'll start the parlour up but if they are still seemingly happy I shall give it a go. If it doesn't work this time I won't try it again so it is one shot and one shot only.
Regarding the milker, if i go down this route he won't be coming in at all...

Got my low group going out tomorrow. Earliest yet. Sometimes when all is said and done in farming you trust your gut and make it work. Grab a beer and watch the second half of the rugby your decision is made now.

 

[Beef farmer]

You need to give it 10 days. Not siht yourself at the 1st milk ticket and change back

 

[Beef farmer]

Even If there all parked at the parlour, they will only stand there 10 min before they f**k off

 

[Cows 'n grass]

I think systems like 10 in 7 will have a significant part to play in the dairy industry going forward but I don't think it's for you right now. It will bugger up your Tuesday and Thursday so that you lose productive time in the morning and you will definitely lose yield if you're aiming for 7500. 13 milkings a week could well suit you though, just milking once at 8/9am on a Sunday will give you a lie in and a bit of time off on a day that shouldn't be productive anyway.

There seems to be a misconception on here about grazing cows all being 'grass rats'. It's completely possible to run a low cost system with pedigree or crossbred cows that are functional, profitable and also easy on the eye. It's a shame you couldn't have done a season in NZ before you settled down, there are 1000s of pedigree herds out there with breeders who's passion in life is dairy genetics yet the cows are run on a 100% commercial basis with a focus on profit from grazing cows on a no frills system.

 

[Jdunn55]

Got my low group going out tomorrow. Earliest yet. Sometimes when all is said and done in farming you trust your gut and make it work. Grab a beer and watch the second half of the rugby your decision is made now.

I'm afraid I'm a cider man... me + an open fire tends to lead to me sleeping in about 30 seconds so I very well could wake up and it be 4am tomorrow...

 

[O'Reilly]

They'll only holler if they see you. Stay in, get some sleep. Google 'focussed farmers' might help.

 

[Jdunn55]

You need to give it 10 days. Not siht yourself at the 1st milk ticket and change back

I'm getting twitchy I won't lie, and am now wondering what the hell I've done...