Afghanistan on brink of starvation

Seems that the 300,000 troops which the west (UK and US) "Trained" never actually existed other than on a payroll list - Surely the Trainers had an idea of how many they were training ? Or was it the same 30,000 got "trained" 10 times ??
 
deal making is what makes the world work or not work? so make a deal with the US i,ll trade the military hardware left behind by the military the US recons it amounts to billions of dollars? for food, simple?

The hardware was pre-dominantly Afghan owned (US/NATO donated modified/downgraded equipment that was too expensive to transport home).

It is also difficult to do a deal with a government which has very little recognition. So the US are not going to buy back any aged-equipment it has already off-loaded and has no use for, from a government that it does not recognise.

Doing a straight financial transaction with the Taliban will not solve the food supply crisis; it will simply fill Taliban coffers, with a lot diverted to other accounts, never to be seen again; and certainly won't be used to the benefit of the Afghan public which are in need.
 
Last edited:
Seems that the 300,000 troops which the west (UK and US) "Trained" never actually existed other than on a payroll list - Surely the Trainers had an idea of how many they were training ? Or was it the same 30,000 got "trained" 10 times ??

ISAF trained many thousands of Afghans, military and police. Some stayed on the payroll, many others did not and (part of the endemic corruption issue in Afghanistan) there were "ghosts" on the payroll; including some entire units. Some were found out and dealt with, quite a lot weren't.

It was quite hard to change a centuries old culture and way of thinking.

One of the primary issues which led to the collapse of the Afghan military, was the corruption. Senior officers syphoning off the funds that should have been used to pay soldiers wages, and pay for equipment and supplies. No one was going to fight if they weren't equipped properly, and not getting paid.

Afghans also have a very fluid loyalty; and can change sides depending on who is the likely winner that day, or who they were talking to at that moment.
 

Campbell

Member
Location
Herefordshire
images.jpg

Found this a good read, the title says it all. Just one of the many books written.
 
View attachment 996666

Found this a good read, the title says it all. Just one of the many books written.
Try this book for a western perspective on the wider area

 

How much

Member
Location
North East
Its a terrible shame but when there are so many counties that are rich in many respects but corrupt to the core that the general population should suffer as much , this is true of many parts of the world and this is especially true today in light of the revelations about the former Afgan government not even having anywhere near the security /military they claimed to have and the people in charge simply pocketing the cash that was meant to be paying them !! How many people have died because of that , would the country still be a "free" society had they not done so and made themselves richer , and where are these people now ?
Now as an Islamic state how does that level with the population that the religion will see them through and keep them safe , Allah has allot to answer for !
Should We the so called "infidels" in the west step in and help out a county in dire need ? or should we leave it to other Islamic countries to do ?
How safe would western charity workers be if we did step in ? could you trust Afgan government and forces to distribute food without turning it into another fiddle job , I think maybe not.
 

bluebell

Member
but is it any of our business? how other people live behave in another country? thats the whole problem in my opinion the west, ie america with the uk following, trying to impose our way of life on other countries? We in the west might not, dont agree with the way they live ,work, worship, organise running the country, but hey if they dont like it its not for us to impose our way?
 
Its a terrible shame but when there are so many counties that are rich in many respects but corrupt to the core that the general population should suffer as much , this is true of many parts of the world and this is especially true today in light of the revelations about the former Afgan government not even having anywhere near the security /military they claimed to have and the people in charge simply pocketing the cash that was meant to be paying them !! How many people have died because of that , would the country still be a "free" society had they not done so and made themselves richer , and where are these people now ?
Now as an Islamic state how does that level with the population that the religion will see them through and keep them safe , Allah has allot to answer for !
Should We the so called "infidels" in the west step in and help out a county in dire need ? or should we leave it to other Islamic countries to do ?
How safe would western charity workers be if we did step in ? could you trust Afgan government and forces to distribute food without turning it into another fiddle job , I think maybe not.

There is no Afghanistan in the Western sense. Afghanistan only exists as a demarcated piece of land on the globe. It's populace is split along historical, racial and societal lines that often go back many generations. Only a small portion of the population would consider themselves Afghan in the same way a Briton would consider themselves British and a member of British society. Even how a person would identify themselves in Afghanistan will vary. Some people identify themselves based on the region they live in, what language their speak or where their extended family came from. There is no universal rule for this.

This video explains it if you have 45 minutes of interest in the topic.




This video helps explain why international efforts made toward peace-keeping, humanitarian missions or the like in the region face some serious challenges. A very interesting and historic place, which I would love to genuinely visit were it safe to do so.
 
The hardware was pre-dominantly Afghan owned (US/NATO donated modified/downgraded equipment that was too expensive to transport home).

It is also difficult to do a deal with a government which has very little recognition. So the US are not going to buy back any aged-equipment it has already off-loaded and has no use for, from a government that it does not recognise.

Doing a straight financial transaction with the Taliban will not solve the food supply crisis; it will simply fill Taliban coffers, with a lot diverted to other accounts, never to be seen again; and certainly won't be used to the benefit of the Afghan public which are in need.

The USA had no concern it was leaving what it did behind. Anything worthwhile will have been taken away. The remainder was supposed to be issued to the government forces of Afghanistan.

The USA have demonstrated that they are plenty good enough at destroying vehicles and equipment if the requirement to do so ever turns up at a later date.

I guess the USA have been disposing of Humvees for years anyway as they don't suit the needs of their forces any longer and they are being replaced by other machines.

Some aircraft were left, well that is fine but you won't fly even a transport aircraft for long without proper servicing and parts trails. I guess some of those airframes will be wrecked anyway and no good except for scrap metal.
 
The USA had no concern it was leaving what it did behind. Anything worthwhile will have been taken away. The remainder was supposed to be issued to the government forces of Afghanistan.

The USA have demonstrated that they are plenty good enough at destroying vehicles and equipment if the requirement to do so ever turns up at a later date.

I guess the USA have been disposing of Humvees for years anyway as they don't suit the needs of their forces any longer and they are being replaced by other machines.

Some aircraft were left, well that is fine but you won't fly even a transport aircraft for long without proper servicing and parts trails. I guess some of those airframes will be wrecked anyway and no good except for scrap metal.

You only need to look at the colour schemes and unit badges to see that the equipment had already been handed over to, and was in service with, the Afghans.

Humvees have been on the way out for quite some time. The cost of transportation back home versus the cost of handing them over (and been seen to do the charitable thing), it became a "no brainer"; added to the potential ongoing contracts of maintaining the western made equipment with parts and expertise. Iran and China will probably assist on maintenance to a certain extent.

Equipment handed over were basic shells, with no sophisticated/classified technology included. Like most news stories, the media would have you believe that the US nuclear codes were left behind. It's a similar situation to the equipment left behind following the Russian withdrawal.
 
To get away from the military hardware discussion, and back on topic of Afghan food supply... here are some photos taken in September 2014, in the peaceful area of Bamyan (one of the few places you could stop and take photos), and some Afghan potato farmers (and his dog):

View attachment 996688
View attachment 996689View attachment 996690View attachment 996691View attachment 996692View attachment 996693View attachment 996694
View attachment 996696

Fantastic. Look at the place. It's not going to change in 1000 years.
 

le bon paysan

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Limousin, France
How will they punish anyone that goes against their religion if they don’t have guns? There will be working women and beardless men running riot…….

Things look pretty hopeless for those stuck in Afghanistan and no doubt thousands will starve to death praying to a god for help which in the past seemed to help in the form of aid agencies but doesn’t like that is a option now.
How many Jews were executed praying for help? Many didn’t fight because they believed prayer was the answer?
Its the 80th anniversary of 'Kristallnacht' tonight.
 
Last edited:

TheRanger

Member
Location
SW Scotland
Have watched a lot of documentaries about Afghanistan over the years and have always wondered how they managed to feed a population of 30 million people.

It always seems to be barren hill or dusty mud plains when they show aerial footage. Any green bits seem to be growing opium.
 

PostHarvest

Member
Location
Warwick
always wondered how they managed to feed a population of 30 million people.
In between the mountains and desert areas there is some quite decent land and some pretty determined farmers and huge irrigation systems. One problem is a bit like UK diverting land to grow energy crops, they are using large areas to grow opium poppy as its much more profitable. When I was there, in the Western areas that didn't grow poppy they were farming with ox ploughs, in Helmand where they do grow poppy, there were 3 MF dealers in Lashkargah town.
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 79 42.0%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 66 35.1%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 16.0%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,292
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top