agronomy

[holly smoke]

evening all

new on here so bear with me
we are currently using 1 of the main agronomy firms to do the crop walking but recently been thinking about changing as the price we are paying for chemical seems a lot more that posted on here.
230 acres split between w wheat, w barley, s barley, w osr, w beans
would it be cheaper to go independent and pay a fee or stick with a all in firm

many thanks hs

 

[Clive]

evening all

new on here so bear with me
we are currently using 1 of the main agronomy firms to do the crop walking but recently been thinking about changing as the price we are paying for chemical seems a lot more that posted on here.
230 acres split between w wheat, w barley, s barley, w osr, w beans
would it be cheaper to go independent and pay a fee or stick with a all in firm

many thanks hs

Probabaly cheaper with independant but depends on what level of service you are getting or expect and how much over you have been paying for inputs ?

Independant wil cost circa £15/ha (weekly visits) which isn’t a massive amount of inputs to save or buy cheaper

 

[An Gof]

evening all

new on here so bear with me
we are currently using 1 of the main agronomy firms to do the crop walking but recently been thinking about changing as the price we are paying for chemical seems a lot more that posted on here.
230 acres split between w wheat, w barley, s barley, w osr, w beans
would it be cheaper to go independent and pay a fee or stick with a all in firm

many thanks hs

If you want some involvement yourself join NIABTAG. @Fromebridge can point you in the right direction

 

[John Slejpner]

Probably is the case that Clive is being very diplomatic above by starting his response with the word "Probably"

ps one of us can't spell pobably and i think it's me!

 

[holly smoke]

hi thanks for the reply's
we get 1 visit every 14 days at the moment. we have a new agronomist that has just taken over and I am not overlay impressed.
he told us to put a growth reg on the spring barley that is only at 2 -3 leaf stage and that it needed slug pellets as they were hammering it ( slugs don't pull the entire plant out and leave it on the surface) also a growth reg on the wheat that isn't knee high ( we use all the straw so need as much as we can get )

 

[Clive]

hi thanks for the reply's
we get 1 visit every 14 days at the moment. we have a new agronomist that has just taken over and I am not overlay impressed.
he told us to put a growth reg on the spring barley that is only at 2 -3 leaf stage and that it needed slug pellets as they were hammering it ( slugs don't pull the entire plant out and leave it on the surface) also a growth reg on the wheat that isn't knee high ( we use all the straw so need as much as we can get )

Is he partial to expensive trace elements and has an unexplained addiction to insecticides as well maybe ?

Do you find yourself buying chemicals with names you can’t buy from others or active mixes unique to them ?

If so it’s time to start asking some aukward questions !

Don’t get me wrong, there is nothing wrong for paying more for serviced agronomy but ONLY if the advice is sound and worth the input premium.

 

[holly smoke]

I think he is fairly new at this and wants to through every thing at the crops but there is a limit as to what and when. we have done a t0 but no t1 as the wheat's are clean just done a t2 at £20 per acre I will see about a t3 but it will have to be cheap if they stay clean

 

[Clive]

I think he is fairly new at this and wants to through every thing at the crops but there is a limit as to what and when. we have done a t0 but no t1 as the wheat's are clean just done a t2 at £20 per acre I will see about a t3 but it will have to be cheap if they stay clean

What will your total spray spend be on your wheat , barley, beans or OSR be this year ? Maybe others on here could help you benchmark

 

[holly smoke]

spray cost on osr is £241 per ha not including fert
wheat is at £100 so far not including the t2

 

[franklin]

Independent best. But think from their point of view. At £6 an acre say you will pay them £1500 a year. What do you want them to do for that? If you want a visit every week and five different crops walked, a cup of tea and a chat, your NMax paperwork doing, your hands holding if you get an inspection you are not going to get it. I think if they have to travel more than half an hour to get to you, the best you could expect at that rate would be an hour a week, or two hours every other week.

On a small scale, you want to be asking who your neighbours use and at the very least getting one of them to come and do it so they can almost "block-crop" you as customers.

 

[robbie]

I was(and still am a bit)with a serviced agro with the company with the two eye's.

I got good service but was paying through the nose for Chems and despite my protests there was always a pet product or two in the order. So this year I put him on a reduced acreage fee of £2 acre and joined niab tag.

I still have him do all my n max and nvz paper work and he walks my beet,Will come out as and when I need him and is always on the end of the phone for any queries.

Niab tag membership is brilliant and is worth every penny ,so much so I've done all the cereal agronomy myself this year with the help of there strategy books and other documents.

It doesn't take long buying aviator instead of boogy, teb/proline instead of kestrel and ally max instead of ink sx to save the cost of the membership and I find it a very rewarding thing to do myself.

 

[SilliamWhale]

spray cost on osr is £241 per ha not including fert
wheat is at £100 so far not including the t2

£241 per ha on OSR for chemicals alone? f**king hell.

 

[franklin]

So this year I put him on a reduced acreage fee of £2 acre and joined niab tag.

Do you keep him on his toes with the prices of the basics, or do you put it all through a buying group and just dodge the Boogie?

 

[yellow belly]

I was(and still am a bit)with a serviced agro with the company with the two eye's.

I got good service but was paying through the nose for Chems and despite my protests there was always a pet product or two in the order. So this year I put him on a reduced acreage fee of £2 acre and joined niab tag.

I still have him do all my n max and nvz paper work and he walks my beet,Will come out as and when I need him and is always on the end of the phone for any queries.

Niab tag membership is brilliant and is worth every penny ,so much so I've done all the cereal agronomy myself this year with the help of there strategy books and other documents.

It doesn't take long buying aviator instead of boogy, teb/proline instead of kestrel and ally max instead of ink sx to save the cost of the membership and I find it a very rewarding thing to do myself.

Did the same when my serviced agronomist retired after 30 years
Been a NIAB tag members since the cereal centres came east
Son will be basis qualified later this year

If you grow your own crops you are capable of doing your own field walking especially if you sit on the seat for fertiliser and spraying

 

[holly smoke]

Do you keep him on his toes with the prices of the basics, or do you put it all through a buying group and just dodge the Boogie?

No ever thing comes through them
I have questioned the price before and compared with neighbours and we always seem to be paying more

 

[DrWazzock]

I do my own agronomy. I joined NIAB tag for a couple of years. I might even join again when the all the bumf they sent me gets a bit out of date.

Surprising what you can find on the net as well. Loads of info out there if you can sift the wheat from the chaff.

I think we lose confidence in our own ability and get frightened by a lot of these "experts".

 

[AndrewM]

fully serviced agronomy on a small area can sometimes really take the pee.
they recommend high doses of their high margin product, and can add a fair mark up on top aswell, plus chuck in aload of high margin trace elements, and adjuvants, because they think u dont know any better.
get an independent agronomist in, get a shopping list from him, and shop around.
with a small area, your never going to get the best price, due to lack of purchasing power, but u should be able to get a sensible price.
for example i payed £302 a can for siltra off our old fully serviced supplier this year, have since found it for £255 from a competitor, u can guess where my business is going now.

 

[franklin]

No ever thing comes through them
I have questioned the price before and compared with neighbours and we always seem to be paying more

If you have a neighbour with similar land and cropping; they get good yields and their crops look tidy; and their agron is independent then ask for his or her details. Put chem through buying group. Join TAG and get familiar with the products. That would be a strong first suggestion.

 

[curlietailz]

£241 per ha on OSR for chemicals alone? fudgeing hell.

Wow
My spend so far for OSR is £80/ha
Independent agronomist
Cost c £7.5/ha/year

Will need some more fungicide though,

Last years total spend was £155/ha on OSR including adjuvants, & dessicants

 

[snipe]

We went to an independent agronomist and joined a buying group18months ago and with the help of a lot of people on here, mostly the one who have already posted above we have reduced the amount of chemical we buy and the amount we pay for it. I have been farming all my life now 42 and have learnt more in the last 18 months about agri chemicals than in all the previous years. You soon get your agronomists area fee and buys group membership fee back.