AHDB put all Red Tractor funding on hold

[Tarw Coch]

I don't give the assessor any jip , they're doing a job .

However a RT knob rung me after I'd consumed alcohol .... oops

I can see it now, a new RT rule coming in after the next “consultation” farmers must not consume alcohol

 

[steveR]

I don't give the assessor any jip , they're doing a job .

However a RT knob rung me after I'd consumed alcohol .... oops

G'won.... More info

 

[Drillman]

I can see it now, a new RT rule coming in after the next “consultation” farmers must not consume alcohol

Farmers must not discredit red tractor, the great saviour of farming on social media!

 

[Steevo]

Needs to be nominated as farming hero of 2021.

Very much. This crossed my mind a few days ago and I'm glad these comments have jogged it again.

It struck me that @Grass And Grain should be nominated for a Farmers Weekly award.

By sheer coincience when I Googled for it tonight it turns out that the awards ceremony is actually being hosted TONIGHT - 7pm in London.

Looking through the categories, there is one which describes it perfectly..... (i'll let you add your own punchline about the award sponsor!)

 

[Tarw Coch]

Very much. This crossed my mind a few days ago and I'm glad these comments have jogged it again.

It struck me that @Grass And Grain should be nominated for a Farmers Weekly award.

By sheer coincience when I Googled for it tonight it turns out that the awards ceremony is actually being hosted TONIGHT - 7pm in London.

Looking through the categories, there is one which describes it perfectly..... (i'll let you add your own punchline about the award sponsor!)

View attachment 989955

Look who the sponsor is, if they have any say then he hasn’t a chance............ on the other hand, if they don’t have any say it would be priceless!

 

[Steevo]

Look who the sponsor is, if they have any say then he hasn’t a chance............ on the other hand, if they don’t have any say it would be priceless!

I did say I’d let you add your own punchline about the sponsor….!

 

[yellowbelly]

Am I just being cynical, or are the AHDB running scared??

I believe they've just lost the vote by the horticultural boys about the amount of levy they have to pay, so I reckon they've decided to keep you cereal guys 'onside' (and not risk you all thinking about doing the same) by bringing RT into line.

Just a thought.

 

[SilliamWhale]

Am I just being cynical, or are the AHDB running scared??

I believe they've just lost the vote by the horticultural boys about the amount of levy they have to pay, so I reckon they've decided to keep you cereal guys 'onside' (and not risk you all thinking about doing the same) by bringing RT into line.

Just a thought.

Possibly. I mean what is the point of the AHDB if they're not going to engage?

 

[Grass And Grain]

Am I just being cynical, or are the AHDB running scared??

I believe they've just lost the vote by the horticultural boys about the amount of levy they have to pay, so I reckon they've decided to keep you cereal guys 'onside' (and not risk you all thinking about doing the same) by bringing RT into line.

Just a thought.

They just need to get a new AHDB approved pesticide declaration standard accepted by mills and put us a little tick box on the passport. One standard accepted by mills for all grain from all countries, giving us equivalence to imports. Job done, happy farmers, prosperous AHDB.

Failure = big risk to AHDB, and they can blame NFU, RT, AIC and also themselves. Remember, AHDB are guarantors to the private company of RT, the assurance system has cut off our markets for non-assured levy payers, singling us out for extra compliance costs compared to the intake requirements for every and any other country in the world.

Our industry representatives have done this to us, whilst the farmers have picked up the bill for all their salaries.

When this all started, we were the first country to have FA, and none of the importing countries did, so it was bound to single us out and add additional costs to us. Didn't take a genius to work that out, yet NFU and AHDB backed the formation of RT.

20 years on, and the feed grain intake standards still differentiate between imports and UK grain, with imports having no requirement for FA.

What were they thinking. Our representatives made it harder for the farmers they represent to access their home markets. They put an additional layer of cost between UK farmer and mill.

 

[carbonfibre farmer]

Farmers must not discredit red tractor, the great saviour of farming on social media!

@Barleymow

 

[Barleymow]

@Barleymow

I would never publicly criticise them ,they want me to talk to them directly

 

[tullah]

They just need to get a new AHDB approved pesticide declaration standard accepted by mills and put us a little tick box on the passport. One standard accepted by mills for all grain from all countries, giving us equivalence to imports. Job done, happy farmers, prosperous AHDB.

Failure = big risk to AHDB, and they can blame NFU, RT, AIC and also themselves. Remember, AHDB are guarantors to the private company of RT, the assurance system has cut off our markets for non-assured levy payers, singling us out for extra compliance costs compared to the intake requirements for every and any other country in the world.

Our industry representatives have done this to us, whilst the farmers have picked up the bill for all their salaries.

When this all started, we were the first country to have FA, and none of the importing countries did, so it was bound to single us out and add additional costs to us. Didn't take a genius to work that out, yet NFU and AHDB backed the formation of RT.

20 years on, and the feed grain intake standards still differentiate between imports and UK grain, with imports having no requirement for FA.

What were they thinking. Our representatives made it harder for the farmers they represent to access their home markets. They put an additional layer of cost between UK farmer and mill.

Blame lays firmly at Nfu door. What were they thinking about. Well we know a little more what they were thinking about. People have been digging on here and it transpires they actually own a share of the money grabbing quango. No wonder they don't want to give it up. Conflict of interests is nothing compared to this behind the scenes theft.
Just think if we hadn't bothered to dig, the Nfu and the rest of the gravy train would have continued this racket for years and bled us dry. These people have at last got a shock coming.

 

[Grass And Grain]

Needs to be nominated as farming hero of 2021.

Very much. This crossed my mind a few days ago and I'm glad these comments have jogged it again.

It struck me that @Grass And Grain should be nominated for a Farmers Weekly award.

By sheer coincience when I Googled for it tonight it turns out that the awards ceremony is actually being hosted TONIGHT - 7pm in London.

Looking through the categories, there is one which describes it perfectly..... (i'll let you add your own punchline about the award sponsor!)

View attachment 989955

Haha, they'd love me wouldn't they.

Nominated for giving the sponsors grief and pointing out how they've elected to make UK farmers less competitive in the marketplace.

Suppose it might be a different sponsor next year. OMG, hope it's not the, the, the... No, it's just no good, can't bring myself to even type the letters.

How about, just for a laugh, nominating someone who's been doing the exact opposite to the award category description. Answers on a postcard.

 

[Drillman]

Assured Food Standards - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Now we all know Wikipedia isn’t perfect but looking closely at the above link it appears that not only is the NFU listed as parent company but that Neville Rolfe woman is also still involved!

Neville Rolfe was the one who voted to lower food standards while in charge of red tractor for anyone who doesn’t know!

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Am I just being cynical, or are the AHDB running scared??

I believe they've just lost the vote by the horticultural boys about the amount of levy they have to pay, so I reckon they've decided to keep you cereal guys 'onside' (and not risk you all thinking about doing the same) by bringing RT into line.

Just a thought.

It just occurred to me, reading your post, that AHDB may even be in breach of the law. By supporting red tractor, they are actually working against their levy payers.

Obviously that goes against the spirit and the letter of their remit to develop and improve access to markets and is 100% wrong in the first place, but is it illegal as well? If AHDB is found to be acting illegally, they are in deep do do.

I expect the legal department may be looking at this quite carefully.

 

[roscoe erf]

Its definitely corrupt Where is the moral compass?

its where the sun don’t shine and no I don’t mean Wales

 

[Grass And Grain]

It just occurred to me, reading your post, that AHDB may even be in breach of the law. By supporting red tractor, they are actually working against their levy payers.

Obviously that goes against the spirit and the letter of their remit to develop and improve access to markets and is 100% wrong in the first place, but is it illegal as well? If AHDB is found to be acting illegally, they are in deep do do.

I expect the legal department may be looking at this quite carefully.

One thing for certain is that supporting RT has without doubt cut off markets for non-assured levy payers.

To put that into context - 20 years ago we were all non-assured levy payers.

That one move by AHDB and NFU meant that we then all had to join RT, with the background that practically no other countries had FA. It was obviously going to put us at a competitive disadvantage.

We ended up with either losing our market access if we weren't RT members, or we had to join RT to access the same markers as the non-assured foreign grain producers.

Nice work.

Who was actually responsible at the time for this at NFU and AHDB? It was a completely and utterly the wrong move.

Our industry leaders orchastrated a system by which the supposedly premium RT brand was also the base spec set for the feed mills.

Making RT the base spec for UK grain into a feed mill meant that the RT grain was never going to command a premium. That should have been obvious.

That's why we need the base spec for UK grain into the feed mills set at an equal to imports pesricide declaration.

Firstly, thar gives us a level playingfield.

Secondly, it means that any users who require RT grain, then must pay a genuine premium to get the grain, otherwise the farmers will sell it to the feed mill that only requires the base spec.

This one structural failing is why RT has never worked for UK grain farmers. Never produced a premium, and always been hated by farmers.

Correct this structure, and then RT can be truly valued by farmers, and farmers will have a market and premium driven choice of being RT assured or not.

Then RT have to work hard to command premiums. They have to work harder than ever to create their brand, and they have to work harder than ever to attract farmers.

No premium price = no farmer members.

Good RT premium price = lots of farmer members.

It would be market led, and RT wouls need to excel in order to survive. That's no bad thing.


And why

 

[Drillman]

One thing for certain is that supporting RT has without doubt cut off markets for non-assured levy payers.

To put that into context - 20 years ago we were all non-assured levy payers.

That one move by AHDB and NFU meant that we then all had to join RT, with the background that practically no other countries had FA. It was obviously going to put us at a competitive disadvantage.

We ended up with either losing our market access if we weren't RT members, or we had to join RT to access the same markers as the non-assured foreign grain producers.

Nice work.

Who was actually responsible at the time for this at NFU and AHDB? It was a completely and utterly the wrong move.

Our industry leaders orchastrated a system by which the supposedly premium RT brand was also the base spec set for the feed mills.

Making RT the base spec for UK grain into a feed mill meant that the RT grain was never going to command a premium. That should have been obvious.

That's why we need the base spec for UK grain into the feed mills set at an equal to imports pesricide declaration.

Firstly, thar gives us a level playingfield.

Secondly, it means that any users who require RT grain, then must pay a genuine premium to get the grain, otherwise the farmers will sell it to the feed mill that only requires the base spec.

This one structural failing is why RT has never worked for UK grain farmers. Never produced a premium, and always been hated by farmers.

Correct this structure, and then RT can be truly valued by farmers, and farmers will have a market and premium driven choice of being RT assured or not.

Then RT have to work hard to command premiums. They have to work harder than ever to create their brand, and they have to work harder than ever to attract farmers.

No premium price = no farmer members.

Good RT premium price = lots of farmer members.

It would be market led, and RT wouls need to excel in order to survive. That's no bad thing.


And why

This is where the whole rt business model fails,

the brand as they call it only works to pay money to rt. They claim there a not for profit organisation yet soak up £4.5 million I believe, from farmers, and other companies who pay to use there logo! And also the AHDB used to pay them some as well.

What the hell do they do with all the money? Management must be on a nice salary!

They have no intention of making money for farmers, All there interested in is making money for themselves.

going forwards I don’t think they have the ability to move there business into a place where they can negotiate a premium on behalf of the farmer,

The mills etc won’t pay it when there’s a cheaper alternative.

this is where red tractor will fail. And is why there being so evasive of questions!

Edit- I’ve said in the past that rt would do well to have some competition it would give them chance to shine. I now realise I’m wrong, red tractor are terrified of competition as they know anything farmer led will wipe the floor with them as we’re approaching it from a totally different angle, doing the right thing for UK AG going forwards rather than just sucking money out for no gain!

 

[tullah]

One thing for certain is that supporting RT has without doubt cut off markets for non-assured levy payers.

To put that into context - 20 years ago we were all non-assured levy payers.

That one move by AHDB and NFU meant that we then all had to join RT, with the background that practically no other countries had FA. It was obviously going to put us at a competitive disadvantage.

We ended up with either losing our market access if we weren't RT members, or we had to join RT to access the same markers as the non-assured foreign grain producers.

Nice work.

Who was actually responsible at the time for this at NFU and AHDB? It was a completely and utterly the wrong move.

Our industry leaders orchastrated a system by which the supposedly premium RT brand was also the base spec set for the feed mills.

Making RT the base spec for UK grain into a feed mill meant that the RT grain was never going to command a premium. That should have been obvious.

That's why we need the base spec for UK grain into the feed mills set at an equal to imports pesricide declaration.

Firstly, thar gives us a level playingfield.

Secondly, it means that any users who require RT grain, then must pay a genuine premium to get the grain, otherwise the farmers will sell it to the feed mill that only requires the base spec.

This one structural failing is why RT has never worked for UK grain farmers. Never produced a premium, and always been hated by farmers.

Correct this structure, and then RT can be truly valued by farmers, and farmers will have a market and premium driven choice of being RT assured or not.

Then RT have to work hard to command premiums. They have to work harder than ever to create their brand, and they have to work harder than ever to attract farmers.

No premium price = no farmer members.

Good RT premium price = lots of farmer members.

It would be market led, and RT wouls need to excel in order to survive. That's no bad thing.


And why

But would you do business ever again with that same crowd involved with RT, Nfu etc. no matter what premium they offered?

 

[Grass And Grain]

But would you do business ever again with that same crowd involved with RT, Nfu etc. no matter what premium they offered.

Would be personal choice for individual businesses, and would depend if end users would pay a decent premium for this oh so valued RT grain. Or if those same end users would not be prepared to pay the premium.

Let's pretend we're livestock farmers.

Mill A tries to sell me feed. Sales rep says they purchase boggy basic grain. Their feed is £300/t.

Mill B only purchases RT grain. Sales rep tries to sell me his feed. It's £303/t.

So what happens? In feed sector, I suspect Mill B sells very little feed, and goes bankrupt. I suspect Mill A gets all the trade.

I suspect RT wouldn't command a premium.

It might be different for human consumption grains.

What it would be, is market/premium led.