B275 Again

Well, I wish I had some good news, but unfortunately no boys showed up this weekend so on to Plan B. In the morning the old man will get on with making arrangements for a diesel compression test, hopefully tomorrow evening.

Yes, I have heard of splashing a bit of 2 stroke oil in as a lubricant, I've never done it tho. I've been using ATF as long as I've had the tractor as that is what we always used in the trucks I drove, 1 liter in a 50 gallon tank especially in winter. Mind I've only put about 600-700 of those 4000 hours on it but it has the look of a tractor that had a hard life. When I changed the pump you could see where the block had been welded at some time in the past. Quite a long crack too, 6 or 8 inches. Whover did the job knew what he was doing, neat tidy seam and no leaks. It does blow oil top and bottom as well, has pretty much since I got it but it has been getting steadily worse.
 

Pennine Ploughing

Member
Mixed Farmer
It does blow oil top and bottom as well, has pretty much since I got it but it has been getting steadily worse
if you take the exhaust pipe off as to lift the bonnet, is there signs of damp oil on inside of pipe or a very deep black ?
if so give it a half to an hour hard work, constantly 80% plus load,
working it as hard as it will take, but keeping an eye on temp gauge not to boil it, as long as oil pressure and temp ok, give it a good flogging, this will bed the rings in if it's glazed,
and the soot in exhaust pipe will be a dry light black if engine is good,

to do this it needs to be a load on the pto, a too big machine for the tractor, or a dyno, cheap and free option in UK is a slurry whisk
 

X344chap

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Central Scotland
Well, I wish I had some good news, but unfortunately no boys showed up this weekend so on to Plan B. In the morning the old man will get on with making arrangements for a diesel compression test, hopefully tomorrow evening.

Yes, I have heard of splashing a bit of 2 stroke oil in as a lubricant, I've never done it tho. I've been using ATF as long as I've had the tractor as that is what we always used in the trucks I drove, 1 liter in a 50 gallon tank especially in winter. Mind I've only put about 600-700 of those 4000 hours on it but it has the look of a tractor that had a hard life. When I changed the pump you could see where the block had been welded at some time in the past. Quite a long crack too, 6 or 8 inches. Whover did the job knew what he was doing, neat tidy seam and no leaks. It does blow oil top and bottom as well, has pretty much since I got it but it has been getting steadily worse.


Behind the injector pump is where these blocks crack if they are allowed to freeze.. If its blowing top and bottom you will possibly need to budget to overhaul the head as well - valves, springs, and valve guides. Hopefully the valve seats are serviceable.
 
if you take the exhaust pipe off as to lift the bonnet, is there signs of damp oil on inside of pipe or a very deep black ?
if so give it a half to an hour hard work, constantly 80% plus load,
working it as hard as it will take, but keeping an eye on temp gauge not to boil it, as long as oil pressure and temp ok, give it a good flogging, this will bed the rings in if it's glazed,
and the soot in exhaust pipe will be a dry light black if engine is good,

to do this it needs to be a load on the pto, a too big machine for the tractor, or a dyno, cheap and free option in UK is a slurry whisk
Now that you mention this, it got me thinking and to be quite honest the tractor hasn't really had a "good workout" for quite a while. It has mostly be relegated to plowing the drive in the winter for the past few years. Once I get it running for a compression test, I'll have to look around to find a good bit of work for it and see if that will improve the situation.
 
Ive Had the combusustion chambers come loose then the piston has forced into the head
Very poor starting, new heads are not dear complete... cheaper than rebuilding them
New engine kits are quite cheap too if it's worth doing it's worth doing correct once and once only, nothing worse than having to do the same job again for trying to save £50.

If you need parts pm me I'll do my best to shop around my suppliers and get you the best quote also I'll stand by the parts I sell If there was a failure.
Just don't rush in and buy stuff off eBay as there is a lot rubbish out there,
As said I'd strip it down and assess what is needed they are simply engine to strip and rebuild I enjoy doing these engines, They do give issues though over the years,
Make sure your glow plugs are all working as one duff one makes the whole system not work, also make sure you have resistor (The pepper pot thing) on the dash working as this limits the current to glow plugs so they don't just blow.
Best advice would be fit the glow plug mod for pencil plugs far more reliable too...
 
I wasn't aware of any mods for the glow plug system. I'd like to find out more about that because it is a rather antiquated system that creates headaches.

I do plan on tearing into it once we get the compression test done, which might be tomorrow but more likely Wednesday. I did look around in the web sites mentioned earlier, emmark and enginefixuk, and prices are definitely lower than over here, even after shipping. I do think once we get it opened up we'll check everything so that there only needs shipping paid once. There's not a lot of money to be wasting on doing jobs a second time, it may even be a bit of a squeeze doing it this time, depends on what we find.
 

Mur Huwcun

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North West Wales
As said you can buy modern 12v plugs wired parallel instead of in series but they’re easy enough to do yourself aswell. Knock the centre out of the old burned plugs and tap an m12 fine thread in the hole and fit some Ford/Peugeot /Citreon plugs with some bearing lock, bypass the pepper pot, remove the bus bar on no1 cylinder which earths to the head and make up three short leads to connect the plugs up it’s a case of fit and forget!

This is a kit on ebay but it’s stupidly priced, the above can be done for peanuts. I have a habit now of stripping scrap cars of heater plugs and bus bars!!!

 
As said you can buy modern 12v plugs wired parallel instead of in series but they’re easy enough to do yourself aswell. Knock the centre out of the old burned plugs and tap an m12 fine thread in the hole and fit some Ford/Peugeot /Citreon plugs with some bearing lock, bypass the pepper pot, remove the bus bar on no1 cylinder which earths to the head and make up three short leads to connect the plugs up it’s a case of fit and forget!

This is a kit on ebay but it’s stupidly priced, the above can be done for peanuts. I have a habit now of stripping scrap cars of heater plugs and bus bars!!!

I am not disputing what you say about fitting new glow plugs.... but should there be a timer device fitted as modern glow plugs need current for only a few seconds any longer and the glow plugs could burn out
 

Pennine Ploughing

Member
Mixed Farmer
The purpose of the pepper pot is to increase current
wrong on that,
the glow plugs are 1.5 volt each,
the pepper pot is 4 volts
this equals 10 volt,
putting 12 volts into the system creates similar to a slow blow fuse, that is where the glow comes from, thus creating heat,




but should there be a timer device fitted as modern glow plugs need current for only a few seconds
again modern heater plugs are built far more robust and reliable than old ones, the timer on new plugs, is so the driver of new cars does not have to do it manually, that would be beyond a lot of town folk, yes you will see the light on the dash only be on for a few seconds, and go out, But the heater plugs on most cars will still glow for up to a minute or longer after the car is started, this is to get a cleaner burn, and lower emissions, that's why you don't see Smokey cars on start up, so no timer is needed, plugs will be fine,



Knock the centre out of the old burned plugs and tap an m12 fine thread in the hole and fit some Ford/Peugeot /Citreon plugs
this seems a long way round to save £4, as Mercedes 220 heater plugs are about £1 each dearer, and are the same dimensions and thread size/ pitch as old glow plugs, and any good motor factor will have them, for a quick easy direct replacement
 

Mur Huwcun

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North West Wales
this seems a long way round to save £4, as Mercedes 220 heater plugs are about £1 each dearer, and are the same dimensions and thread size/ pitch as old glow plugs, and any good motor factor will have them, for a quick easy direct replacement

To be honest I tried to match them up some years ago now, failed at the time and got some wrong ones so converted the old ones and have not tried afterwards. Will try motor factors up the road again.
 

tomlad

Member
Location
nr. preston
Brother-in-laws car was playing up , think it was a 405 pug but i forget
Garage said glow plugs , i thought nonsense, they do nothing once car is running.
He had them changed, it solved problem.
Agreeing with what ur saying john .
 

Mur Huwcun

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North West Wales
Brother-in-laws car was playing up , think it was a 405 pug but i forget
Garage said glow plugs , i thought nonsense, they do nothing once car is running.
He had them changed, it solved problem.
Agreeing with what ur saying john .
A friend had a Ford focus TDCI that was in limp mode and not boosting, we were guessing turbo or air flow meter fault etc. Garage said straight away, glow plugs. ecu was detecting an open circuit and deflecting into limp mode!!!
 
I have just phoned someone that I worked with 40 years ago at IH main dealer and he said
The glow plug circuit is designed for normal battery voltage and when the battery is in low condition and this is
Purpose of pepper pot by increasing current he went on to say that if he is going to fit new type glow plugs because of the heavy current draw fit relay in circuit
He also said tell the guy in Canada to get the glow plug circuit sorted first as there is a danger of opening welded crack in block when tightening down head and he has seen many worn engines but starting no problem and make sure air filter is clean and change engine oil and filter regularly as new oil improves compression and these are not my words but from a mechanic that learned his trade doing
national service and that is my lot on this subject
 

Pennine Ploughing

Member
Mixed Farmer
I have just phoned someone that I worked with 40 years ago at IH main dealer and he said
The glow plug circuit is designed for normal battery voltage and when the battery is in low condition and this is
Purpose of pepper pot by increasing current he went on to say that if he is going to fit new type glow plugs because of the heavy current draw fit relay in circuit
He also said tell the guy in Canada to get the glow plug circuit sorted first as there is a danger of opening welded crack in block when tightening down head and he has seen many worn engines but starting no problem and make sure air filter is clean and change engine oil and filter regularly as new oil improves compression and these are not my words but from a mechanic that learned his trade doing
national service and that is my lot on this subject
it is not a coil to increase volts, but a resistor to absorb volts,
if you think your right, then connect 4 glow plug straight to 12 volts, and see them blow in second

no need for a relay if wired through the original twist heater switch
 
it is not a coil to increase volts, but a resistor to absorb volts,
if you think your right, then connect 4 glow plug straight to 12 volts, and see them blow in second

no need for a relay if wired through the original twist heater switch
I did not say increase volts because that cannot be done as you know
I said increased amps which is completely different to volts
The end as far as I am concerned
Regards to all
 

Mur Huwcun

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North West Wales
Plugs are 1.5v each, stamped clearly on them. By wiring them in series and not parallel the 4 plugs combined require 6v. The pepper pot resistor drops the battery voltage by resistance from 12 to roughly 6v. As mentioned bypassing the pepperpot will blow the plugs in seconds. The only way to increase the current in a circuit is by increasing the load on that particular circuit.
 
Plugs are 1.5v each, stamped clearly on them. By wiring them in series and not parallel the 4 plugs combined require 6v. The pepper pot resistor drops the battery voltage by resistance from 12 to roughly 6v. As mentioned bypassing the pepperpot will blow the plugs in seconds. The only way to increase the current in a circuit is by increasing the load on that particular circuit.
When the voltage is dropped the amperage goes up which is purpose of pepper pot as more amps are needed to push current through high resistance glow plugs
You can compare it with a high pressure pump pushing water through a small jet
I am reminded of a local know it that told me some years ago you test glow plugs by putting one multimeter lead direct to battery and the other lead direct to glow plug and if 12v are showing glowplug is good and if no reading glowplug is fudged my reply was don't talk ballox as that tells you nothing and you will do damage but he would not have it
I suggest you have a stab at someone else next time
Amen
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 78 42.9%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 63 34.6%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 16.5%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 5 2.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,286
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top