BASIS beet help

robbie

Member
BASIS
If you pm me your email I'll see if I can send you a pdf copy of the British sugar growers guide there's some useful stuff in there. It will show you some chem combinations and programmes.

Also don't be afraid to ask questions on here, there's a few of us beet boys who'll tell you how not to grow beet🤣🤣🤣
 
Don't over complicate things for your BASIS exam. A typical farmers programme will seem needlessly complex.

Learn a distinct sequence using the every day and most common named products- the sort of thing you see advertised in the press.

Start with your pre-emergence product

The your first pass post em for weeds

Then the second.

Then if weeds get out hand you can head to the SU product (if it is still legal?)

Then the fungicide passes, etc.

The point is that the above could be totally unnecessary or even ridiculously expensive but it demonstrates you have some idea of a programme.
 
I thought they would have covered spray programmes in the course? I looked into doing my basis but decided to leave it for the time being. I would like to do it at some point though.

Definitely do it. All serious arable farmers should do it, and their spray operators as well as it builds familiarity and confidence in the chemicals. Would recommend it for people with just a passing interest in it.

Edit: I should have written to add that farmers and people operating sprayers will get a lot out of the course because it gives them the skills to spot weeds, disease and growth stages as an agronomist would. This might appeal for some who want to add more appeal and diversity to spraying as a job. The confidence to recognise and understand the chemicals being applied also makes it easier for all concerned as someone is more likely to spot that wrongly delivered can or face decisions like: 'heck, can we reduce the rate a bit on these weeds?', 'ok- lets look at the size of them/what else is in the tank mix then' etc.

Ditto an understanding of tank mixing and sprayer hygiene or when you can go from crop to crop or and when you can't. That kind of knowledge may appeal to many of the people out there who are otherwise doing a very technical job with obvious 'blanks' that BASIS will help them fill in.

It will be useful in future if you try to remember not just the brand names of the chemicals when doing your BASIS course but also the active ingredients as there are times when you won't be able to source the big names.

In particular anyone doing contract spraying should get BASIS training as you will be offering a more reliable service to your customers as opposed to a chap that just wants to turn up and cover acres without a care in the world. There are a lot of very intelligent people out there driving tractors who would easily cope with doing the BASIS (and FACTS) exams. Easily done in the winter months, too.
 
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Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
I thought they would have covered spray programmes in the course? I looked into doing my basis but decided to leave it for the time being. I would like to do it at some point though.
They do. However they way we are being taught it’s separated out. I.e lecture of weed control then another on diseases etc. In my head I quite like a seasons program then I can break it down.
 

alomy75

Member
Don't over complicate things for your BASIS exam. A typical farmers programme will seem needlessly complex.

Learn a distinct sequence using the every day and most common named products- the sort of thing you see advertised in the press.

Start with your pre-emergence product

The your first pass post em for weeds

Then the second.

Then if weeds get out hand you can head to the SU product (if it is still legal?)

Then the fungicide passes, etc.

The point is that the above could be totally unnecessary or even ridiculously expensive but it demonstrates you have some idea of a programme.
Really good advice. Beet sprays just got harder because we’ve lost Betanal Maxxpro but just pick something broad spectrum like PowerTwin. Goltix is handy because it’s approved pre and post em. Debut for when it gets serious! Don’t worry about rates; just say you would google it and don’t be unduly worried about actives unless they’re topical like Metaldehyde or glyphosate. Depending where you are will dictate what crops you need to concentrate on-I did mine on lincs so there was hardly any grassland in the training and absolutely none in the exam! Don’t try and bullsh*t the examiner; they don’t care if you don’t know everything-they just want to know where you would find out the answer.
 
Really good advice. Beet sprays just got harder because we’ve lost Betanal Maxxpro but just pick something broad spectrum like PowerTwin. Goltix is handy because it’s approved pre and post em. Debut for when it gets serious! Don’t worry about rates; just say you would google it and don’t be unduly worried about actives unless they’re topical like Metaldehyde or glyphosate. Depending where you are will dictate what crops you need to concentrate on-I did mine on lincs so there was hardly any grassland in the training and absolutely none in the exam! Don’t try and bullsh*t the examiner; they don’t care if you don’t know everything-they just want to know where you would find out the answer.

Just cite the max rates for the products you can remember. If you can't tell the examiner you would need to check the label or your grower software.

Learning the actives saves a lot of pain because look at how many different kinds of Liberator there are: if something unusual turns up it pays to know what liberator contained to make sure it is safe to use!

Grassland is pretty straight forward, the main thing to remember is the need to keep stock out for a set number of days post application or before cutting.

Definitely don't try to bluster your way through an answer. The examiners just want to check you have a good working knowledge and understanding of the products and what you can and cannot do with them. Having PA1 and PA2 will be a useful starting point.
 

Salopian_Will

Member
BASIS
Location
Shropshire
Start with previous rotation/weed burden, then cultural controls, hoeing etc before moving to spray programmes. Within that you will need to know the a typical 'repeat low dose' spray programme i.e. little and often, at high concentrations/low water volumes. You will also need to know the FAR spray regime, which is a more rigid timing, less often and throwing the kitchen sink at it. Finally also talk about Conviso Smart varieties, which use a specific SU similar to Clearfield Rape.

We have never grown a single beet crop on this farm and so I was always going to get a question about it in my viva. The above allowed me to just about scrape through.
 

Salopian_Will

Member
BASIS
Location
Shropshire
Don't over complicate things for your BASIS exam. A typical farmers programme will seem needlessly complex.

Learn a distinct sequence using the every day and most common named products- the sort of thing you see advertised in the press.

Start with your pre-emergence product

The your first pass post em for weeds

Then the second.

Then if weeds get out hand you can head to the SU product (if it is still legal?)

Then the fungicide passes, etc.

The point is that the above could be totally unnecessary or even ridiculously expensive but it demonstrates you have some idea of a programme.

I would disagree on the named products. Go with the actives instead.
 

Salopian_Will

Member
BASIS
Location
Shropshire
Really? Triflusulfuron-methyl is easier to remember than Debut? x5+ similar actives for each crop?
Absolutely.
The guidance we were given was that this would be what the examiners would prefer to hear- in the Viva the examiners used Actives. Moreover, there are countless generics for each active and you might get caught out if you only know a trade name - they will always use the Active. Away from the exam it allows you to better understand what can be substitutes etc in the real world.
 

alomy75

Member
Absolutely.
The guidance we were given was that this would be what the examiners would prefer to hear- in the Viva the examiners used Actives. Moreover, there are countless generics for each active and you might get caught out if you only know a trade name - they will always use the Active. Away from the exam it allows you to better understand what can be substitutes etc in the real world.
Completely agree for substitutes; but for starting out I think either you had tough examiners or I had soft ones (probably the latter!) I’ve done up to the basis diploma now and bet that in all my exams I’ve used 90% trade names; unless there’s a specific reason to know the active; like dff limits in front of an osr crop etc…but OP don’t take my word for it; be guided by your trainer as this thread shows there’s some regional variation.
 

Bogweevil

Member
Hi

I am doing my BASIS and have no knowledge of beet.

Could someone give me a copy of their typical spray programme? DM if you like.

Thanks

They don't want to catch you out, just want to be certain you won't do anything dangerous illegal, after all most people don't grow beet.

Just say, 'Ah beet, not my crop, but I would endeavour to get rid of any old beet crop debris around the farm, control weeds after the previous crop perhaps treating with an approved herbicide, or a cover crop to be incorporated well before sowing, look to use stale seedbeds weather permitting before sowing, then consider the weed species profile to select suitable herbicides approved for the crop, perhaps going for Conviso cultivars if the weed situation is intractable. I would choose herbicides with due consideration or risk to water, including LERAPS and with careful reference to the BBRO Reference Book (https://edition.pagesuite-professio...me=&edid=d0dc9b1d-43cb-46b0-a088-5864edceb18f). The same goes for any insect control measures taking careful note of thresholds and measures I have put in place to boost natural predators, and for fungicides, assuming my careful choice of the most resistant cultivars was insufficient to limit damage, aim to spray at first signs, re-treating within 28 days to avoid re-infection and using the recommended adjuvants and water volume '.

You can get away with mentioning no actives at all.
 
I would disagree on the named products. Go with the actives instead.

If it likely that the average user will remember a little sequence of named products more readily, especially if the examiner asks something like: 'outline me a winter wheat weed control programme'. The answer of: 'a pre-em of liberator plus defy in the autumn followed by maybe broadway star later for anything that comes through the pre-em'. Is totally correct (if rather impractically expensive).
 

robbie

Member
BASIS
If it likely that the average user will remember a little sequence of named products more readily, especially if the examiner asks something like: 'outline me a winter wheat weed control programme'. The answer of: 'a pre-em of liberator plus defy in the autumn followed by maybe broadway star later for anything that comes through the pre-em'. Is totally correct (if rather impractically expensive).
Have you never heard of a stack??? If you think defy and liberator plus spring Broadway is dear you'd fall over to hear what a lot of the boys are using!!!!! Liberator plus defy pre em, then post em crystal or a FFCT top-up then a spring SU oh and not for getting probably avadex aswell pre em!!!!!
 
Have you never heard of a stack??? If you think defy and liberator plus spring Broadway is dear you'd fall over to hear what a lot of the boys are using!!!!! Liberator plus defy pre em, then post em crystal or a FFCT top-up then a spring SU oh and not for getting probably avadex aswell pre em!!!!!

I'm keeping it stick simple so that people have an idea of something that they will find easier to remember. Liberator and defy as a pre-em followed by a post em of broadway star is simple and it reflects some on farm practice. A follow up question might be, 'ok, so you have done all that and now find some cleavers in the crop emerging later- what do you do'?

The answers you give in the BASIS exam need to be concise and straight forward. If you begin by trying to copy what you are recommended to do by already experienced agronomists on the home farm etc etc then you will increase the complexity and the risk that you will make a mistake. I've seen people who were overly confident. You invite danger if you begin talking about complicated tank mixes and cutting rates or whatever- the examiner will be experienced, possibly from in the trade themselves or maybe even a PhD who has been involved in product/chemical research- one of mine definitely was. If you go stating unusual things they will remember them and if they don't know how accurate your statements were they will research them before you go and sit in front of the panel later on. Guess what areas they will then ask you again in more detail? Don't be that guy.

BASIS is a bit like passing a driving test. The key question they are aiming to answer is will this person be safe recommending something, i.e. is he going to get a growth stage wrong or torch someone's crop? They don't expect everyone to be a full blown expert on every crop and walking 30,000 acres- they know it doesn't work that way. A lot of people who sit the exam will be farmers or people trying to gain more insight of agronomy and to understand recommendations and the decision making process. The examiners know this and aren't there to try and catch you out. But they will do if you are trying to drive at 150mph before you've even learned the Highway code.

I had an advantage of sorts because I spent a lot of time at Uni (many years before sitting BASIS this was, mind) learning active ingredients as a hobby. I learned what they were, rates and even how they worked- I have a huge book somewhere of plant physiology and that was one of my bed time reading materials. I probably spent more of my time doing this than actual work for some of the uni modules I did. Even so, for BASIS I learned a simple program based on product names I knew and from labels I had read so I knew some rough goalposts each product would work within. Get a few copies of FW and cut out the chemical adverts. Stick them in your notebook as a reminder.
 

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Written by Michelle Martin from Agriland

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