Big announcement tonight!

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
What a refreshing contrast in attitude and policy compared with the UK where its all about CO2 emissions, restrictions, tree planting, rewilding and taking land out of production and reducing the number of animals.

Imagine the UK in trade talks with the USA and that difference in attitude and emphasis. America First! "I love my farmers and they need to produce more and buy bigger tractors"
Meanwhile in the UK we are leaving the biggest trading block that is only 26 miles from our border to try and trade with an aggressively export oriented behemoth that expressly puts themselves first and can bury us feet deep in their produce.
Look into American farming and trade policy/food aid abit deeper and you will realise that this kind of thing is what causes famin and world hunger. More isn’t needed to be produced, famin and starvation happen because of policies like this. This is bad for all of us they artificially keep prices low and pay their farmers subsidies. This in turn keeps prices too low for 3rd world countries to invest in proper agriculture with infrastructure despite having excellent growing conditions. They then pump out their surplus as ‘food aid’.
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
But by saying, farmers need to buy bigger tractors, get more land etc, that, in reality, means putting money into the machine makers, the banks, and all the other industries that live off our backs, and for the farmers ? more produce for a market that might, or might not, buy it, and if not, lower prices, which starts of the vicious circle, of produce more, to spread the cost of buying the machinery.
One of the 'points' of the new vision UK ag bill, which may have far reaching pluses for us, is the point of putting emphasis on soil, and environment, may lead to lower production, where most of us think, this will lead to lower standard imported food, which will be cheaper. If you look at it from another angle, we are always told, public want to know where food comes from, buy british etc, this, combined with lower production, this might, might increase price of home grown, haven't really got by head around it yet, but there may be some very good things in it. Early days.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
But by saying, farmers need to buy bigger tractors, get more land etc, that, in reality, means putting money into the machine makers, the banks, and all the other industries that live off our backs, and for the farmers ? more produce for a market that might, or might not, buy it, and if not, lower prices, which starts of the vicious circle, of produce more, to spread the cost of buying the machinery.
One of the 'points' of the new vision UK ag bill, which may have far reaching pluses for us, is the point of putting emphasis on soil, and environment, may lead to lower production, where most of us think, this will lead to lower standard imported food, which will be cheaper. If you look at it from another angle, we are always told, public want to know where food comes from, buy british etc, this, combined with lower production, this might, might increase price of home grown, haven't really got by head around it yet, but there may be some very good things in it. Early days.
I honestly think this whole thing is best thing to happen to U.K. agriculture since the war. If farmers can just stop being so blinded by the past and what they are comfortable with then the opportunities are absolutely huge. I am SO excited and am feeling very lucky that I am young at 28 to crack on with a totally different Model of business.
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
I honestly think this whole thing is best thing to happen to U.K. agriculture since the war. If farmers can just stop being so blinded by the past and what they are comfortable with then the opportunities are absolutely huge. I am SO excited and am feeling very lucky that I am young at 28 to crack on with a totally different Model of business.
thanks for saying that, we are blinded by ag policies dating back to WW2, and it is a new horizon for farmers, my generation are getting towards the end of our active farming lives, and, tend to view change with trepidation, it is for the younger farmers to bite the bullet, and make the most of it.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Look into American farming and trade policy/food aid abit deeper and you will realise that this kind of thing is what causes famin and world hunger. More isn’t needed to be produced, famin and starvation happen because of policies like this. This is bad for all of us they artificially keep prices low and pay their farmers subsidies. This in turn keeps prices too low for 3rd world countries to invest in proper agriculture with infrastructure despite having excellent growing conditions. They then pump out their surplus as ‘food aid’.
I do not believe that the US is going to dump produce. There is no guaranteed market for the $50Billion of trade Trump promises. It is just a deal that gets rid of barriers to that trade. Trade which will probably offset imports from Australasian sources but only if the price is right and the demand is there. It is an 'opportunity' for US farmers rather than a certainty. There is certainly no mention of selling at low subsidised prices to China and I'm sure that China would not hesitate putting a stop to that.

It is Africa that gets most 'food aid'. Yes, it buggers the economics of their own agriculture for certain commodities when it happens, but if it didn't happen, as has been the case before now where drought or war has caused famine, millions die.
As far as I know very few agricultural development projects in large areas of Africa have made much of a difference for any significant period of time. They just don't seem to help themselves, whether because of corruption, ineptitude or whatever, I don't know.
There are some areas where development has been successful though and they export produce to Europe, helping their own economy and raising local living standards. I presume that these enterprises are located in the more stable, safe, and well governed regions in a vast continent.
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
"Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach him to fish and he will feed himself forever." Dumping excess produce on the 3rd world markets does wreck domestic production there but this is less common now since WTO/GATT reforms. World prices of ag commodities are being kept artificially low by 1st world farm subsidies which has a similar effect. The subs are just per acre on "decoupled" payments rather than per tonne on export restitutions.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
"Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach him to fish and he will feed himself forever." Dumping excess produce on the 3rd world markets does wreck domestic production there but this is less common now since WTO/GATT reforms. World prices of ag commodities are being kept artificially low by 1st world farm subsidies which has a similar effect. The subs are just per acre on "decoupled" payments rather than per tonne on export restitutions.
They are not kept low by European farm subsidies. If not for the subsidies and tariffs, a high proportion of EU and UK farmers would not be able to compete with imports and would go out of business or bust.
 

le bon paysan

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Limousin, France
totally agree, but by asking farmers to produce more, he is only saying, what all farmers strive to do, is encouraging them to do exactly what farmers want to do !! Of course they love him, he is telling them, what they want to hear !
thanks for saying that, we are blinded by ag policies dating back to WW2, and it is a new horizon for farmers, my generation are getting towards the end of our active farming lives, and, tend to view change with trepidation, it is for the younger farmers to bite the bullet, and make the most of it.
Google the suicide rate among US farmers. If its so good why are so many taking their own life?
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
They are not kept low by European farm subsidies. If not for the subsidies and tariffs, a high proportion of EU and UK farmers would not be able to compete with imports and would go out of business or bust.

They are kept low by subsidies in all countries, not just Europe. Take away the subs and you've got to fill that gap with cost reductions or you won't be able to compete unless you can restrict the cheaper competition.
 

fudge

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire.
They are kept low by subsidies in all countries, not just Europe. Take away the subs and you've got to fill that gap with cost reductions or you won't be able to compete unless you can restrict the cheaper competition.
We have to wait and see what trade deals are done. It’s pretty easy to eliminate UK ag if you increase environmental restrictions here whilst cutting down the the rain forest.
It is striking that the bill, time and again, gives to Secretary of State the ability to impose regulations here whilst there is no legal requirement to extend standards to any imports. Indeed the commitment to food security could be interpreted as reason to accept lower standards from abroad.
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
We have to wait and see what trade deals are done. It’s pretty easy to eliminate UK ag if you increase environmental restrictions here whilst cutting down the the rain forest.
It is striking that the bill, time and again, gives to Secretary of State the ability to impose regulations here whilst there is no legal requirement to extend standards to any imports. Indeed the commitment to food security could be interpreted as reason to accept lower standards from abroad.

Brought nicely back on topic! Good work :)
 

Bald Rick

Moderator
Livestock Farmer
Location
Anglesey
I guess as a dairy farmer relying on young leys and crops such as maize we will probably decide not to take the sub .... although I will certainly be keeping an eye on mountain land or other grade 4-5 if it’s cheap enough as an offset

Where there’s a scheme, there’s a schemer
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
I honestly think this whole thing is best thing to happen to U.K. agriculture since the war. If farmers can just stop being so blinded by the past and what they are comfortable with then the opportunities are absolutely huge. I am SO excited and am feeling very lucky that I am young at 28 to crack on with a totally different Model of business.

interesting you use the word 'model' because it helps me explain a danger I can see coming. You know those Lego kits you get that construct a unique model. Olaf from Frozen for example. The problem with this model and the unique pieces that go into its construction is that you can't build anything else with it. It's a one hit wonde.

i admire your optimism, let's hope it's a ball we can run with.
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
Listed in FMP along with back issues of Direct Driller, Practical Farm Ideas and Tractor Ted! No Gabe Brown, Alan Savoury, Joel Salatin or Edward Faulkner, Clive?
just been talking to someone near you, some of his ground has been virtually continuous corn since 1942, other ground very close to me, come out of arable rotation, and been corn for 25 years, Now telling me that it is marginal corn ground, 1 year in 5, he reckons to have a good crop, the other years, between 2/3 ton. Very surprised at that, as for 25 years he's been telling me he averages 3.5 ton sold, which I never believed anyway. Some of the 25yr corn ground, I used to farm, in a rotation with grass, the last three yrs, I farmed it, I av 4ton wheat sold, as in payed for 4 t/acre. Thinking on how they are going to pay us for looking after the soils, etc, his ground is basically baggered, he won't put manure on it, because someone might make a mess, and threaten his sfp, and manure is no good anyway, had to stop growing rape, as can't control f/beetle, slugs are rife, due to non breakdown of stubble, and chopped straw, puddles of water lie on top of the ground, after rain. He would be really hurt, if you told him, he was farming badly. And, if you look at subs to improve soils, he would be a prime candidate !
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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