Who is right?
Bull beef ?
- Thread starter holywell farmer
- Start date
Norfolk Hill Farmer
Member
Yes have been doing Buitelaar veal/ light weight beef for a number of years and based the above on that. Obviously the continentals would come to more money than the b/ w bulls I use ,but would cost much more to buy.
Would heavier weights lead to poorer FCE and not much extra profit.
PS forgot to add in calf rearing costs (£60) I did say it was the back of an envelope job
Norfolk Hill Farmer
Member
As I said before even with my revised costs it's do able. Would suggest the BB calf could be more than £280 seen plenty go past at £350 or more and for that kind of performance you would need the better ones, not the Friesians in disguise. You also need a stout heart if you get some pneumonia amongst calves that start off at over £300.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
I shouldn't comment but will anyway...Diverting this thread off topic a little bit...
Remember when your father and grandfather kept a bullock for two or three years, being fed on turnip, barley, hay, swede, cakemeal etc etc?
Was the taste of the meat from that animal superior to what we have today?
Other than money, why is it not done today?
I know next to nowt about animals...
Money!!
In less rigid beef markets it is called "a competitive advantage" - the luxury of growing animals out on pasture slow as you like, basically paying interest on the money invested
The fact of the matter is bulls are full of meat, the calf costs the same whether you have its head cut off at 12 or 40 months, but supermarket-supply system seems to prefer having their growers to have very few options = be forced to sell at this price before the deadline.
Meat, not size 11 1/2 leather shoes, but meat that half will end up minced?
Money talks.
I'm tempted to carry the dozen smallest of mine another winter and see how they work out as opposed to the two dozen bigger ones, my costs are very little especially if I put them under some trees and feed them silage in a couple of rings.
Have just put them undercover actually as we've had 40mm of rain in 3 hours and I'm in drought recovery mode at present, better protect the growing plants so in they go for the night
grass silage 4p/kgDM @10.5ME
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
Not a hope in hell of getting a gross margin anywhere near £458!
£280 = Calve cost ( average )
£200= to get them weaned
£40 = meds/ misc costs ( ie replacement tags etc )
£110= straw costs ( post weaning to sale )
£110 = forage costs ( straw or silage )
£100 = protein costs ( @ 0.5 kilos a day @ 365 days post weaning)
£300 = grain costs ( just under 2 ton of say a wheat/ barley mix incl milling )
£10 = minerals/ bicarb
£45 = killing/ haulage costs
Total = £1195/ head.
Should kill out at a average of say 390 kilos x £3.45 kilo = £1345.50 head
Net profit = £150.50 head ( before fixed costs like labour/ tractor costs for feeding/ cleaning out etc )
....
Those are just a guide figures as everyone will be paying different prices for straw/ forage costs etc but as an average wont be far off the mark.
All home grown inputs should be priced at either cop or sale price if sold.
Last edited:
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
In summary you are better off running them as steers and either selling as strong grazing/ finshing steers either on the open or orange market at around 20 months old.
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
I shouldn't comment but will anyway...
Money!!
In less rigid beef markets it is called "a competitive advantage" - the luxury of growing animals out on pasture slow as you like, basically paying interest on the money invested
The fact of the matter is bulls are full of meat, the calf costs the same whether you have its head cut off at 12 or 40 months, but supermarket-supply system seems to prefer having their growers to have very few options = be forced to sell at this price before the deadline.
Meat, not size 11 1/2 leather shoes, but meat that half will end up minced?
Money talks.
I'm tempted to carry the dozen smallest of mine another winter and see how they work out as opposed to the two dozen bigger ones, my costs are very little especially if I put them under some trees and feed them silage in a couple of rings.
Have just put them undercover actually as we've had 40mm of rain in 3 hours and I'm in drought recovery mode at present, better protect the growing plants so in they go for the night
grass silage 4p/kgDM @10.5ME
As we have discussed before due to the end market requirements in the UK your system wont work here.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
Quite interesting to see the costings, do they graze at all or all on a court?
And how the #### do I work out what grass costs anyway?
And how the #### do I work out what grass costs anyway?
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
Exactly, same the other way too.
If I spent that I would be losing roughly £600 per bull sold
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
Suckler bred ones will stay out for one summer on grass.
Dairy ones will prob never go outside on most dairy farms doing bull beef.
Bull beef is only really worth doing for suckler bred cattle as they have a better fat cover and grade higher than dairy bred bulls.
Grass cost is things like hedgetrimming/ fert/ lime/ fencing costs/ rolling costs/ + rental value etc etc.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
Thanks, very interesting indeed.
Pretty tight, isnt it...
Not all beer and tarts
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
Yes with losses/ calf milk/ calf pellets/ straw/ labour/ etc etc.
Weaned bull calves at 16 weeks are about £500 head if you buy them in already reared and with that say in a bunch of 20 calves you will have a couple that are poor.
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
Thanks, very interesting indeed.
Pretty tight, isnt it...
Not all beer and tarts
Not a lot in the beef job here.
Most of the very big finishers that do 1500+ head a year reckon to make £50 head net profit across the board.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
I can't like that
Feck!
the sad part is - what is "plan b"?I was going to put up my costings but I wont now!!
- Location
- Devon
Mostly agree except that I used reckon £100 to weaning but I don't buy milk powder any more so this may well be more now.
And I found 1 1/4 - 1 1/2 tons straw would cover forage and bedding so £100 off your figure there. Obviously would depend on stocking density though.
Please do. Be interesting comparison. I bet it would be a real eye opener for everyone on here. I understand if you would rather not thoughI can't like that
Feck!
I was going to put up my costings but I wont now!!
holywell farmer
Member
- Location
- holywell, north wales
Is easier to finish cattle in sheds would say
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
I can't like that
Feck!
I was going to put up my costings but I wont now!!
Please put up your costings @Kiwi Pete and what the average end price/ age of the cattle are.
Would be helpful and make it easier to compare if you do it in ££s and kilos
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
Calve milk and pellets will be at least £67 calve ( upto 16 weeks ) + meds + straw + losses on top of that so £200 wont be far out. ( esp when you include labour costs )
Bedding will be about 1t per bull and 1t for feeding per bull for 365 days post weaning so say at current values say £220 head so yes the straw/forage costs = £70 head saving on my figure above so profit excluding fixed costs and labour/ machinery costs post weaning =£150 head.
.........
Have updated my earlier post above.