'Challenge Sheep' - tracking replacements

Sandpit Farm

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Derbyshire
Looks like an interesting project... From what I gather:

- looking to establish what affects poor performance of flock replacements
- involves taking weights and BCS and lamb performance data
- requires bigger flocks with 150-250 flock replacements each year
- requires use of EID and tagging lambs at birth

http://beefandlamb.ahdb.org.uk/research/challenge-sheep/

I think applications are due by 20th February so worth applying if you are interested in taking part.
 

unlacedgecko

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Fife
I was involved in a similar project in NZ in the early 1990s. The results were outstanding for the farms involved. One farm I was involved in doubled the number of sale lambs in just 3 years.

A clear demonstration of the damage subsidies do to an industry.

I think this is a great idea. I'd love to see the results when finished.
 

unlacedgecko

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Fife
Explain? The page won't load for me.

Using tagging at birth and EID to monitor the performance of home bred replacement ewes. This should lead to genetic improvement within the flock.

As @NZDan said, this was done in NZ over 20 years ago, with some farms doubling output in 3 years. Imagine if the UK hill flocks could increase output by 50% though genetic gain? They'd become economically viable in their own right, which would massively help fend off the likes of Monbiot.

In the UK it wasn't done sooner as the subsidy means that sheep performance is not as important. I believe subsidy has stifled the industry.

20 years ago in NZ performance recording drove genetic gain to the point that some flocks doubled output in 36 months. In the UK, some still poo-poo recording and EBVs, preferring to select replacement females on the length of their ears or how "pretty" their face is... What's the difference? Subsidy.

I very strongly believe that it is this kind of work the UK farming should be focussed on, rather than coming up with arguements for retaining subsidy.
 
Last edited:

easyram1

Member
Location
North Shropshire
Using tagging at birth and EID to monitor the performance of home bred replacement ewes. This should lead to genetic improvement within the flock.

As @NZDan said, this was done in NZ over 20 years ago, with some farms doubling output in 3 years. Imagine if the UK hill flocks could increase output by 50% though genetic gain? They'd become economically viable in their own right, which would massively help fend off the likes of Monbiot.

In the UK it wasn't done sooner as the subsidy means that sheep performance is not as important. I believe subsidy has stifled the industry.

20 years ago in NZ performance recording drove genetic gain to the point that some flocks doubled output in 36 months. In the UK, some still poo-poo recording and EBVs, preferring to select replacement females on the length of their ears or how "pretty" their face is... What's the difference? Subsidy.

I very strongly believe that it is this kind of work the UK farming should be focussed on, rather than coming up with arguements for retaining subsidy.
You are so correct particularly your last Para
 

Sandpit Farm

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Derbyshire
The only addition I would make is that I believe this project is interested in management effects and the need to manage the young ewes better to increase output and prolong life. So the replacements don't need to be homebred.

I was told that 40% of light lambs come from 1st lambing ewes. How could we improve this? Also there was a staggering % of ewes that don't make it to their second lambing.

Totally agree with the hill sheep point... I think this is being addressed genetically with another project.
 
It is rather easy to say that subsidies are the main difference between the performances of the sheep industries of the UK and NZ. However the desire to focus on the main drivers of profit are definitely made clearer when the only income is directly received from production.

Note; NZ sheep productivity per ewe has doubled in 25 years, half of this is genetic. The effect of hybrid vigour in new composite breeds has been very minor, with the improvement in maternal breeds (mainly Romneys and their derivatives) driving most of this difference. The genetic gains in terminal breeds are less than half of the maternal breeds, however functionality (reducing costs associated with genetics, eg. survival, feet health, dagginess etc.) has been similar across both categories. With maternal traits having 7 times the value of terminal traits (because ewes produce for several years), the market pressure on maternal breed ram breeders to make an improvement has been much greater.
The other half of this outstanding performance in the NZ sheep industry (NZ dairy has increased milk solids by 32% over the same time) has been the improvement in pasture management, despite the sheep industry being largely replaced on land capable of dairy conversion, thus more centred now in hill country. Therefore more than half of NZ flocks are not shepherded at lambing, so Survival and labour saving traits are so important. Much of this country, although very steep and cannot be cultivated, is fertilised and subdivided so grazing management can be carried out to a very precise level. Very little % of NZ sheep SU has grazing limitations imposed, except for mountainous high country Crown Leaseholds for erosion or rabbit management purposes.

Whatever the Brexit outcome, uncertainty and profit volatility may mark a decade. Some of the questions will be;
  • If hill country farmers cannot improve their grazing management because of environmental constraints, will they still be supported to carry on at income levels of today and will their land support a higher level of productivity?
  • If all farmers run into a profit squeeze because of poorer prices, where will they cut their costs?
  • If their current farming system cannot bear severe cost cutting, will they look to breeders for more productivity potential, to at least maintain income, and improved functionality to decrease costs?
  • What options are there to change systems that enable farmers to maintain profitability?
  • How quickly can the pedigree industry adapt to the changed market demand?
All flock improvement comes from firstly measuring what is going on now. Knowledge is power. Any program that empowers farmers to making better informed decisions about their business, has to be good. Unfortunately hard times force farmers to "focus on the ball" sooner rather than later.

Like NZ, large tracts of UK hill country are farmed using sheep, as sheep are the common default land use option. Maybe UK sheep farming is in for bigger changes than realised, as there may be no other option to survive than change for many.
 

gatepost

Member
Location
Cotswolds
The only addition I would make is that I believe this project is interested in management effects and the need to manage the young ewes better to increase output and prolong life. So the replacements don't need to be homebred.

I was told that 40% of light lambs come from 1st lambing ewes. How could we improve this? Also there was a staggering % of ewes that don't make it to their second lambing.

Totally agree with the hill sheep point... I think this is being addressed genetically with another project.
I suspect that some of the more recent fad for lambing ewe lambs has something to answer for, one, reason I have been told for example is to cap the mature size of the ewe, therefore making her more economic to keep, I have neighbours topping lambs at 35kg, IMO all you get is light lambs and a high mortality rate, sometimes common-sense is lacking. but sounds a good project.
 

Al R

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Wales
I suspect that some of the more recent fad for lambing ewe lambs has something to answer for, one, reason I have been told for example is to cap the mature size of the ewe, therefore making her more economic to keep, I have neighbours topping lambs at 35kg, IMO all you get is light lambs and a high mortality rate, sometimes common-sense is lacking. but sounds a good project.

I'll admit it stunts them massively. Last year we had ewe lambs that were rearing twins by mid August both weighing 38-40kg and the ewe lamb (18month old now) would be 45-50kg.
Now those ewes have got to 65-75kg and are coming up to 2 year old. It does quieten them and are much better mothers.
This years ewe lambs twin bearing are 65-80kg and are due in 1 month. Looking fantastic to be fair..
 

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