Chemical Price Tracker

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
As an agronomist trained and practising for 6 years now and also having just celebrated my 30th birthday last week I find your frequent slapdash comments on the above highly offensive.
Despite what you know and what you think you know, the arable and especially the horticultural sectors still need Agronomists and some farms arguably need them more than ever and good ones at that. I commend you for being the successful farmer and businessman that reading this forum would suggest that you are. Its pretty clear to me that you know your stuff, are getting results and enjoy what you do. But, you do not represent the majority of UK farmers, in fact you probably represent a very small percentage. I work in an area dominated by livestock farms and mixed farms, many using arable enterprise to complement their main livestock sectors. Many of these farms are small like 100-200ha and many of the business owners and managers are aged 50plus. The climate here can also be particularly challenging for arable farming. Say what you like about such small and mixed farms but many are very well run and indeed profitable. Many are not but that could be said of many UK farming business irrespective of size. These farms need good sound advice on crop management and crop protection, and they are perfectly entitled to have it. For many they do not have the time to keep up to date with the latest changes in crop protection products and what they should or should not be using (legally), many would not know one end of a cereal plant from the other but they can still grow 12t/ha crops of wheat and run very profitable enterprises- which is what matters ultimately! To help them achieve this they need agronomists, good agronomists and ones that are fair and not there as salesmen to rip them off. The veg farmers out there, a few of which I deal with undoubtedly need good agronomists more than they ever have before, crop protection in these crops is more changing by the month, never mind the year. With respect, Wheat is easy compared to this.
I absolutely do not disagree that technology is evolving at a fantastic rate and in most cases is fantastic in what it can show or tell us. Satellites and mapping among many many other things are making decisions on inputs and strategies easier and probably better but ultimately most of these things can provide you with information, probably more than a crop walking agronomist can but it can’t provide experience and decision making. Hence why most of them can be referred to as decision ‘support’.
I also don’t disagree at all that there are plenty of ‘not so good’ to put it mildly ‘agronomists’ out there, plenty both independent and distributer are glorified salesmen selling whatever they can do to put most in their pension pot each season, many don’t even walk crops where I live and they still have the trust of their customers- don’t ask me how.
This is totally and utterly wrong and should be policed more heavily but god knows how. However, no matter the industry you will get people that abuse their position and do their job selfishly and badly. This also applies to farmers.
So you are entitled to your opinion but can I suggest you stop and engage your brain before constantly coming off with slapdash comments that go way beyond your own situation. I liken it to me saying if I were a farmer below 60 I would go and retrain- because when subsidies firstly get cut and eventually go in their current form at least, many many of you will be up the perverbial creek with no paddle.
I have no farm, I only wish I had. If there was one thing I have always wanted to do it was arable farm but I can’t where I live, at least at the minute. So I do what I consider the next best thing, work with farmers and help their businesses to thrive. I am good at it and most of the time I enjoy it, and take great satisfaction from helping customers get the results they want. I am no salesman I don’t rip people off and I consider it an ever and rapidly changing career, not a job!

Only natural to be defensive when your profession is under threat long term I guess. Most tractor drivers are not keen on the idea of driverless machines either !

What do you think a algorithms / remote sensors / satellite / high res images or small robot image won’t be able to do that only a human can ?

Sone of this tech will see and predict things that no human no matter how skilled will be able to


Genuinely interested as I actually think it will be a shame see skilled people disappear from fields, I feel it’s inevitable however ?

The beginning is “decision support”. (We already have a lot of that) When it learns enough about those decisions the next step becomes decision replacing embrace

I’m afraid it’s inevitable hence my comment re retraining !
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
As an agronomist trained and practising for 6 years now and also having just celebrated my 30th birthday last week I find your frequent slapdash comments on the above highly offensive.
Despite what you know and what you think you know, the arable and especially the horticultural sectors still need Agronomists and some farms arguably need them more than ever and good ones at that. I commend you for being the successful farmer and businessman that reading this forum would suggest that you are. Its pretty clear to me that you know your stuff, are getting results and enjoy what you do. But, you do not represent the majority of UK farmers, in fact you probably represent a very small percentage. I work in an area dominated by livestock farms and mixed farms, many using arable enterprise to complement their main livestock sectors. Many of these farms are small like 100-200ha and many of the business owners and managers are aged 50plus. The climate here can also be particularly challenging for arable farming. Say what you like about such small and mixed farms but many are very well run and indeed profitable. Many are not but that could be said of many UK farming business irrespective of size. These farms need good sound advice on crop management and crop protection, and they are perfectly entitled to have it. For many they do not have the time to keep up to date with the latest changes in crop protection products and what they should or should not be using (legally), many would not know one end of a cereal plant from the other but they can still grow 12t/ha crops of wheat and run very profitable enterprises- which is what matters ultimately! To help them achieve this they need agronomists, good agronomists and ones that are fair and not there as salesmen to rip them off. The veg farmers out there, a few of which I deal with undoubtedly need good agronomists more than they ever have before, crop protection in these crops is more changing by the month, never mind the year. With respect, Wheat is easy compared to this.
I absolutely do not disagree that technology is evolving at a fantastic rate and in most cases is fantastic in what it can show or tell us. Satellites and mapping among many many other things are making decisions on inputs and strategies easier and probably better but ultimately most of these things can provide you with information, probably more than a crop walking agronomist can but it can’t provide experience and decision making. Hence why most of them can be referred to as decision ‘support’.
I also don’t disagree at all that there are plenty of ‘not so good’ to put it mildly ‘agronomists’ out there, plenty both independent and distributer are glorified salesmen selling whatever they can do to put most in their pension pot each season, many don’t even walk crops where I live and they still have the trust of their customers- don’t ask me how.
This is totally and utterly wrong and should be policed more heavily but god knows how. However, no matter the industry you will get people that abuse their position and do their job selfishly and badly. This also applies to farmers.
So you are entitled to your opinion but can I suggest you stop and engage your brain before constantly coming off with slapdash comments that go way beyond your own situation. I liken it to me saying if I were a farmer below 60 I would go and retrain- because when subsidies firstly get cut and eventually go in their current form at least, many many of you will be up the perverbial creek with no paddle.
I have no farm, I only wish I had. If there was one thing I have always wanted to do it was arable farm but I can’t where I live, at least at the minute. So I do what I consider the next best thing, work with farmers and help their businesses to thrive. I am good at it and most of the time I enjoy it, and take great satisfaction from helping customers get the results they want. I am no salesman I don’t rip people off and I consider it an ever and rapidly changing career, not a job!


Good post (y)

TFF needs balance and different views need to be aired or it just gets boring for anyone new to come in here & see the same names bashing serviced agronomy all the time. You supply a demand.

Some of us just like to stimulate discussion or even just provoke a reaction. ;)
 

BenB

Member
BASE UK Member
Location
Wiltshire
As an agronomist trained and practising for 6 years now and also having just celebrated my 30th birthday last week I find your frequent slapdash comments on the above highly offensive.
Despite what you know and what you think you know, the arable and especially the horticultural sectors still need Agronomists and some farms arguably need them more than ever and good ones at that. I commend you for being the successful farmer and businessman that reading this forum would suggest that you are. Its pretty clear to me that you know your stuff, are getting results and enjoy what you do. But, you do not represent the majority of UK farmers, in fact you probably represent a very small percentage. I work in an area dominated by livestock farms and mixed farms, many using arable enterprise to complement their main livestock sectors. Many of these farms are small like 100-200ha and many of the business owners and managers are aged 50plus. The climate here can also be particularly challenging for arable farming. Say what you like about such small and mixed farms but many are very well run and indeed profitable. Many are not but that could be said of many UK farming business irrespective of size. These farms need good sound advice on crop management and crop protection, and they are perfectly entitled to have it. For many they do not have the time to keep up to date with the latest changes in crop protection products and what they should or should not be using (legally), many would not know one end of a cereal plant from the other but they can still grow 12t/ha crops of wheat and run very profitable enterprises- which is what matters ultimately! To help them achieve this they need agronomists, good agronomists and ones that are fair and not there as salesmen to rip them off. The veg farmers out there, a few of which I deal with undoubtedly need good agronomists more than they ever have before, crop protection in these crops is more changing by the month, never mind the year. With respect, Wheat is easy compared to this.
I absolutely do not disagree that technology is evolving at a fantastic rate and in most cases is fantastic in what it can show or tell us. Satellites and mapping among many many other things are making decisions on inputs and strategies easier and probably better but ultimately most of these things can provide you with information, probably more than a crop walking agronomist can but it can’t provide experience and decision making. Hence why most of them can be referred to as decision ‘support’.
I also don’t disagree at all that there are plenty of ‘not so good’ to put it mildly ‘agronomists’ out there, plenty both independent and distributer are glorified salesmen selling whatever they can do to put most in their pension pot each season, many don’t even walk crops where I live and they still have the trust of their customers- don’t ask me how.
This is totally and utterly wrong and should be policed more heavily but god knows how. However, no matter the industry you will get people that abuse their position and do their job selfishly and badly. This also applies to farmers.
So you are entitled to your opinion but can I suggest you stop and engage your brain before constantly coming off with slapdash comments that go way beyond your own situation. I liken it to me saying if I were a farmer below 60 I would go and retrain- because when subsidies firstly get cut and eventually go in their current form at least, many many of you will be up the perverbial creek with no paddle.
I have no farm, I only wish I had. If there was one thing I have always wanted to do it was arable farm but I can’t where I live, at least at the minute. So I do what I consider the next best thing, work with farmers and help their businesses to thrive. I am good at it and most of the time I enjoy it, and take great satisfaction from helping customers get the results they want. I am no salesman I don’t rip people off and I consider it an ever and rapidly changing career, not a job!

Fantastic post. As a 28 year old independent agronomist, who loves their job, I have no plans to re-train into a new career any time soon...only to keep continually re-training my knowledge of agronomy and arable crop production. Thank you!
 

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
The weather is an unpredictable variable that will need to be more accurately measured for accurate decision making

It’s a problem for humans and algorithms to deal with - my money is ion the algorithm being more consistent and able to consider and process more hyper local information to base better decision upon however
 

Wheatonrotty

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
MK43
The rate we are losing chemicals I think any young agronomist needs to be learning organic agronomy!
More seriously, while I think we will use software to decide on products and timings, I do have concerns about who writes the software. A human looking at results of say a basf trial will know that it's likely to promote basf products, will the computers take this into account?
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
The rate we are losing chemicals I think any young agronomist needs to be learning organic agronomy!
More seriously, while I think we will use software to decide on products and timings, I do have concerns about who writes the software. A human looking at results of say a basf trial will know that it's likely to promote basf products, will the computers take this into account?

BASIS students spend as much time learning about cultural controls as they do about chemical ones. That was the case when I did the course with @Woodlander in 2007. I expect the non chemical solutions are an even greater part of the syllabus now.
 

B'o'B

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Rutland
I’m doing some beta testing of an AI driven agronomy decision support system.
Let’s just say there has been quite a lot of manual overriding going on.
Plenty more work to be done before it’s a practically viable system and the cost to get it this far is from what I was told has been truly eye-watering. There will be a need for ground truthing for some years yet. Algorithms predict the likelihood that an issue will appear but it doesn’t actually mean it will appear. Likewise just because something is not likely to happen doesn’t mean that it won’t.
 
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Derrick Hughes

Member
Location
Ceredigion
Ferra are doing some REALLY interesting stuff which I saw recently

It’s an area which is developing very quickly at the moment

If I was an agronomist and under 60 I would be retraining for a different job !
Ive gone back 4 pages and apart from a lot of post I dont understand, not one price. I thought it was a price tracker,?
Beside that how do I go about getting prices and buying off your ..what ever you call it thing
 

richard hammond

Member
BASIS
Ferra are doing some REALLY interesting stuff which I saw recently

It’s an area which is developing very quickly at the moment

If I was an agronomist and under 60 I would be retraining for a different job !
rubbish I am only 59 :(, but I am pleased to be this end of food production which is what we are talking about,when I started Glyphosate was the future and £75/5lts, and now it is the devil and is circa £42/20lts, move on!!!!
 

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
Ive gone back 4 pages and apart from a lot of post I dont understand, not one price. I thought it was a price tracker,?
Beside that how do I go about getting prices and buying off your ..what ever you call it thing

Go to Farm Marketplace page (there is s button top right of every TFF page that links) - see prices ? Like prices ? Buy

Can’t see product you want ? Call number on page or email or fill out the quote me form

Pretty easy really
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
rubbish I am only 59 :(, but I am pleased to be this end of food production which is what we are talking about,when I started Glyphosate was the future and £75/5lts, and now it is the devil and is circa £42/20lts, move on!!!!

If you were 29 would you train as an agronomist ? I’s there another 35 years in the job ?

Next 5-10 years it’s still going to be a people thing but beyond that ?

Good news is I probably won’t have to find a replacement when you retire to somewhere hot and lovely !
 

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
If you where 29 would you become a farmer?

Robot manager might be the new job title, will an agronomist or farmer be more qualified for this.

I am not sure arable farming as we know it will exist in 50 yrs. It depends on who owns the new tech I am not sure farmers will, perhaps serfs is the new job title for tomorrows farmers.
 
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Hampton

Member
BASIS
Location
Shropshire
If you were 29 would you train as an agronomist ? I’s there another 35 years in the job ?

Next 5-10 years it’s still going to be a people thing but beyond that ?

Good news is I probably won’t have to find a replacement when you retire to somewhere hot and lovely !
Aren’t you late 40’s? In 15-20 years time your farming career will be a thing of the past too! ;)
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 80 42.3%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 66 34.9%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 15.9%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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