Covid jab - is it compulsory?

[SilliamWhale]

Covid isn't a nasty cold. We're just lucky that, with our individual immunity trained by vaccination or by being fortunate enough not to be harmed by having encountered Covid without having been vaccinated, this currently dominant variant seems less troublesome than its predecessors. It's still killing people. With luck there won't be a new variant that isn't like that, but it isn't guaranteed.

The pandemic is not over. SARS-CoV-2 has consequences for health for everyone who catches it. Vaccines continue to be vital to reduce negative effects of catching covid. Just a few weeks of leeway brought about by further vaccination could make all the difference to somebody's quality of life. Roll on needle-free administration of vaccination. It's only manufacture of the means of delivery that's holding it back.

What is so difficult to understand about the need for individual citizens to exercise personal responsibility for their own health and not to compromise that of those around them? What's so difficult to understand about the need for individuals as an electorate to weed out those in government who put their own and their mates' business interests first, and the welfare of the population well below that? In an ideal world, health provision per head of population would be small, brilliantly precise, and extremely agile, because the population takes care of itself at individual and social level. Easycare humans, if you will.

Sars Cov doesn't have health consequences for everyone who catches it. I'm sorry but this level of navel gazing is not helpful - the vast vast majority of people feel crap for about 3-4 days and the move on. There are some people who get hit worse.

I'd agree with you that individual citizens need to take personal responsibility for their own health but where we disagree is that other peoples actions impact others. Masks/ lockdowns/ social distancing/ vax passports are all based on feelings with no evidence ie " i feel safer with a bit of cloth on my face" but it doesn't mean anything. Its why all attempts to think the virus can be controlled have failed.

 

[primmiemoo]

In my own area about 10% of the people I know who have contracted the virus end up with long term issues .As well as my accountant with 25% less lung function my factor got it from his kids at Christmas and was very ill in spite of 3 vaccinations. When I met him in February he still had extreme fatigue issues and looked as white as a sheet. This is someone who was a keen mountain biker. No one is going to convince me that is not a bit of a lottery as to how an individuals body reacts to it.
Once the GPs return to full face to face consultations will I believe all risks with getting it are over.Surely GPs are all young enough to get the virus multiple times and not have any after effects.

My GP is the same age as me, but isn't in the best of health. He's definitely back face to face, aided by phone appointments ~ which are proving useful. His partner in the practice is a 30-something. Fit, vigorous, and was floored by covid. I think only now coming back to work full time. Both are good GPs. They soon send patients to the right specialist, and do genuinely care to chase up delays, etc, further along when they can.

 

[primmiemoo]

Sars Cov doesn't have health consequences for everyone who catches it. I'm sorry but this level of navel gazing is not helpful - the vast vast majority of people feel crap for about 3-4 days and the move on. There are some people who get hit worse.

I'd agree with you that individual citizens need to take personal responsibility for their own health but where we disagree is that other peoples actions impact others. Masks/ lockdowns/ social distancing/ vax passports are all based on feelings with no evidence ie " i feel safer with a bit of cloth on my face" but it doesn't mean anything. Its why all attempts to think the virus can be controlled have failed.

Enough people do have enough consequences from catching covid, though. There are impacts across the board from that significant number of cases of illness. I don't know what is meant by navel gazing in this context. Consequences from catching Epstein-Barr virus are only now coming to light. It can take decades to join the dots. SARS-CoV-2 is a novel virus, so we just cannot be confident to know outcomes from catching it.

I'm incredibly glad that I don't live in a totalitarian state that's enforced a zero covid policy. Aren't you?

 

[Mouser]

Enough people do have enough consequences from catching covid, though. There are impacts across the board from that significant number of cases of illness. I don't know what is meant by navel gazing in this context. Consequences from catching Epstein-Barr virus are only now coming to light. It can take decades to join the dots. SARS-CoV-2 is a novel virus, so we just cannot be confident to know outcomes from catching it.

I'm incredibly glad that I don't live in a totalitarian state that's enforced a zero covid policy. Aren't you?

Is it equally possible that consequences of novel vaccination may come to light in decades?

 

[primmiemoo]

Is it equally possible that consequences of novel vaccination may come to light in decades?

The likelihood is no. Vaccines work to train and ready the immune system. mRNA vaccines, like all others, are then broken down and excreted.

 

[Mouser]

The likelihood is no. Vaccines work to train and ready the immune system. mRNA vaccines, like all others, are then broken down and excreted.

So it's likely definitely not to be a possibility

 

[Northernlights]

we will live with unintended consequences for years - it’s affected a lot of children eduction and the NHS is going to struggle to cope with the mental health issues and late detected cancers etc which will kill more than covid has

Sars Cov doesn't have health consequences for everyone who catches it. I'm sorry but this level of navel gazing is not helpful - the vast vast majority of people feel crap for about 3-4 days and the move on. There are some people who get hit worse.

I'd agree with you that individual citizens need to take personal responsibility for their own health but where we disagree is that other peoples actions impact others. Masks/ lockdowns/ social distancing/ vax passports are all based on feelings with no evidence ie " i feel safer with a bit of cloth on my face" but it doesn't mean anything. Its why all attempts to think the virus can be controlled have failed.

Where I feel the mask issue has gone wrong is down to cost/education. If you wear FFP2 or better mask it will offer a high rate of protection. Using FFP3 masks for all hospital visits now and have alwas worn FFP2 masks on the farm for pollen and fungal spore issues. What price your lungs?

Using badly the flimsy pieces of cloth on some folk is doing no good at all.

 

[Mouser]

Where I feel the mask issue has gone wrong is down to cost/education. If you wear FFP2 or better mask it will offer a high rate of protection. Using FFP3 masks for all hospital visits now and have alwas worn FFP2 masks on the farm for pollen and fungal spore issues. What price your lungs?

Using badly the flimsy pieces of cloth on some folk is doing no good at all.

But still mask quality is not an issue anywhere, as long as you wore something hanging over your face all good. Same with vaccines, two doses offered basically no protection for spread since omicron ( could be argued ever) but it was still deemed necessary to socialize. Strange.

 

[primmiemoo]

So it's likely definitely not to be a possibility

Can't fault you for persistence!

 

[Clive]

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[Clive]

Sars Cov doesn't have health consequences for everyone who catches it. I'm sorry but this level of navel gazing is not helpful - the vast vast majority of people feel crap for about 3-4 days and the move on. There are some people who get hit worse.

I'd agree with you that individual citizens need to take personal responsibility for their own health but where we disagree is that other peoples actions impact others. Masks/ lockdowns/ social distancing/ vax passports are all based on feelings with no evidence ie " i feel safer with a bit of cloth on my face" but it doesn't mean anything. Its why all attempts to think the virus can be controlled have failed.

everyone i know has had it at least once - no one i know has any long term consequences


again people are being pathetic about this - there are far bigger, proven risks to most people lives or general health than covid many of which people pay to indulge in like cigarettes or alcohol !


for most people sorting their diet and exercise out would do far more for their health and energy than avoiding covid would

terrified of a mostly harmless virus but in love with junk food, drink and fags ……….. the ironic state of the average warped logic of the average brit today ! ……….. or an excuse to skip work / work from home maybe ?

 

[SilliamWhale]

Where I feel the mask issue has gone wrong is down to cost/education. If you wear FFP2 or better mask it will offer a high rate of protection. Using FFP3 masks for all hospital visits now and have alwas worn FFP2 masks on the farm for pollen and fungal spore issues. What price your lungs?

Using badly the flimsy pieces of cloth on some folk is doing no good at all.

I still think all masks are nonsense.

Look if you want to go around completely donned in safety gear all the time thats up to you. You would never concievably sit in a resturant, go to a sports game, go shopping or even to someone else' house again for fear of getting covid but don't make everyone do it if thats what you want to do

 

[SilliamWhale]

The likelihood is no. Vaccines work to train and ready the immune system. mRNA vaccines, like all others, are then broken down and excreted.

I don't think we have any idea yet.

 

[Northernlights]

I still think all masks are nonsense.

Look if you want to go around completely donned in safety gear all the time thats up to you. You would never concievably sit in a resturant, go to a sports game, go shopping or even to someone else' house again for fear of getting covid but don't make everyone do it if thats what you want to do

Thats exactly how so many farmers end up with "Farmers Lung" and end up carrying an oxgen bottle with them after spreading mouldy straw without a mask. and as someone who suffered from hayfever for nearly 50 years I can tell you they prevent the worst of the symptoms in air heavy with grass pollen. This was all known and taught when I was at Agri College 45 years ago

 

[bobk]

Thats exactly how so many farmers end up with "Farmers Lung" and end up carrying an oxgen bottle with them after spreading mouldy straw without a mask. and as someone who suffered from hayfever for nearly 50 years I can tell you they prevent the worst of the symptoms in air heavy with grass pollen. This was all known and taught when I was at Agri College 45 years ago

Yes I was shovelling wheat on to an auger for years in a dusty bin , had a nebuliser for the last 20 .

 

[Ukjay]

The one thing this thread has confirmed - is that society has evolved into shite...
Too many snowflakes supporting and forcing draconian actions to be taken against other level headed individuals whom can read between the lies, simply because they live in fear of everything outside of their own beliefs..
Welcome to the asylum run by loonatics...

 

[bobk]

The one thing this thread has confirmed - is that society has evolved into shite...
Too many snowflakes supporting and forcing draconian actions to be taken against other level headed individuals whom can read between the lies, simply because they live in fear of everything outside of their own beliefs..
Welcome to the asylum run by loonatics...

Very eloquent post , well done

 

[Ukjay]

Very eloquent post , well done

Sorry, truth hurts sometimes!

 

[SilliamWhale]

When brought in, nobody knew the novel virus's pattern beyond events in those countries hit first.

They knew a hell of a lot more than they pretended to know. In fact the info was out there way before lockdown

We were bounced into lockdown and daft measures on some seriously dodgy scaremongering

 

[SilliamWhale]

Thats exactly how so many farmers end up with "Farmers Lung" and end up carrying an oxgen bottle with them after spreading mouldy straw without a mask. and as someone who suffered from hayfever for nearly 50 years I can tell you they prevent the worst of the symptoms in air heavy with grass pollen. This was all known and taught when I was at Agri College 45 years ago

I think you are making quite a leap here. A mask for a virus vs a mask for breathing in dust are different things. Dust particles are way larger than virus particles