Donald J Trump will.....MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!!!

Honest john

Member
Location
Fenland
I just think it highlights how well DT knows his audience if nothing else. Tell farmers he is doing a deal that will allow them to produce more and buy more metal and they won’t sleep for excitement.

I’m with you on the Kurds. It is the worst thing he has done in office.

I don’t think we really know what’s going on.

Clearly the pentagon do.

Turkey clearly had decided to go in.
Clearly Trump decided not to get involved in yet another war.

Where Russia, Assad, Iran, sit with this time will tell.

Trump has been asking Europe to take their ISIS peoples back for some time to no avail.
So it’s looking like they will escape now.

USA has a base in Iraq so is close at hand.

Clearly Trumps thoughts must be if you want a fight get on with it. But I am getting the hell out.
 

oil barron

Member
Location
Aberdeenshire
I don’t think we really know what’s going on.

Clearly the pentagon do.

Turkey clearly had decided to go in.
Clearly Trump decided not to get involved in yet another war.

Where Russia, Assad, Iran, sit with this time will tell.

Trump has been asking Europe to take their ISIS peoples back for some time to no avail.
So it’s looking like they will escape now.

USA has a base in Iraq so is close at hand.

Clearly Trumps thoughts must be if you want a fight get on with it. But I am getting the hell out.

im no so sure. I think erdogan knew the exact buttons to push with DT to make him think he was doing an awesome deal and played him like a drum. You don’t abandon your allies
 

FlyBy

Member
I don’t think we really know what’s going on.

Clearly the pentagon do.

Turkey clearly had decided to go in.
Clearly Trump decided not to get involved in yet another war.

Where Russia, Assad, Iran, sit with this time will tell.

Trump has been asking Europe to take their ISIS peoples back for some time to no avail.
So it’s looking like they will escape now.

USA has a base in Iraq so is close at hand.

Clearly Trumps thoughts must be if you want a fight get on with it. But I am getting the hell out.

There was zero chance of Turkey attacking while the US had soldiers in the firing line. It would have meant in effect declaring war on America, which no-one is going to do. They’re only attacking because Trump gave them the green light to.
 
There was zero chance of Turkey attacking while the US had soldiers in the firing line. It would have meant in effect declaring war on America, which no-one is going to do. They’re only attacking because Trump gave them the green light to.


During the current offensive Turkey opened fire on USA special forces.

Why is it you post these dramatic assertions about the USA forces being some kind of super shield .. it obviously is not the case since Tukrey has been killing Kurds in Syria for years.

Stop posting information which is planely not true.
 

Honest john

Member
Location
Fenland
During the current offensive Turkey opened fire on USA special forces.

Why is it you post these dramatic assertions about the USA forces being some kind of super shield .. it obviously is not the case since Tukrey has been killing Kurds in Syria for years.

Stop posting information which is planely not true.

They did because they didn’t get them out quick enough when Trump gave the instruction.
It’s said there were only 50 special forces.

What about our special forces ?
 

FlyBy

Member
During the current offensive Turkey opened fire on USA special forces.

Why is it you post these dramatic assertions about the USA forces being some kind of super shield .. it obviously is not the case since Tukrey has been killing Kurds in Syria for years.

Stop posting information which is planely not true.

If you think Turkey aren’t afraid of the world’s only superpower who also just happen to have the power to crush the Turkish economy with sanctions, then you really are delusional. No country openly fires first on US troops, because it would be suicidal. Trump ok’d what is happening, for reasons we can only guess at.
 

Honest john

Member
Location
Fenland
If you think Turkey aren’t afraid of the world’s only superpower who also just happen to have the power to crush the Turkish economy with sanctions, then you really are delusional. No country openly fires first on US troops, because it would be suicidal. Trump ok’d what is happening, for reasons we can only guess at.

What is Turkeys game plan here ?
 
If you think Turkey aren’t afraid of the world’s only superpower who also just happen to have the power to crush the Turkish economy with sanctions, then you really are delusional. No country openly fires first on US troops, because it would be suicidal. Trump ok’d what is happening, for reasons we can only guess at.


Oh right .. so given Russia could also trounce Turkey then can you explain how Turkey got away with downing a Russian plane ?
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
DWARD LUCAS
october 14 2019, 12:01am, the times
Every US ally now fears betrayal like the Kurds
edward lucas
Trump’s erratic foreign policy means that European nations must prepare to be cast aside too
methode%2Ftimes%2Fprod%2Fweb%2Fbin%2F51cafb58-edf7-11e9-ba44-aad5db5172e7.jpg

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Perhaps the Kurds should have named the road to Raqqa “Trump Highway”. Or translated The Art of the Deal into Kurdish. Sycophancy certainly seems to have worked for Poland, which is basking, almost alone among American allies, in a favourable gaze from Washington. Soon 5,500 US troops will be posted there, including to a base the Poles cannily nicknamed Fort Trump.
Flattery, not loyalty, is the main currency now for America’s friends. Past sacrifice counts for nothing. The mainly Kurdish Syrian Defence Forces lost about 11,000 fighters battling Islamic State alongside US forces (who lost five people). But President Trump is indifferent to that, instead issuing a nonsensical rebuke that the Kurds did not take part in the Normandy landings. (In fact, 8,000 Kurdish troops fought in the war, chiefly helping to foil Nazi plans in Iraq. Some later served in Albania, Greece and Italy.)
Nor does strategic calculation matter much. The handful of US forces protecting the Kurdish-controlled zone in northern Syria were cheap and cost-effective. Their presence did not solve the country’s problems but they stopped them getting worse. Even Mr Trump’s staunchest defenders struggle to justify the abrupt withdrawal, announced off the cuff in a late-night, ill-prepared phone call with President Erdogan of Turkey. In the words of the wartime propaganda poster, careless talk costs lives. It should hang in the Oval Office.
To be fair, pulling out from “endless” foreign wars was a campaign promise. Mr Trump assures his supporters that the US has notched up a win. But with the Syrian Kurdish militia, once America’s staunchest and most effective regional ally, battered by Turkey and in retreat, Isis and al-Qaeda can regroup. Americans may forget the jihadists. But they have not forgotten America.
Worse, friends and foes alike will not forget the betrayal of the Kurds. Why should any ally now trust the US? Why should Russia hold back in its war in Ukraine, or in menacing other small countries on its borders: non-Nato Finland and Sweden, or Nato members such as Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania? It does not help if you have shed blood in US-led wars in faraway Afghanistan or Iraq. The president is not interested in what you did for him lately. Now is what matters.

An optimistic take on this is that Mr Trump will not make the same mistake twice; many Republican national security hawks are aghast at his reckless behaviour. With the impeachment battle looming, he can ill-afford to lose allies on Capitol Hill by mistreating allies abroad. But his chaotic administration seems rather good at repeating its mistakes.
A more cynical view is that the Kurds were inherently expendable. US interest in the Middle East is waning thanks to the shale boom, which has cut American dependence on imported energy. Counterterrorism has dropped down the agenda. Great-power competition is now the centrepiece of the administration’s national security strategy. Despite Mr Trump’s strange personal ties with President Putin, the White House is still hawkish towards the Kremlin; so too, emphatically, is Congress. The 30 million Kurds, stateless, isolated, lightly armed and tied to the terrorist PKK, are not in the same category as real countries. Moreover, US involvement in Syria was always half-hearted and temporary. It bears no comparison with the solemn, decades-old treaty obligations that bind the countries of Nato.
That too could be comforting were it not for the bruising treatment the president has already meted out to Japan and South Korea, two vital, long-standing US allies in Asia. Mr Trump’s erratic personal diplomacy with the North Korean and Chinese leaders has repeatedly blindsided and humiliated decision-makers in Tokyo and Seoul. Europeans could easily be next.
The main point for all countries that rely on American security guarantees is that outsourcing defence to the US is costlier and chancier than it seems. Mr Trump’s behaviour may be reckless and his words incoherent but he reflects heartfelt dissatisfaction with the country’s thankless role as world police. American taxpayers have long and rightly wondered why Europe — bigger and richer than the US — cannot foot the bills and take the risks involved in dealing with crises in its own neighbourhood. Allies, coddled for too long, will have to raise their defence spending, appetite for risk and readiness for innovative, taboo-busting co-operation. Anyone who thinks Brexit will allow this country to cut free from involvement in European foreign, security and defence policy has another think coming. As US involvement and dependability shrink, European countries have no choice but to do more, and to do it together.
Money still talks. Poland offered $2 billion (about £1.6 billion) towards the costs of the new US presence. Mr Trump has deployed nearly 3,000 US troops to Saudi Arabia, gleefully pointing out that the country has met his request to “pay us for everything we are doing”. Toomas Ilves, former president of ultra-loyal Estonia, wonders if the Pentagon will publish a price list; at least we will know where we stand, he says. US foreign policy engagement now depends on the answers to three flinty questions. Does the US have a vital interest at stake? More unpleasantly, what are the direct benefits (business, flattery, family) of this for Mr Trump? Will any of this count in a real crisis? Those who complain should count their blessings. The Kurds would love to have our difficulties.
 
They did because they didn’t get them out quick enough when Trump gave the instruction.
It’s said there were only 50 special forces.

What about our special forces ?


I don't think Turkey gives a monkeys about anyone IMHO.

They are in NATO, Europe isn't going to do anything, nor is Russia and Trump isn't going to fight an ally against Russia.

I also think Trump has other fish to fry.
 

FlyBy

Member
Oh right .. so given Russia could also trounce Turkey then can you explain how Turkey got away with downing a Russian plane ?

Because Turkey is a NATO member and under Article 5 any attack on a NATO country REQUIRES other NATO members to come to their defense.

It’s also worth noting the Russian plane was inside Turkish airspace and had refused to respond to warnings.

As it was, the Russians got payback in various attacks on the Turks outside Turkish borders, but knew better than to attack Turkey directly because it would have triggered a war against the US that they had no chance of winning conventionally.
 
Because Turkey is a NATO member and under Article 5 any attack on a NATO country REQUIRES other NATO members to come to their defense.

It’s also worth noting the Russian plane was inside Turkish airspace and had refused to respond to warnings.

As it was, the Russians got payback in various attacks on the Turks outside Turkish borders, but knew better than to attack Turkey directly because it would have triggered a war against the US that they had no chance of winning conventionally.


Exactly .. and that of course applies to the USA as well.

The first step to anything is throwing Turkey out of NATO which won't happen because the EU wants them to help against Russia.

Which IMHO is why Trump is doing what he is doing.
 

FlyBy

Member
Exactly .. and that of course applies to the USA as well.

The first step to anything is throwing Turkey out of NATO which won't happen because the EU wants them to help against Russia.

Which IMHO is why Trump is doing what he is doing.

What do you mean that applies to the US? America had troops stationed along that border, meaning Turkey couldn't invade without killing Americans. They were never going to do that. Then Trump moved the troops so Turkey could invade. What part of this is confusing you?
 

Farmer Roy

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
NSW, Newstralya
Ive been hearing a lot dismay and outrage even in the UK about Trump becoming the next president I think many people are missing the bigger picture, here we have one of the most successful businessmen in America with a serious drive to prove to people just how good he really is, a Wharton school of finance degree and $4 billion fortune proves beyond all doubt that he is incredibly smart, forget all the nonsense he talks the reality is he will make their economy stronger and country wealthier than Clinton would!
hahaha - this is SO funny 3 years later
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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