Draught horses vs electric tractors

[Wigeon]

OK, so riddle me this:

150 yrs ago the draught horse meant we could grow corn. That horse needed energy. I'm presuming this came from a mix of summer grazing, and winter hay.

Question is, on say 1000 acres, how much would have been devoted to producing the energy to till the soil?

Now then, fast forward 150 yrs. The electric tractor rules the roost. How much of the same 1000 acres needs covering in solar panels to produce the electric to till the soil?

Yes, I know there's a billion variables, but anyone like to hazard a guess at any numbers?

 

[glasshouse]

OK, so riddle me this:

150 yrs ago the draught horse meant we could grow corn. That horse needed energy. I'm presuming this came from a mix of summer grazing, and winter hay.

Question is, on say 1000 acres, how much would have been devoted to producing the energy to till the soil?

Now then, fast forward 150 yrs. The electric tractor rules the roost. How much of the same 1000 acres needs covering in solar panels to produce the electric to till the soil?

Yes, I know there's a billion variables, but anyone like to hazard a guess at any numbers?

Horses took 25-30% of the land to feed them
Biofuel roughly the same
Wind turbines take upvery little land

 

[yellowbelly]

Horses took 25-30% of the land to feed them
Biofuel roughly the same
Wind turbines take upvery little land

There's another little twist.....
The horses bred their own replacements too - you didn't need to spend money to trade them in every five or ten thousand hours. Mares could still work well into their pregnancy and whilst rearing a foal.

 

[glasshouse]

There's another little twist.....
The horses bred their own replacements too - you didn't need to spend money to trade them in every five or ten thousand hours. Mares could still work well into their pregnancy and whilst rearing a foal.

Time for a new niche
“Horsganic”
£1000/ton for wheat grown by horsepower!!

 

[glasshouse]

There's another little twist.....
The horses bred their own replacements too - you didn't need to spend money to trade them in every five or ten thousand hours. Mares could still work well into their pregnancy and whilst rearing a foal.

No compaction either

 

[Kidds]

It takes a lot of time and commitment to look after a horse, that bit alone rules them out.

 

[yellowbelly]

No compaction either

Well, I thought that too, but on another thread, a week or two ago, somebody reckoned that plough pans existed back in the days of real horse power.

You have to be careful not to look at it through rose coloured spectacles though.
I'm old enough to have known a good number of wagoners and horsemen - it was bloody hard work and a lot of them were pleased to see the early tractors arrive.

 

[glasshouse]

Well, I thought that too, but on another thread, a week or two ago, somebody reckoned that plough pans existed back in the days of real horse power.

You have to be careful not to look at it through rose coloured spectacles though.
I'm old enough to have known a good number of wagoners and horsemen - it was bloody hard work and a lot of them were pleased to see the early tractors arrive.

“Plough” pans existed before ploughs
No one said it was easy

 

[Villein]

Bring Back the Horses

Replacing tractors with real horse power could be the revolution that agriculture needs.

solar.lowtechmagazine.com

 

[yellowbelly]

Filling those AD maize clamps would certainly proceed at a much more leisurely pace..

 

[glasshouse]

Filling those AD maize clamps would certainly proceed at a much more leisurely pace..

What a caper

 

[Villein]

The above acticle covers the topic with a pretty detailed analysis but mentioned horses V tractors powered by bioethanol crops land area.

 

[Billboy1]

Time for a new niche
“Horsganic”
£1000/ton for wheat grown by horsepower!!

could be another sfi option

 

[Tarw Coch]

Not only would horses have needed about 30% of the land, they’d also have contributed to a similar percentage of the workload, making harvest and looking after them. Dad said one of the best bits of the arrival of the tractors was that you didn’t have to go catch them in the morning.
Horses would also have contributed to natural fertility for the soil, something you don’t necessarily get from renewables…………I guess they’d also have contributed to methane emissions so in the crazy world we live today would be seen as bad

 

[yellow belly]

horses need a lot of energy when working and were fed oats hay and grass did not power them

my grand father gave up horses for a tractor when one kicked a man and killed him
they were very dangerous

 

[Tarw Coch]

horses need a lot of energy when working and were fed oats hay and grass did not power them

my grand father gave up horses for a tractor when one kicked a man and killed him
they were very dangerous

Dads eldest brother got crushed by a horse, damaged his kidneys and was given 6 months to live, that would be getting on for 70 years ago now. Nothing they could do for him back then,

Local feed merchant used to take oats from dads home to feed the horses at Liverpool docks, used to fetch Indian corn back in payment, two tons for every ton taken, that was off an upland predominantly livestock farm in mid wales but I suppose just about all farms were mixed farms back then.
Also needs remembering, it wasn’t just farms that needed horses for power, go back a bit further and horsepower would have been very widely used, if anything, farming was probably a bit late catching on.

 

[miniconnect]

No compaction either

have you nobody with a few Clydesdales near you who lets them out in a field in winter?!

 

[glasshouse]

Dads eldest brother got crushed by a horse, damaged his kidneys and was given 6 months to live, that would be getting on for 70 years ago now. Nothing they could do for him back then,

Local feed merchant used to take oats from dads home to feed the horses at Liverpool docks, used to fetch Indian corn back in payment, two tons for every ton taken, that was off an upland predominantly livestock farm in mid wales but I suppose just about all farms were mixed farms back then.
Also needs remembering, it wasn’t just farms that needed horses for power, go back a bit further and horsepower would have been very widely used, if anything, farming was probably a bit late catching on.

It was a massive market for farm produce, oats, hay, straw , young horses.
All lost to oil

 

[Bogweevil]

Horses took 25-30% of the land to feed them
Biofuel roughly the same

Got a reference for that? Other people suggest 10% for biofuel, but of course that assumes high yields which would be due to use of energy intensive nitrogen fertilisers.

 

[Dry Rot]

From my school days I seem to remember, "Energy can neither be created nor destroyed". Unless I have got that wrong? All said to have changed with nuclear power? Even that is questionable. The trouble with these comparisons, it's difficult to factor in all that's involved.