easy care sheep margins

[willy]

please can someone with a reasonable flock (500+) of easy cares share some financial data with me.

what were your average selling prices for lambs last year? and when did you start to sell and finish selling? (lambing dates aswell)

what stocking rates.?
what were your total variable costs?
what were your lambing through to selling percentages.?

sorry to be nosey but i am seriously considering switching.

we currently run 850 nrth country mules and our figures are as follows for last year

output minus purchases £99150

variable costs £40000

gross margin £ 59150

but this does not include any labour costs

 

[exmoor dave]

are you planning on running a closed flock or flying flock (which i guess you are doing with the mules?)

 

[sean m]

please can someone with a reasonable flock (500+) of easy cares share some financial data with me.

what were your average selling prices for lambs last year? and when did you start to sell and finish selling? (lambing dates aswell)

what stocking rates.?
what were your total variable costs?
what were your lambing through to selling percentages.?

sorry to be nosey but i am seriously considering switching.

we currently run 850 nrth country mules and our figures are as follows for last year

output minus purchases £99150

variable costs £40000

gross margin £ 59150

but this does not include any labour costs

sounds to me like your already on top of your job

 

[Johnny400]

please can someone with a reasonable flock (500+) of easy cares share some financial data with me.

what were your average selling prices for lambs last year? and when did you start to sell and finish selling? (lambing dates aswell)

what stocking rates.?
what were your total variable costs?
what were your lambing through to selling percentages.?

sorry to be nosey but i am seriously considering switching.

we currently run 850 nrth country mules and our figures are as follows for last year

output minus purchases £99150

variable costs £40000

gross margin £ 59150

but this does not include any labour costs

Why?

 

[willy]

are you planning on running a closed flock or flying flock (which i guess you are doing with the mules?)

Flying flock.

Why?

Because I want to improve my bottom line I have a very big mortgage, also I have an ageing workforce and also I am trying to expand the arable business.

Also the biggest threat I see to my lamb production is the overall cost of lamb, and to stop the ever rising costs squeezing my botum line I want to see my options

 

[exmoor dave]

are you buying the mules as ewe lambs or grimmers?

you might struggle to find the number you need (i'm guessing 200+ per year?) at sensible money.

i'm in a similar boat, in that i have one "flying flock" of mules which i cross to suffolk to make up the other flock, i'm interested in maybe changing the mules over to wool shedders and go closed flock, i buy my mules as ewe lambs and over winter anyway so a closed flock wouldn't be a problem.

i've gone in to it cautiously and up to 60 now, but i'm doing it the full "easycare" system- outdoor lambing, etc etc

do you indoor or outdoor lamb the mules? and are you wanting to change this with the wool shedders?

purely on the wool front, the savings would be shearing, docking, pour on's on the ewes, hopefully not losing ewes on their backs, not having to check the ewes so much for being cast (so savings on fuel, vehicle wear and tear) probably more stuff besides.

question is does the wool chq cover the above and leave a profit?

 

[JD-Kid]

ummmm yer still going to need pour on for lice scab etc etc shearing would lower the need for fly control if done at the right time .. fat flat back sheep get cast i don't fully buy in to the wooly sheep get cast story

 

[neilo]

ummmm yer still going to need pour on for lice scab etc etc shearing would lower the need for fly control if done at the right time .. fat flat back sheep get cast i don't fully buy in to the wooly sheep get cast story

Agreed on the cast thing. I have very few cast ewes each year, and any that doget recorded and culled (hopefully before they achieve their aim). My ewes are reasonably wooly and also fairly broad (Texel base ewes and only 'chunky' Highlander rams used). I practice the same in the pedigree Charollais flock, and get very few that get cast. Again, offenders are culled at the first sensible opportunity.

 

[neilo]

Flying flock.


Because I want to improve my bottom line I have a very big mortgage, also I have an ageing workforce and also I am trying to expand the arable business.

Also the biggest threat I see to my lamb production is the overall cost of lamb, and to stop the ever rising costs squeezing my botum line I want to see my options

Would it be possible to move to a closed flock, if you are moving away from the need to buy in Mule replacements? That move would improve your bottom line by a fair chunk too, IME.
'Easycare' management works well with the right flock genetics IMO, but not if you try to do it with ewes not selected for such traits or with rams that throw lambs that need pulling. Some ewe breeds will also be better able to maintain condition on forage rather than with cereal based supplements, which again make a big difference to input costs if you have the ground/ability to outwinter.

 

[exmoor dave]

ummmm yer still going to need pour on for lice scab etc etc shearing would lower the need for fly control if done at the right time .. fat flat back sheep get cast i don't fully buy in to the wooly sheep get cast story

True but you'd hope not to have to deal with scab or lice regulary (I've not had to target either specificily for years- althou my flystrike control does lice as well)
Wool shedding can completely eliminate the need for fly control in the ewes.

My problem here is I've got to constantly treat for ticks and the best control covers fly as well (&lice).

I think wool shedders are a extremely attractive idea if you are after a closed flock on rough scruby ground (like me)
Only thing holding me back is that I shear the flock myself so the wool chq does genuinely add to the bottom line (even if it's only 4% of the sheep income)

 

[willy]

So come on then where are you easy care producers?

 

[hindmaist]

So come on then where are you easy care producers?

I tried to get similair info on here a while back,but got none.My own feeling is that,on an arable farm,sheep have to be high output to have any chance of producing an acceptable gross margin per acre.You would really need to try fifty to see,but it might be a damned nuisance having to run them separately through the winter etc.

 

[willy]

I tried to get similair info on here a while back,but got none.My own feeling is that,on an arable farm,sheep have to be high output to have any chance of producing an acceptable gross margin per acre.You would really need to try fifty to see,but it might be a damned nuisance having to run them separately through the winter etc.

I agree to some extent, as I only have 145 acres of grass for the 850 ewes, ok there is plenty of over wintered stumbles to keep them on all winter. And I would not want to increase the grass area but just wanted to see If I can squeeze a bit more margin out of the job.

At the moment we don't like to see grass in front of the sheep, because the
Lambs will pick at the grass and not the creep. So we are high input and high output. But I do feel that the price of lambs does have a top limit, and so to make more money we have to reduce the cost?

 

[Hilly]

Arnt figures for shedders the same as any other folk -wool cheque - shearing bill - fly control, - a couple of quid on each lamb ????

 

[exmoor dave]

So come on then where are you easy care producers?

Best ask
@Tim W @GTB @sean m

 

[GTB]

Our farm and land type is so far removed from the OP that it is irrelevant to this thread. All I will say is that you'll struggle to improve on the figures you quote. Low inputs usually means low outputs too. Your costs would be significantly reduced as would your labour needs.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

Arnt figures for shedders the same as any other folk -wool cheque - shearing bill - fly control, - a couple of quid on each lamb ????

Does the op want specific figures for wool shedders, or the 'easy care' principle of lower input, lower labour sheep in general, which could include Romneys, lleyns, highlanders or others?

 

[Hilly]

Does the op want specific figures for wool shedders, or the 'easy care' principle of lower input, lower labour sheep in general, which could include Romneys, lleyns, highlanders or others?

I don't subscribe to easy care, just means no care to me, they all require care and attention just some don't need to be shorn.

 

[GTB]

I don't subscribe to easy care, just means no care to me, they all require care and attention just some don't need to be shorn.

Wool shedding sheep don't need as much attention because they don't need shearing, dagging, ringtailing, fly control. They don't get stuck in brambles and fences much either. Lameness can be culled out as can lambing probelms etc over time.
There's a huge difference between easy care and don't care. A couple of our neighbours run a don't care system and they don't even have wool shedding sheep.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I don't subscribe to easy care, just means no care to me, they all require care and attention just some don't need to be shorn.

I know what you mean Hilly, but you keep/kept Romneys (?) Do you not think they are easier to keep, with lower inputs, than a mule or terminal crossed ewe flock - without the connotations of the word 'easycare'?