Easycare sheep experiment

[Kingcustard]

I would think the addition of texel blood would have the potential to include a few issues in exchange for a slightly meatier lamb.

There is a lot more money to be made in a lot more areas than an extra meaty lamb.

I think there is a place for those shedding texel genetics, but including them into the maternal shedding line is just a lazy mans way of improving carcass traits (with a trade off for something else).

Number one for me is scanning rate coupled with lamb survival.

I am going to trial Texels NZ Suffolks and pure EC tups on similar ewes this year and see if there is a big difference in the lambs, lambing ease, numbers, price per head and time to fatten.

The NZ Suffolks give great lambs but definitely have to lamb a few, nothing major but if the lambs from ECs on older ewes are anywhere close to the performance of the NZ Suff then I will just go pure all the way.

Can't remember having to lamb a pure EC so far and that is worth a lot in itself.

 

[CopperBeech]

I am going to trial Texels NZ Suffolks and pure EC tups on similar ewes this year and see if there is a big difference in the lambs, lambing ease, numbers, price per head and time to fatten.

The NZ Suffolks give great lambs but definitely have to lamb a few, nothing major but if the lambs from ECs on older ewes are anywhere close to the performance of the NZ Suff then I will just go pure all the way.

Can't remember having to lamb a pure EC so far and that is worth a lot in itself.

My shedders have NZ texel, NZ suffolk and a few other bits in them. But that blood was put in about ten years ago, and I've bred back to the highest index shedding tups available for the last ten years. Still get some dark faces and speckles but lambing ease the same. Killed 1/3 of the males lambs at weaning last year over 42kg. Weaning 10-14 weeks.

 

[Kingcustard]

My shedders have NZ texel, NZ suffolk and a few other bits in them. But that blood was put in about ten years ago, and I've bred back to the highest index shedding tups available for the last ten years. Still get some dark faces and speckles but lambing ease the same. Killed 1/3 of the males lambs at weaning last year over 42kg. Weaning 10-14 weeks.

My issue is I am basing the pure EC lambs off first time lambers which are usually smaller as a rule.

Haven't lambed anything older to a pure yet.

Interested to see how they do.

Would you say they have bigger lambs as they get older

 

[CopperBeech]

My issue is I am basing the pure EC lambs off first time lambers which are usually smaller as a rule.

Haven't lambed anything older to a pure yet.

Interested to see how they do.

Would you say they have bigger lambs as they get older

Yes I would say mature ewes usually scan better and milk better but also there is a lot of variation within the breed. At the start there were a lot of 55kg Welsh type shedders which reared a small o grade lamb.

I’ve got 65/70kg shedders which rear a 20-22kg r or u grade.

But I bought my first shedding flock about 12 years or so ago, closed the flock and have used high index rams wirh a focus on various traits since then. It’s cost me some money in rams, I believe up until last year I’ve bought the most expensive highest index exlana rams on sale most years. It’s been painful but progress has been good.

 

[Kingcustard]

Yes I would say mature ewes usually scan better and milk better but also there is a lot of variation within the breed. At the start there were a lot of 55kg Welsh type shedders which reared a small o grade lamb.

I’ve got 65/70kg shedders which rear a 20-22kg r or u grade.

But I bought my first shedding flock about 12 years or so ago, closed the flock and have used high index rams wirh a focus on various traits since then. It’s cost me some money in rams, I believe up until last year I’ve bought the most expensive highest index exlana rams on sale most years. It’s been painful but progress has been good.

If you divide the tup price by the lamb value sold off him its never as bad as you think. And even the most expensive aren't Suffolk or Black ie prices yet haha

 

[CopperBeech]

If you divide the tup price by the lamb value sold off him its never as bad as you think. And even the most expensive aren't Suffolk or Black ie prices yet haha

For me it’s more the value in the ewe lambs if that makes sense. Spreading the value of a £2500-£5000 maternal tup across the efficiencies of his daughter for the next however many years. But that’s probably enough!

Most folk want a maternal tup in the £500-£1000 range which I think is fair enough.

Sell commercial maternal tups in that range and let the geeks amongst us fight over the genetic freaks.

 

[unlacedgecko]

I would think the addition of texel blood would have the potential to include a few issues in exchange for a slightly meatier lamb.

There is a lot more money to be made in a lot more areas than an extra meaty lamb.

I think there is a place for those shedding texel genetics, but including them into the maternal shedding line is just a lazy mans way of improving carcass traits (with a trade off for something else).

That's me, stupidly trying to improve my sh!t sheep the lazy way.

Number one for me is scanning rate coupled with lamb survival.

Luckily my sh!t sheep have great lamb survival, as they are very maternal. If only there was a way to dramatically increase litter size with a single cross?

 

[CopperBeech]

That's me, stupidly trying to improve my sh!t sheep the lazy way.


Luckily my sh!t sheep have great lamb survival, as they are very maternal. If only there was a way to dramatically increase litter size with a single cross?

That wasn’t aimed at you at all, so don’t get offended.

But I have seen plenty of first x texel shedders which shed well enough and surprisingly why do have better carcass traits than the other shedders..... but then usually have a lower scan and lower lamb survival. Due to harder birthing mainly.

I actually think your project has a lot of merit. I know someone who has bred a large shedding flock up from mostly soay and Manx sheep as a base and make a lot of money grazing some awful ground (mostly land fills).

I’m not knocking the texel Shetland x, as you probably remember I used to run a flock of shetex ewes, bred up about 6-8 years ago, which I sold last year to one farm who loves them.

A smaller efficient short tailed shedding ewe with good muscling and a decent scan will be very appealing for a lot of upland and marginal farms.

I know you probably think a lot of my comments are aimed at you, but they aren’t. I just have an acerbic and miserable tone. I don’t like people. I prefer dogs.

 

[JSmith]

Shall we just say that if we want to aim any comments at anyone we just say “and this is aimed directly at you ……, I think your a xxxx!!” And then only one person will get offended if they so choose too, that way people won’t need to keep apologising!!

 

[Poorbuthappy]

That's me, stupidly trying to improve my sh!t sheep the lazy way.


Luckily my sh!t sheep have great lamb survival, as they are very maternal. If only there was a way to dramatically increase litter size with a single cross?

BFL?

 

[gwi1890]

I would think the addition of texel blood would have the potential to include a few issues in exchange for a slightly meatier lamb.

There is a lot more money to be made in a lot more areas than an extra meaty lamb.

I think there is a place for those shedding texel genetics, but including them into the maternal shedding line is just a lazy mans way of improving carcass traits (with a trade off for something else).

Number one for me is scanning rate coupled with lamb survival.

TBH I’ve seen little difference in scanning % or lamb survival between the texel x easycare and the conventional easycare here, muscle depth under the scanner very similar little to no difference, the texel x were leaner , grades dw similar, texel x better selling live, and better cull trade on the ewe.

 

[Tim W]

TBH I’ve seen little difference in scanning % or lamb survival between the texel x easycare and the conventional easycare here, muscle depth under the scanner very similar little to no difference, the texel x were leaner , grades dw similar, texel x better selling live, and better cull trade on the ewe.

And they LOOK good

 

[unlacedgecko]

BFL?

There will never be any BFL blood in my flock.

 

[gwi1890]

And they LOOK good

That’s more or less what it is, I personally like having a mix of both, but the £40 per head cull value in the texel x certainly helps.

 

[Kingcustard]

My Easycares seem to be able to go 180+ after their first lambing is out of the way.

This year would have been higher but I let 12 ewes run on that didn't rear lambs last year and only got 7 lambs out of them. Its amazing how a few barren ewes can knock your lambing percentages.

The gimmers do around 160% which I am more than happy with.

Biggest problem is the amount of gimmers every year as I build the numbers up, but the last 3 years have been over 170%+ and as the older ewes get more numerous this will increase hopefully.

Lamb survival is great with them whatever the ram is, but the biggest difference for me is ewe survival. Think I have had 10 dead ewes in 3 years and a few of these were easily avoidable.

 

[Boso]

That's me, stupidly trying to improve my sh!t sheep the lazy way.


Luckily my sh!t sheep have great lamb survival, as they are very maternal. If only there was a way to dramatically increase litter size with a single cross?

Use a booroola/fec b texel....

 

[unlacedgecko]

Use a booroola/fec b texel....

I'm using inverdale/fec X texel

 

[Woolless]

I would think the addition of texel blood would have the potential to include a few issues in exchange for a slightly meatier lamb.

There is a lot more money to be made in a lot more areas than an extra meaty lamb.

I think there is a place for those shedding texel genetics, but including them into the maternal shedding line is just a lazy mans way of improving carcass traits (with a trade off for something else).

Number one for me is scanning rate coupled with lamb survival.

Lazy man's way or not, it works. You get myomax and hybrid vigour and a splash of Texel makes your sheep more palatable to those buying in for the first time. There's always a downside to every upside but good old fashioned selective breeding, utilising all available tools, mitigates most of that.

 

[Woolless]

That’s more or less what it is, I personally like having a mix of both, but the £40 per head cull value in the texel x certainly helps.

I always thought working back from potential cull value when breeding your ewes was a bit defeatist. But with the trade they are nowadays, it has to be a consideration.

 

[Kingcustard]

Easycares I sold fat this year were £9 more than the mules on the same day and cost a lot less to buy