Electric vans

Y Fan Wen

Member
Location
N W Snowdonia
Ethanol is a manufactured fuel (alcohol) used in some classes of racing cars. Why not change from petrol to alcohol just with small changes to current engine technology? An alternative approach would be an ethanol fuel cell and electric drive. Just think of all those distilleries wanting grain feedstock!
 

Highland Mule

Member
Livestock Farmer
Ethanol is a manufactured fuel (alcohol) used in some classes of racing cars. Why not change from petrol to alcohol just with small changes to current engine technology? An alternative approach would be an ethanol fuel cell and electric drive. Just think of all those distilleries wanting grain feedstock!
Inefficiencies. Every step of chemical change has losses associated with it. We need to minimise the number of steps between photon and motion.
 

Pasty

Member
Location
Devon
On the radio this morning there was an industry rep stating that many PHEVs were actually worse for emissions than pure ICE cars because of the extra battery weight being carried around .....Doesn't surprise me as many are bought simply for for the tax benefits and the users have little interest in efficient usage.

"Self-Charging Hybrids" must be even worse..

This is the future,


Battery is currently (see what I did there) suitable for domestic use or city centre use and not a lot more .
Are you suggesting that they have not actually finally cracked perpetual motion? It charges it's self up, end of. Now put your fingers in your ears and sing la la la.
 

Pasty

Member
Location
Devon
Just a thought , is there a lot less fire risk from electric vehicles :unsure: ie no petrol, diesal, engine oil
Yes there is, far safer in general. Battery fires do happen although they are very, very rare and not as explosive as a plastic petrol tank going up. So, in theory you have more time to exit the car unless trapped / incapacitated. The flip side is that lithium fires are extremely hot so when they go, they really go. Tesla have a very impressive safety rating but there have been a few examples of cars going up with no outside interference.
 

Bury the Trash

Member
Mixed Farmer
Far safer? - a 70kw Tesla has about 12kg of lithium in the battery. Good luck putting that out if it short circuits in a crash.
Far safer? - a 70kwh Tesla has about 12kg of lithium in the battery pack. Good luck putting it out if it short circuits in a crash.
:sneaky:

Yes fair point but What about ignition , what I mean is like petrol vapours will go up' just like that' if they are there, ie around the engine compartment, both petrol and diesal are injected at high pressure these days which adds extra risk, the fuel tank is so vulnerable......

How easily is it to ignite a lithium battery and I suppose they could be put inside a strong protective case .
 

Tubbylew

Member
Location
Herefordshire
:sneaky:

Yes fair point but What about ignition , what I mean is like petrol vapours will go up' just like that' if they are there, ie around the engine compartment, both petrol and diesal are injected at high pressure these days which adds extra risk, the fuel tank is so vulnerable......

How easily is it to ignite a lithium battery and I suppose they could be put inside a strong protective case .
 

Pasty

Member
Location
Devon
Yeah but what is the likelihood of a fire in an accident vs a petrol car? EVs have been known to go up while charging etc. and I accept that if you crashed and were unable to escape and it went up, there would be very little left but the point is would you rather be rear ended and knocked unconscious or trapped in a model 3 or in a modern petrol car with a plastic tank of explosive liquid? I think I'd take my chances on the EV to be honest.
 

PSQ

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Scottish Borders
Yeah but what is the likelihood of a fire in an accident vs a petrol car? EVs have been known to go up while charging etc. and I accept that if you crashed and were unable to escape and it went up, there would be very little left but the point is would you rather be rear ended and knocked unconscious or trapped in a model 3 or in a modern petrol car with a plastic tank of explosive liquid? I think I'd take my chances on the EV to be honest.
Would you rather be killed by several hundred ravenous tabby cats, or one very large tiger?



 

Pasty

Member
Location
Devon
Would you rather be killed by several hundred ravenous tabby cats, or one very large tiger?

You can pull up any stat. It's tragic and I have already said that when these things go up, they really do. I'm afraid I have witnessed a crash where the driver was trapped and the car set on fire (petrol). I couldn't get near and drove like a loon to a local garage who came out with extinguishers but it was too late. That will live with me and the mechanics for the rest of our lives, it was absolutely hideous and I have told very few people because it still troubles me. I would still take my chances on an EV to be safer. Nothing is 100%.
 

Bury the Trash

Member
Mixed Farmer
You can pull up any stat. It's tragic and I have already said that when these things go up, they really do. I'm afraid I have witnessed a crash where the driver was trapped and the car set on fire (petrol). I couldn't get near and drove like a loon to a local garage who came out with extinguishers but it was too late. That will live with me and the mechanics for the rest of our lives, it was absolutely hideous and I have told very few people because it still troubles me. I would still take my chances on an EV to be safer. Nothing is 100%.
I prefer Diesels as i have been in a petrol car that has exploded into flames leaving me seconds to get out , which i was able to. thankfully.
That's why i asked.
 

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