ELMS Fiasco

Wombat

Member
BASIS
Location
East yorks
The difference is that before you could invest the money as you see fit. In future it will have to be spent on things from a list of options that may or may not benefit your business.
If you have to spend £9,000 on something that's not beneficial to your business just to get paid £10,000 you are only getting £1,000 even though the Government appears to be throwing money at it.
But the gov holds u in hock for the 10k while in effect you make 1k, therefor as I see it at the moment I would rather not spent the 9k and lose the 1k and do as I please (within the law)
 
Reliance on subsidy is not sustainable
If we do away with it the farmers that can't cope will leave and new farmers with different models and who are not addicted to govt aid will take their place

The reduction in state payments should be good for new farmers
The reduction in state aid would be good for farmers were there no government interference as to how they wish to farm and no state aid in countries competeing for the same market...
 

delilah

Member
The difference is that before you could invest the money as you see fit. In future it will have to be spent on things from a list of options that may or may not benefit your business.
If you have to spend £9,000 on something that's not beneficial to your business just to get paid £10,000 you are only getting £1,000 even though the Government appears to be throwing money at it.

You say that as if all of this is decided. It isn't. The SFI is a blank piece of paper. No-one will say as much, but it is. You - and everyone else on here - need to say what you want the SFI to look like.
 

steveR

Member
Mixed Farmer
This might be ok on better ground where you can get the production to cover your costs but in the extensive hill and upland sector it just means the end of farming in these areas. Farming subs in these areas always has been and always will be a social subsidy to maintain the fabric of the countryside. Schools go ,shops go and then the people go .

Well put @Top Tip.

Juat look at what happened in France when you get past a critical population level in the uplands and difficult areas, the villages just die. Granted the pokey little country that we live in is somewhat different, but how many commuters will want to be based in a desolate village with the nearest facilities (and community) 10miles away.
 
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Why they didn't just make the environmental measures mandatory and put a cap on the amount paid (or sliding scale, a rate for 0-100 acres, 100-200 acres and so on).

Would have been simple to implement and check. No need to look at paperwork and calculations - every tree, hedge and watercourse should have an offset. Simple.
Too simple and sensible but won’t fit the agenda of being able to blame farmers for not taking up the options and passing the buck.
 
It is an irrelevant question
The BPS is going, we know that
ELMS will not replace it ---that is evident
The public expects that standards are maintained & we will have to comply

All the above is happening ---no point in whinging ---best to just be prepared and buy my sheep
Yes, just roll over and have you're tummy tickled. I've finished the last sentence for you
 

Cowcorn

Member
Mixed Farmer
Kinda looks like the whole ELMS botch is just going to be one big PITA ..
I really cant understand why the Gov doesent continue paying say 100 quid an acre up to a maximium of say 150 acres them 50 quid on the next hundred and maybe a fiver for every acre after that so Guy and the rest of the " efficent " wont feel disadvantaged !!!
Lots of smaller farmers supporting their communities and keeping shops ,schools, and other local business has to be the ultimate " public good " .... Not to mention the fact that producing food is hardly a minor thing .
The benefits to society would be enoromous.
The reason the large " efficent" operators are so down on small farmers support is because the are like sharks the have to keep gobbling up the small fry to maintain their model .
If support is front loaded in favour of smaller units then maybe a lot of snaller farms might even restart farming and retire the " contract farmer " .
You never know what way the ball will hop heres hoping ....
 
Location
North Notts
I contract share farm with a landowner in our village, 100 acres so not a big landowner but a wealthy chap and he keeps the subs so can’t see that working. Lots of landowners claiming subs and not the farmers I think that is a real problem.
if defra want farmers to join elms they need to offer more money or make it really simple. Staff that try to help would be a great start .
 

steveR

Member
Mixed Farmer
I contract share farm with a landowner in our village, 100 acres so not a big landowner but a wealthy chap and he keeps the subs so can’t see that working. Lots of landowners claiming subs and not the farmers I think that is a real problem.
if defra want farmers to join elms they need to offer more money or make it really simple. Staff that try to help would be a great start .

There are no doubt good staff, but the mindset of them where they are employed on VERY short term contracts is never going to be the most enthusiastic...

Another problem that needs resolving if the good working relationship we need, is going to happen.
 
Location
Devon
Prob take a change in outlook rather than a few sheep purchases for most farmers i think

Your business model is based ( from what you have said in the past ) on getting land rent free so no costs either rent/ reseeding/ drainage/ fencing/ hedgecutting/ new gates/ clearing ditches etc....

So who pays for all these costs in your brave new world where there is no sub and no rent money for landowners??
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 77 43.5%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 62 35.0%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 28 15.8%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.7%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.7%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 4 2.3%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,285
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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