Enzootic abortion

[twizzel]

Having a few problems with enzo so wondered if anyone could shed some light on a couple of things. 2 weeks ago 4 year old ewe aborted her 3rd set of twins. Pm showed enzo and nothing else. Ewes were toxo and enzo vaccinated in August 2020, after flockcheck bloods last spring on 6 empty/aborted ewes showed positive to toxo but all bloods for enzo were negative. Thought I just as well do enzovax if I was doing toxovax.
All my ewes scanned in lamb, no empties.

Fast forward to lambing- first ewe was the aborted ewe (now isolated) then second ewe lambed last night from a different pen- scanned for 2, had a big single ram alive but placenta wasn’t right and some white gloop followed so expect she’s absorbed the other one soon after scanning.

So questions- can I keep any ewe lambs as replacements if this happens again? Obviously will carry on vaccinating everything now.
I was going to cull the aborted ewe- but reading last night msd who make the vaccines say not to cull ? I’d rather like to keep the ewe that lambed last night as she’s pedigree and given me some super ewe lambs over the past couple years.

If screening bloods for enzo were negative last year... the flock is closed apart from a ram I bought last year, where did it come from? The vet wondered if the ram could be a carrier but the flock he came from has no history of enzo and all the ewes were vaccinated by the time he met them.? Incidentally the 2 ewes that have lambed so far I also bought from the same flock as where the ram came from (unrelated ram, obv).

The vets are going to speak to the drug company but I am stumped and in a small flock could potentially lose a lot of my foundation ewes if this carries on. So just wondered if anyone could answer the culling replacements and ewes, or had any advice

 

[neilo]

Iirc some ewes that abort with EAE can become carriers, but by no means all. Most will get over it and become resistant.
If you are going to vaccinate all replacements from now on, they ‘shouldn’t’ be at any risk from a carrier ewe, even if there was one. I’d usually cash an aborted ewe in as a cull personally, purely for economic reasons, but I’d not be concerned about the disease implications of keeping her, as long as the rest are vaccinated.

 

[Nithsdale]

I found I had Enzo about 4-5 years ago. I vaccinated the flock but was warned the odd ewe would already have Enzo in her system and could abort that first lambing after vaccinating...

As I understand it;
You've now broken the cycle by vaccinating everything. These ewes you've got now are the abortion cycle ending. Just keep doing all replacements each year and you should have no more problems after this lambing.

Keep those ewes, too

 

[twizzel]

Ideal thank you. I’m thinking to cash the aborted one in and keep the one that had the 1 live lamb. Vet has suggested screening replacement ewe lambs which might be an idea, and killing those that are positive. Not sure the logistics of it yet but we’ll see.

 

[Nithsdale]

I'm not up on this part of it but why does the vet suggest screening your ewe lambs?

My head says If the flock is vaccinated and you do all ewe lambs as they go into the flock each year there shouldn't be any more issues.

 

[gatepost]

If a ewe picks up Enzo prior to being vaccinated, but after she lambed she will abort the next time, but unlikely ever to again, a, because she has been vaccinated and b, because she now has her own immunity, often you have to work your way through it, what might be a good idea is to jab any replacement ewe lambs now before lambing ie when there will be infection floating about on the farm, even if they are not to be lambed until gimmers,

 

[twizzel]

I'm not up on this part of it but why does the vet suggest screening your ewe lambs?

My head says If the flock is vaccinated and you do all ewe lambs as they go into the flock each year there shouldn't be any more issues.

Can ewe lambs be born with infection if the mother has it ? That is my concern, that they are infected through their mother before they get vaccinated. I don’t know, the vet is going to ring the drug company to find out for sure.

I was going to jab my 2020 and 2021 ewe lambs together in the summer as there’s only half a dozen I kept from last year, and don’t want to waste vaccine.

 

[neilo]

Can ewe lambs be born with infection if the mother has it ? That is my concern, that they are infected through their mother before they get vaccinated. I don’t know, the vet is going to ring the drug company to find out for sure.

I was going to jab my 2020 and 2021 ewe lambs together in the summer as there’s only half a dozen I kept from last year, and don’t want to waste vaccine.

Yes, I think so. Iirc ewe lambs can pick it up if fostered onto an aborted ewe too.

 

[Al R]

Can ewe lambs be born with infection if the mother has it ? That is my concern, that they are infected through their mother before they get vaccinated. I don’t know, the vet is going to ring the drug company to find out for sure.

I was going to jab my 2020 and 2021 ewe lambs together in the summer as there’s only half a dozen I kept from last year, and don’t want to waste vaccine.

The enzovax vaccine does come in 10 dose pots too by the way.

 

[Nithsdale]

Can ewe lambs be born with infection if the mother has it ? That is my concern, that they are infected through their mother before they get vaccinated. I don’t know, the vet is going to ring the drug company to find out for sure.

I was going to jab my 2020 and 2021 ewe lambs together in the summer as there’s only half a dozen I kept from last year, and don’t want to waste vaccine.

It's a very small % and chance. Personally wouldn't say it was anything to really worry about. How big a flock or many ewe lambs are we talking here?

I'd be more inclined to manage the small issue (cull the current ewe lambs first crop of lambs, keep them separate if possible from rest of flock etc) for 1 year, than go through screening the females...

 

[twizzel]

It's a very small % and chance. Personally wouldn't say it was anything to really worry about. How big a flock or many ewe lambs are we talking here?

I'd be more inclined to manage the small issue (cull the current ewe lambs first crop of lambs, keep them separate if possible from rest of flock etc) for 1 year, than go through screening the females...

Only a very small flock, I kept 10 ewe lambs which are lambing now for first time as shearlings and there’s only half a dozen I kept from last year running empty which are away on a different farm.
I was wondering whether to cull lambs from any suspect lambings, but if the placenta and lambs are all ok whether they could be kept.

 

[primmiemoo]

If of help, when enzo was bought in here and caused an abortion storm, we decided to vaccinate all of the breeders, including the keeper ewe lambs as soon as the right time came along before next tupping.

We took the view that keeping lines we valued was worth the low risk of one or two ewes slipping. As it was, the jabs worked well, and we've only had to jab keeper ewe lambs since. The storm was getting on for 15 years ago. The oldest ewes are 9yo, now, so could, technically, have had a second jab at 6yo, but keeping the younger flock covered has prevented them from reinfection.

 

[Nithsdale]

If of help, when enzo was bought in here and caused an abortion storm, we decided to vaccinate all of the breeders, including the keeper ewe lambs as soon as the right time came along before next tupping.

We took the view that keeping lines we valued was worth the low risk of one or two ewes slipping. As it was, the jabs worked well, and we've only had to jab keeper ewe lambs since. The storm was getting on for 15 years ago. The oldest ewes are 9yo, now, so could, technically, have had a second jab at 6yo, but keeping the younger flock covered has prevented them from reinfection.

Agree with this.

I didn't have a storm, vet called it a grumble - we had issues and knew something wasn't right but it was only a handful ewes a year, nothing obvious but bloods conformed it. No doubt if ignored it could have exploded into a storm at some point.

I vaccinated everything from ewe lambs upto 4-crop. Deciding the oldest ewes probably had been exposed and were worth the risk (also a bit like this Covid, trying to maximise protection with minimal work/injections).

The following year there was maybe 1 or 2 issues which were carried over with ewes which had contracted the abortion before being vaccinated. But ever since, there have been zero problems.

That was 6 years ago now

 

[twizzel]

That’s really promising, thanks both. I’ll carry on vaccinating (seems all I do is vaccinate for something be it the sheep or sucklers ) but as you say keeping good ewe lines up is really important now I feel I’m actually getting somewhere with my little flock. Had a nice single ram last night from a first time ewe no problems at all which made me feel a bit better.

 

[primmiemoo]

Glad there are normal lambings for you. Hope the rest of them match that or better

I like idea of tackling a grumble in the flock much better than dealing with the heartbreak of a storm! Worth incorporating jabs, for short- and long-term.

I'm sure your vet will have mentioned being strict about handwashing, etc, for yourself and family. Enzo can be zoonotic (as if there needs to be anything else to think about )

 

[Kip]

Agree with this.

I didn't have a storm, vet called it a grumble - we had issues and knew something wasn't right but it was only a handful ewes a year, nothing obvious but bloods conformed it. No doubt if ignored it could have exploded into a storm at some point.

I vaccinated everything from ewe lambs upto 4-crop. Deciding the oldest ewes probably had been exposed and were worth the risk (also a bit like this Covid, trying to maximise protection with minimal work/injections).

The following year there was maybe 1 or 2 issues which were carried over with ewes which had contracted the abortion before being vaccinated. But ever since, there have been zero problems.

That was 6 years ago now

Hi, sorry to bring all this back up again but I think I’m going through a bit of a grumble myself. I’ve had about 12 ewes out of 400 abort so far and I’ve lambs away getting tested at the moment. My question is will my aborted ewes abort next year if l keep them even if l vaccinate them? And are they spreading the disease about for others to pick up making them abort next year? I’m planning on vaccinating all my breeding ewes in the back end for enzo but worried I’m still going to have issues because I’ve kept all my aborted ewes and they will be joining the rest of the flock in the summer?
My vet advising not to rush out injection with engemycin till I get positive result. Ewes due to start lambing next week. Thanks, I thought you would be the best person to ask for some advice.

 

[Greythundercloudys]

The last fortnight before lambing is always a bugger but once you get 2 or three sets of twins away you go and forget about the ones that lmbed early, sell them if there anyway fleshy.

 

[twizzel]

Hi, sorry to bring all this back up again but I think I’m going through a bit of a grumble myself. I’ve had about 12 ewes out of 400 abort so far and I’ve lambs away getting tested at the moment. My question is will my aborted ewes abort next year if l keep them even if l vaccinate them? And are they spreading the disease about for others to pick up making them abort next year? I’m planning on vaccinating all my breeding ewes in the back end for enzo but worried I’m still going to have issues because I’ve kept all my aborted ewes and they will be joining the rest of the flock in the summer?
My vet advising not to rush out injection with engemycin till I get positive result. Ewes due to start lambing next week. Thanks, I thought you would be the best person to ask for some advice.

Yes your aborted ewes will spread disease through birth fluids/discharge so any ewes that pick up infection now it seems can almost harbour it in the uterus and abort next lambing, even if vaccinated. That’s the jist I got anyway. So it’ll gradually keep decreasing every year. My aborted ewe is going cull, and the lambs I've had born since are all seeming okay. We jabbed everything with alamycin a couple weeks ago. Best thing to do with any aborted ewes is isolate immediately and disinfect where they lambed, or use lots of straw to clean up after.

I don’t think they will abort next year but I think they will keep spreading it? Or that’s how I understood it.

 

[Kip]

Yes your aborted ewes will spread disease through birth fluids/discharge so any ewes that pick up infection now it seems can almost harbour it in the uterus and abort next lambing, even if vaccinated. That’s the jist I got anyway. So it’ll gradually keep decreasing every year. My aborted ewe is going cull, and the lambs I've had born since are all seeming okay. We jabbed everything with alamycin a couple weeks ago. Best thing to do with any aborted ewes is isolate immediately and disinfect where they lambed, or use lots of straw to clean up after.

I don’t think they will abort next year but I think they will keep spreading it? Or that’s how I understood it.

All my aborted ewes are isolated and will probably cull when out of fluke retention period. Just a bit fed up with the whole situation and find it very frustrating when you find another one aborted.

How many times did you give your ewes alamycin? Thanks

 

[primmiemoo]

It was just the one dose of antib's with our lot, but it was all under the Vet, @Kip .

It is disappointing when it's one after the other. Sympathies, Cyberchum. Hoping there are more normal lambings very soon