Farming from March to September Only

[Kiwi Pete]

Can you incorporate a fallow into your rotation, and be paid for it? Seems like the way to go, from what I read on here there are some good options to not only give a spell between crops but also to hedge risk a little.

 

[GeorgeK]

I think, like Farmer Roy, now risk seems to be increasing, we need to be able to walk away for the year if conditions aren't right. It's so marginal now, anything drilled in less than ideal conditions in an efficient manner is going to struggle to give an acceptable return from day one

 

[Lawless]

In 2018 we went to a 50:50 winter/spring cropping. 2019 it was 12% winter 88% spring and for 2020 it was the same 12:88 and going into 2021 it’ll be 12:88. 2022 the plan at the minute is 30:70. It certainly makes winter far easier but there’s the hassle of a dry spring so I think it’s only achievable via no till and cover crops to preserve moisture.
We’ll all be only cropping 50% of the land anyway when ELMS kicks in.

@warksfarmer you have mentioned before the potential for much less cropped area once ELMS starts to take effect. Am I right in thinking that you are taking part in the ELMS pilot scheme? Could you expand on what you are finding now and see becoming main stream once adopted? Please ignore if I have got this completely wrong!

 

[ih1455xl]

If under drained why not plant some drains over winter?
dig ditches out hire or buy a trencher bit of pipe and splash of gravel every 40meters

 

[Lincsman]

If under drained why not plant some drains over winter?
dig ditches out hire or buy a trencher bit of pipe and splash of gravel every 40meters

Dont think he meant lack of drains, just the land has drains under it.
Similar here on proper clay, without good deep cultivation it floods too easily.. stubble fields in winter just become lakes when not cultivated.
Wet autumns when it gets paddled are on course to fail if weather is anything but a dry winter,.

 

[DrWazzock]

Dont think he meant lack of drains, just the land has drains under it.
Similar here on proper clay, without good deep cultivation it floods too easily.. stubble fields in winter just become lakes when not cultivated.
Wet autumns when it gets paddled are on course to fail if weather is anything but a dry winter,.

That’s right. The drainage system is reasonably good and well maintained but it’s so easy to seal the clay over. Best to leave it alone if in doubt.

 

[4course]

This is what I do. I have enough trouble keeping crops alive over the summer, never mind the winter.
PFKIS. Proper farmers keep it simple. Winter is spent maintaining a medieval manor house, holiday cottage, WW2 era sheds, and 1970/ 80's machinery.
No skiing trips and all that boll0cks for me.

it all depends wether you live to farm or farm to live , I will corvid allowing be off skiing next jan /march for a week or so each trip and as im getting short of time ( age)will engage in as much rubbish as possible and i consider myself a proper farmer but then I still plough ho ho however will not start to take it easy until end of october and by easy I mean taking wednesdays off so as not to feck both weekends up

 

[ih1455xl]

That’s right. The drainage system is reasonably good and well maintained but it’s so easy to seal the clay over. Best to leave it alone if in doubt.

Sounds more like slow drain causing it to slump had the same here till we re drained it completely different now no standing water and this is on blue brick clay that they made the railway brick out of along with reduced deep cultivations only use paraplow or michel soil loosener no deeper than needed and mole plough

 

[Devil's advocate]

Sounds more like slow drain causing it to slump had the same here till we re drained it completely different now no standing water and this is on blue brick clay that they made the railway brick out of along with reduced deep cultivations only use paraplow or michel soil loosener no deeper than needed and mole plough

Dr Wazzock drains might run backwards in a wet time.

 

[Devil's advocate]

I've got a decent living here but it is hardwork & relentless.

Often thought about a simple cereal, sheep, grass system & one contract service such as spraying or maybe drystone walling.

If I was farming the farm the good Doctor describes I would be running an early lambing sheep flock, but it all comes down to personnal choice.

 

[Cowcorn]

I've got a decent living here but it is hardwork & relentless.

Often thought about a simple cereal, sheep, grass system & one contract service such as spraying or maybe drystone walling.

If I was farming the farm the good Doctor describes I would be running an early lambing sheep flock, but it all comes down to personnal choice.

I too earn a decent living off 220 acres of cereals and 120 dairy cows but dairy farming is hard work when you youre the wrong side of fifty . But as farming is the only income we have and with my daughter starting college this year i will be milking for another few years . My teenage son has become very involved on the arable side since school closed last march due to the covid crisis but alas returns to the books next monday and not even one field cut . . The Good Doctor is a very wise man thinking clearly about how to simpify his operation and boost his income without running himself ragged . As grain prices show no sign of leaving the eighties and catching up with twenty first century living costs and with Bps payments coming to an end many more small and meduim sized arable farmers are going to have to consider their options
A sad reality,

 

[unlacedgecko]

We are thinking of giving this a try. Nothing but spring combinable crops. Alright we won’t make a fortune but might have less of a bad time all round and we can work off farm for a 6 months clear run. Change is as good as a rest and all that. At the moment the year just seems to drag on from one pain in the ass problem to another.
Sheep going, beet going. Shut the shop on 30th September, reopen 1st March. Maybe down to two spring crops, barley and something else. Could be a way forward for our small patch and break the cycle.

Sounds like a great plan. Would you be interested in putting in 200 acre stubble turnips? Sheep and fences gone and bill paid 28 Feb.

 

[GeorgeK]

The problem is farming is a hobby, a way of life and a passion, and as such farmers seem willing to do whatever it takes to keep going. Work smarter, harder, for less money and when that doesn't work get another job and work for free. Even then you still won't compete against development millions that are merrily thrown into the black hole that UK ag has become.
The idea of making a decent return has long since left the building, the idea of earning a living is fast evaporating, all that remains is the need to do "Whatever it takes" (rarely a sensible policy), and becoming enslaved to the land for the remainder of our useful lives.
Of course I'm generalising, but there's far too much of this madness about at the moment to allow real, efficient, profitable businesses to prosper as they should

 

[DrWazzock]

Sounds like a great plan. Would you be interested in putting in 200 acre stubble turnips? Sheep and fences gone and bill paid 28 Feb.

My brother had thought of this and we have done it on the lighter fields after winter barley some years. A good idea in principle. But this year we are too late getting the cereals off for the turnips to get to a decent size and we’d need our heads testing to fatten store lambs past New Year with no trade deal in sight. Poaching can be a problem here with stock on the land over winter whereas if it’s given a once over with a primary cultivator in the autumn it has broken down to a nice tilth by the following spring if left alone and can be drilled in one pass.
I admire your enthusiasm though.

 

[Devil's advocate]

The problem is farming is a hobby, a way of life and a passion, and as such farmers seem willing to do whatever it takes to keep going. Work smarter, harder, for less money and when that doesn't work get another job and work for free. Even then you still won't compete against development millions that are merrily thrown into the black hole that UK ag has become.
The idea of making a decent return has long since left the building, the idea of earning a living is fast evaporating, all that remains is the need to do "Whatever it takes" (rarely a sensible policy), and becoming enslaved to the land for the remainder of our useful lives.
Of course I'm generalising, but there's far too much of this madness about at the moment to allow real, efficient, profitable businesses to prosper as they should

So we should get out of the way & let these "efficent" farmers have all the land cheap then?

 

[DrWazzock]

The problem is farming is a hobby, a way of life and a passion, and as such farmers seem willing to do whatever it takes to keep going. Work smarter, harder, for less money and when that doesn't work get another job and work for free. Even then you still won't compete against development millions that are merrily thrown into the black hole that UK ag has become.
The idea of making a decent return has long since left the building, the idea of earning a living is fast evaporating, all that remains is the need to do "Whatever it takes" (rarely a sensible policy), and becoming enslaved to the land for the remainder of our useful lives.
Of course I'm generalising, but there's far too much of this madness about at the moment to allow real, efficient, profitable businesses to prosper as they should

That’s a fair assessment. I also wonder how much of UK agriculture is subsidised by the state pension!

 

[teslacoils]

So we should get out of the way & let these "efficent" farmers have all the land cheap then?

Unless there is some dedicated system to punish the larger farm to help the smaller farm then the big are only going to get bigger. The "hobby" farm will get progressively larger. It's a wonder knowing what to do for the best.

One thing to add is that those who've bought land from outside / development money often employ very good managers and get good returns. And the farms that have grown most have done so for the reason that they are good farmers. No point slagging off the successful imho.

But so tricky knowing what to do for the best. It's easy for folk to say get a job off farm, but when you've done nothing else, or live in the middle of nowhere it's not quite as simple.

 

[unlacedgecko]

My brother had thought of this and we have done it on the lighter fields after winter barley some years. A good idea in principle. But this year we are too late getting the cereals off for the turnips to get to a decent size and we’d need our heads testing to fatten store lambs past New Year with no trade deal in sight. Poaching can be a problem here with stock on the land over winter whereas if it’s given a once over with a primary cultivator in the autumn it has broken down to a nice tilth by the following spring if left alone and can be drilled in one pass.
I admire your enthusiasm though.

I’ve a contractor with a 36m rig to broadcast them into standing crops. My mobile number is in my signature if you want to try it.

 

[texas pete]

I’ve a contractor with a 36m rig to broadcast them into standing crops. My mobile number is in my signature if you want to try it.

I've never tried broadcasting them into a standing crop.

How do you get on with it? Very moisture dependent I assume, though not an issue at the moment.

 

[Devil's advocate]

Unless there is some dedicated system to punish the larger farm to help the smaller farm then the big are only going to get bigger. The "hobby" farm will get progressively larger. It's a wonder knowing what to do for the best.

One thing to add is that those who've bought land from outside / development money often employ very good managers and get good returns. And the farms that have grown most have done so for the reason that they are good farmers. No point slagging off the successful imho.

But so tricky knowing what to do for the best. It's easy for folk to say get a job off farm, but when you've done nothing else, or live in the middle of nowhere it's not quite as simple.

At no point have I slagged off large farms but George K slagged off small farmers who carry on with small returns

I totally reject that it is madness for small farmers to carry on if they are only making a small margin. Also that it is some how selfish to carry on because it stops those with development money from expanding.