Farming REALITY CHECK!

[Bossfarmer]

for all those that claim farmers don't need subs and are living pretty at the expense of the taxpayer(who has a much reduced weekly shopping bill thanks to farm support) heres the facts for you....................................... 20% of farms in Scotland made a loss last year,
27% of farmers made less than the minimum wage,
incomes are expected to drop further by 8% this year,
incomes have been "hammered" the past 4 years the most severe decrease in incomes since the 1990s BSE crisis!

 

[Yale]

It's a difficult one.

Scottish farmers get more livestock and hill payments so just be glad you don't farm in Wales.

 

[Kidds]

If farmers and their subsidies were to go the rest of the rural economy would be devastated. There are a lot of folk out there living off the back of farming.

 

[franklin]

Loss, wage, income. All depend on your accountant. Quite possible to make a "loss", while watching your land double in price; putting £250k a year into machinery; living in a house and driving a car essentially foc.

Although if we were all to refuse to work more than 40 hours a week; stop lone-working; all draw an experienced worker wage etc then it would be interesting to see how that would work. I am resigned to being asset-rich and income-poor for ever.

 

[Bossfarmer]

Loss, wage, income. All depend on your accountant. Quite possible to make a "loss", while watching your land double in price; putting £250k a year into machinery; living in a house and driving a car essentially foc.

Although if we were all to refuse to work more than 40 hours a week; stop lone-working; all draw an experienced worker wage etc then it would be interesting to see how that would work. I am resigned to being asset-rich and income-poor for ever.

my land may have increased in value but I still value it at 0 because its not for sale and hopefully never will be

 

[Agrispeed]

Ok, Devil's advocate -

Maybe 20% of farms in Scotland need to improve? Farms are not special. You are a business and if you consistently lose money you need to ask yourself why, when others are not.

I wonder what the percentage of other small business in the UK have similar figures, I suspect that actually, many more small business wind up due to not being profitable every year.

 

[franklin]

my land may have increased in value but I still value it at 0 because its not for sale and hopefully never will be

But you feel richer, and happier? Horrific financial agony to buy houses and watch them as the go up in value despite needing to actually live in them and only getting that wealth when you sell up / die is the lie this country's economics is based on!

 

[Bossfarmer]

Ok, Devil's advocate -

Maybe 20% of farms in Scotland need to improve? Farms are not special. You are a business and if you consistently lose money you need to ask yourself why, when others are not.

I wonder what the percentage of other small business in the UK have similar figures, I suspect that actually, many more small business wind up due to not being profitable every year.

the point is that's 20% WITH sfp, take it away and that figure could treble, the difference with farming is that prices have been deliberately pushed below cost of production so the consumer can buy cheap food this is fine as farmers were given support to bridge the gap, its unfair to then take this support away and not hike up the farmgate price to match

 

[tje]

the point is that's 20% WITH sfp, take it away and that figure could treble, the difference with farming is that prices have been deliberately pushed below cost of production so the consumer can buy cheap food this is fine as farmers were given support to bridge the gap, its unfair to then take this support away and not hike up the farmgate price to match

Life isn't fair ....

 

[Frodo2]

for all those that claim farmers don't need subs and are living pretty at the expense of the taxpayer(who has a much reduced weekly shopping bill thanks to farm support) heres the facts for you....................................... 20% of farms in Scotland made a loss last year,
27% of farmers made less than the minimum wage,
incomes are expected to drop further by 8% this year,
incomes have been "hammered" the past 4 years the most severe decrease in incomes since the 1990s BSE crisis!

Whats your source?

As others have said it does depend on your methodology. Put an opportunity cost on financing the land value and I doubt if any make a trading profit. On the other hand if you own bare land with no debt, making a loss is a bit embarrassing given the subsidy would be paid for doing nothing.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

If farmers and their subsidies were to go the rest of the rural economy would be devastated. There are a lot of folk out there living off the back of farming.

Farmer is a good distributor of his hard earned cash that's for sure

 

[ewald]

This is not news - for the whole of my farming career I would have been better off selling up, investing the proceeds and working for someone else.
Don't want to though, prefer life with my head in the sand pretending not to hear the prophets of doom.

 

[Still Farming]

Aid is Aid what ever.
If your on sfp farming or social benefits not farming.
Losses are losses and some all will run at a loss as don't want to pay tax.
Or if they do make a profit -what do they do. - Buy a new tractor or truck - then no profit ?
The True picture will never be know.
If money out there -it will be taken -who or what ever Scheme or Schemer !!!

 

[Bossfarmer]

Aid is Aid what ever.
If your on sfp farming or social benefits not farming.
Losses are losses and some all will run at a loss as don't want to pay tax.
Or if they do make a profit -what do they do. - Buy a new tractor or truck - then no profit ?
The True picture will never be know.
If money out there -it will be taken -who or what ever Scheme or Schemer !!!

not true as the profit comparisons show a large drop, presumably the previous years the farmers would be as equally tax efficient so therefore you are getting a clear indication that farm incomes have taken a serious hit for 4 consecutive years!

 

[baabaa]

for all those that claim farmers don't need subs and are living pretty at the expense of the taxpayer(who has a much reduced weekly shopping bill thanks to farm support) heres the facts for you....................................... 20% of farms in Scotland made a loss last year,
27% of farmers made less than the minimum wage,
incomes are expected to drop further by 8% this year,
incomes have been "hammered" the past 4 years the most severe decrease in incomes since the 1990s BSE crisis!

you seem to labour under the assumption that cap payments are set in stone
http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/a-switch-from-grants-to-loans-could-be-the-future-of-cap/#

 

[Agrispeed]

not true as the profit comparisons show a large drop, presumably the previous years the farmers would be as equally tax efficient so therefore you are getting a clear indication that farm incomes have taken a serious hit for 4 consecutive years!

But so have farms in most countries. Why should we have the benefit of better income, or more subsidisation just because we have the pleasure of living here?

If you look at the last 20 years farmgate prices have risen and fallen. The price rises and everyone jumps in, the price falls and people leave.

 

[Still Farming]

not true as the profit comparisons show a large drop, presumably the previous years the farmers would be as equally tax efficient so therefore you are getting a clear indication that farm incomes have taken a serious hit for 4 consecutive years!

They put what they want ???

 

[exmoor dave]

for all those that claim farmers don't need subs and are living pretty at the expense of the taxpayer(who has a much reduced weekly shopping bill thanks to farm support) heres the facts for you....................................... 20% of farms in Scotland made a loss last year,
27% of farmers made less than the minimum wage,
incomes are expected to drop further by 8% this year,
incomes have been "hammered" the past 4 years the most severe decrease in incomes since the 1990s BSE crisis!

So I assume you have &/or will be taking a full and active role in the coming negotiations over support by going along to the NFU (&others) Britix meetings to voice your views and shaping our futures?

No point just voicing it on here

 

[Henarar]

So I assume you have &/or will be taking a full and active role in the coming negotiations over support by going along to the NFU (&others) Britix meetings to voice your views and shaping our futures?

No point just voicing it on here

is there any point in voicing it at an NFU meeting ?

 

[exmoor dave]

is there any point in voicing it at an NFU meeting ?

Where else are you going to voice it?


Like it or not, its the nfu that have the ear of DEFRA (not saying how effective they are mind)


But it's like voting, you either have a say then reserve the right moan at the outcome

Or do nothing &have no right to moan over it.


Just my thoughts