Farming without subsidies

Discussion in 'Agricultural Matters' started by Farmer Fin, Jan 6, 2019.

  1. jendan

    jendan Member

    As a proportion of total UK milk output,how much is produced for them?
     
  2. I have no idea of the answer to that question, nor do I see the relevance, actually?
     
  3. jendan

    jendan Member

    Of course its relevant! Its a small amount thats why.They would not pay it if it was right across the board would they? Thats why we had the bloody Milk Marketing Board! Fair do s for everyone,not just the chosen few!
     
  4. I don't know how much milk Waitrose sell, nor do I care, but if they want to pay people more money for that volume they do retail, and can make money themselves by doing so, that is fantastic in my book. It is not the responsibility of Waitrose or Tesco (or anyone else for that matter) to ensure the continued prosperity of every dairy farm in the UK. All other companies have to paddle their own canoe, t'was ever thus.
     
  5. lazy farmer

    lazy farmer Member

    Location:
    som/dor border
    At least half of the time my milk price is higher than any supermarket contract.
     
  6. Stop racing to the bottom!:rolleyes:
     
  7. lazy farmer

    lazy farmer Member

    Location:
    som/dor border
    It has appeared to me that when ever systems or milk price is mentioned if anybody does things better or cheaper/ more profitability than others they are accused of racing to the bottom. Seemingly regardless of the fact that their COP is not the bases of the milk price. Supply and demand is
     
  8. jendan

    jendan Member

    .........i was young and green once...........Regarding milk supply,"twas ever thus" before 1933 and after 1994.If the MMB was still in existance,every single milk producer in the country would be getting 35p-40p litre,and the f*cking supermarkets would have been forced to pay a fair price for all milk they bought,right across the board.We still have the highest consumption of liquid milk anywhere in the World.We should have the highest price,and would have were it not for the supermarkets selling it as a loss leader.
     
    Cowcorn and glasshouse like this.
  9. unlacedgecko

    unlacedgecko Member

    Location:
    North Lincolnshire
    Socialise the losses and capitalise the profits....

    If every single milk producer was getting 35p per litre how many of them do you think would have a COP of 30p?

    MMB sounds like protectionist rubbish to me.
     
  10. glasshouse

    glasshouse Member

    Location:
    lothians
    nothing wrong with protectionism, the problem is its the supermarkets who are protected currently.
     
    hally and jendan like this.
  11. Cowcorn

    Cowcorn Member

    Location:
    East meath/dublin
    Liquid milk is been used by the Supermarkets as a loss leader over here too, needless to say we have the same supermarkets mostly. The price paid used to be set by the Dublin district milk board and was fair for producer and consumer. The rot set in whem the doorstep deliveries declined and the supermarkets gained thel lions share of the market. You cant really compare seasonal production with liquid production its a totally different game but unless a decent premuim is been paid its a lot of work for nothing. We have been involved in liquid milk since the 1930s but unless margins improve i think as im getting old i will be taking the scenic route to spring calving. I dont know the background to the supermarkets contracts in the UK but the seem to be working for the few but i find it hard to believe the supply all of the milk that the supermarkets sell, probably the cost is been balanced out by cheaper milk been bought elsewhere. Strong farmer owned co ops are the best route to fair milk prices, not pick and fix contracts with supermarkets.
     
  12. We get them in RHD from the US, but $25-30k overpriced, not that I'd ever want to drive one!!!:LOL:
    Camaro's also come in RHD but are remanufactured in Melbourne :rolleyes:
     
    Muck Spreader likes this.
  13. stewart

    stewart Member

    Location:
    Bay of Plenty NZ
    Your memories of the MMB are different to mine, I remember the UK having one of the highest percentages of milk going into liquid, which was a high paying product, while our continental cousins were putting more of their milk into lower paying products, unfortunately this was not reflected in the price the farmer received, UK dairy farmers, even though they should have been receiving one of the highest milk prices in Europe were at the other end of the scale receiving one of the lowest.
    I went to all the talks given by the MMB prior to the setting up of Milk Marque and after listening to the dinasours giving the presentations opted to go direct, the price increase post vesting day was huge, so much so that we didn't send any milk on 31st October 1994 sending twice as much to the dairy 1st November.
    The MMB ran a pooling system for milk which I generally agree with, the way it was run was ridiculous, the CATFI system guarenteed a profit to the processing dairies, which by its very nature promoted inefficiencies, these inefficiencies were also clearly evident through the whole supply chain that the MMB ran.
    You are dreaming if you believe that a present day MMB would see returns of 35-40ppl, how would or could they force supermarkets to pay more? The MMB couldn't obtain the highest price in Europe 25 years ago how would they do so now?
    The system that is operating now doesn't seem to be much better with a dog eat dog environment. Producer co-ops would be the way to go, I have mentioned this several times, co ops just don't seem to work in the UK, despite the fact that they work in Europe and elsewhere, if every dairy farmer invested in a processing co op then the milk price would improve, the potential solution is in the hands of the farmer.
    NZ generally gets discussed when subsidies are mentioned, due to the fact we don't have them, what we do have is a very good coordinated marketing strategy (see Lockwood Smiths presentation put up by Clive) the average NZ dairy farmer would have $500,000 invested in processing through their co ops, if the UK dairy farmer invested a similar amount in processing this would enable them to share in the profits from higher up the supply chain.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  14. stewart

    stewart Member

    Location:
    Bay of Plenty NZ
    It doesn't fall below the accepted safety standards but is at the lower end, having a 5 litre V8 under the bonnet doesn't help (Yes I have a small dick).
    I have no problem with buying an imported product and country of origin does not worry me as long as it is up to the job, which is why my tractor and sprayer are Italian.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
    Farmer Roy likes this.
  15. stewart

    stewart Member

    Location:
    Bay of Plenty NZ
    It should have a standard to be sold or imported, some products just meet the standard some are at the higher end and meet more than the standard.
    When buying something price is not the top consideration, first on the list is does it fit my requirements (no point in having cheap kit if it is not up to the job).

    Interesting you mention leaches, I thought you were referring to the recipients of subsidy.
     
    mwj and Farmer Roy like this.
  16. turbo

    turbo Member

    Location:
    lincs
    What raw Commodities can be imported to your country?
     
  17. stewart

    stewart Member

    Location:
    Bay of Plenty NZ
    Any, why?
     
  18. turbo

    turbo Member

    Location:
    lincs
    Ok I will re phase that,how much is imported and what standards does it have to reach,google is not very clear and it does seem you have restrictions in place.(not that I think it’s a bad idea if you do)
     
  19. stewart

    stewart Member

    Location:
    Bay of Plenty NZ
    We import a high percentage of our manufactured goods machinery etc. and some beef and pork, very little if any raw milk, the shipping costs would be too high and we are a net exporter, some processed dairy products are imported, cheese etc.
    The standards are high, as they should be.
     
  20. turbo

    turbo Member

    Location:
    lincs
    Thanks for that.On the standards I agree but how does that fit with free trade after all milk is milk and wheat is wheat according to some on here
     

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